Crusaders v Blues
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@KiwiMurph said in Crusaders v Blues:
@shark said in Crusaders v Blues:
What do the Blues do now at 10, both for the rest of this season and beyond? Plummer has been really, really average. Seems to do two things poorly for every thing he does well. Black simply isn't coming on as he should have. Neither of these jokers are going to reach their potential at the Blues as they are now and have been for many moons. They really either need a generational talent who doesn't have to rely on others to succeed, or to sign BB or Richie, which isn't going to happen.
What?
Plummer is 20 and a rookie. He's already lead the Blues to an NZ derby win. Something they hadn't done the previous 2 seasons.
Writing him off now is frankly ridiculous. Josh Ioane didn't exactly light it up for the Highlanders in his first action. Let him develop.
The bigger issue to me is 9. Nock seemed to be showing some real promise but got injured. Pulu is probably gone after this year. Ruru is a decent squad option but doesn't feel like a starting quality 9.
Plummer is fine.
I don't think he will ever be a frontline All Black (looks to lack a little bit of top end pace to me), but he's way better than Otere Black.
Pretty tough for any 10 to come down here against a fired up Crusaders forward pack and a pumped up crowd and perform on such a cold night. Just ask Beauden Barrett
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@Kirwan said in Crusaders v Blues:
Writing off a 20 year old in his first season, who is showing improvement, is hilarious.
Flushing a 21 year old in his first season was standard procedure and sound judgement I thought?
I would persevere with Plummer and perservere isn't even the right word for it becuase he is a young first-five who needs to take his lumps. Crusader fans are glad the early footage of Super Rugby was lost for a reason - unless you get to pilot a juggernaut you have to learn your lessons.
Give him a chance to come back next year and see what happens.
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The ultimate kiss of death known to mankind is @rotated posting about a Blues 1st 5.
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@SammyC said in Crusaders v Blues:
@KiwiMurph said in Crusaders v Blues:
@shark said in Crusaders v Blues:
What do the Blues do now at 10, both for the rest of this season and beyond? Plummer has been really, really average. Seems to do two things poorly for every thing he does well. Black simply isn't coming on as he should have. Neither of these jokers are going to reach their potential at the Blues as they are now and have been for many moons. They really either need a generational talent who doesn't have to rely on others to succeed, or to sign BB or Richie, which isn't going to happen.
What?
Plummer is 20 and a rookie. He's already lead the Blues to an NZ derby win. Something they hadn't done the previous 2 seasons.
Writing him off now is frankly ridiculous. Josh Ioane didn't exactly light it up for the Highlanders in his first action. Let him develop.
The bigger issue to me is 9. Nock seemed to be showing some real promise but got injured. Pulu is probably gone after this year. Ruru is a decent squad option but doesn't feel like a starting quality 9.
Plummer is fine.
I don't think he will ever be a frontline All Black (looks to lack a little bit of top end pace to me), but he's way better than Otere Black.
Pretty tough for any 10 to come down here against a fired up Crusaders forward pack and a pumped up crowd and perform on such a cold night. Just ask Beauden Barrett
Not saying you are wrong ( because its way too early anyway ) but I do remember on here a couple of years ago , it being said by quite a few , Richie Mounga was too slow to be an AB , after a game( cant remember which one ) where he was beaten for pace in a play or two ,
I think sometimes you can be made to look quicker , or slower, by your timing
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@kiwiinmelb I've always found that a weird comment, based on one game - the Crusaders v B&I Lions game, in which it seemed RM was out-run by a forward. A game in which, as he said later, he was just overawed by the occasion. I don't think he was running full speed at the time; he just hesitated or didn't trust himself.
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@kiwiinmelb said in Crusaders v Blues:
@SammyC said in Crusaders v Blues:
@KiwiMurph said in Crusaders v Blues:
@shark said in Crusaders v Blues:
What do the Blues do now at 10, both for the rest of this season and beyond? Plummer has been really, really average. Seems to do two things poorly for every thing he does well. Black simply isn't coming on as he should have. Neither of these jokers are going to reach their potential at the Blues as they are now and have been for many moons. They really either need a generational talent who doesn't have to rely on others to succeed, or to sign BB or Richie, which isn't going to happen.
What?
Plummer is 20 and a rookie. He's already lead the Blues to an NZ derby win. Something they hadn't done the previous 2 seasons.
Writing him off now is frankly ridiculous. Josh Ioane didn't exactly light it up for the Highlanders in his first action. Let him develop.
The bigger issue to me is 9. Nock seemed to be showing some real promise but got injured. Pulu is probably gone after this year. Ruru is a decent squad option but doesn't feel like a starting quality 9.
Plummer is fine.
I don't think he will ever be a frontline All Black (looks to lack a little bit of top end pace to me), but he's way better than Otere Black.
Pretty tough for any 10 to come down here against a fired up Crusaders forward pack and a pumped up crowd and perform on such a cold night. Just ask Beauden Barrett
Not saying you are wrong ( because its way too early anyway ) but I do remember on here a couple of years ago , it being said by quite a few , Richie Mounga was too slow to be an AB , after a game( cant remember which one ) where he was beaten for pace in a play or two ,
I think sometimes you can be made to look quicker , or slower, by your timing
Fair enough, I havent watched as much of Plummer as a lot of people on here, and am happy to be proved wrong.
Although anyone saying Richie was slow is obviously an idiot
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Ive got no idea how far Plummer will go either , but I think sometimes we go a bit early writing young players off when they are nowhere near their full possible potential yet ,
Ardie for example , looks like one of those about to prove a lot of us wrong .
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@kiwiinmelb Plummer reminds me a little of Andre Pollard,a very big first five who when he decides to run because of his size takes some stopping..i was quite impressed with him in the Canes game when he decided to run , especially with the rush defence the visitors were using..he actually got in behind the defence which have momentum leading up to both the tries the Blues scored in the first half..
If he can iron out the little errors I am hoping the Blues persists him..Black on the other hand I would let go,I would build my pivotal options around Plummer & Perofeta .. -
@KiwiMurph I wouldn't take what he says too seriously. He moaned and sulked for months on end after the Mitre 10 Cup last year lol and is probably still sulking about it despite his team being by far the best in Super Rugby.
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@kiwiinmelb said in Crusaders v Blues:
Not saying you are wrong ( because its way too early anyway ) but I do remember on here a couple of years ago , it being said by quite a few , Richie Mounga was too slow to be an AB , after a game( cant remember which one ) where he was beaten for pace in a play or two ,
I think sometimes you can be made to look quicker , or slower, by your timing
He's about a year younger than Mo'unga was when he made his debut. He's 3 years younger than Josh Ioane who's basically a rookie
Ideally Plummer would've had more time at NPC level learning lessons before being the starter in an SR side. We don't have that luxury, but he is still better than Black.
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The first year of Super Rugby is often pretty rough for a young 10. Probably even harder when you've only had one NPC season under your belt. I don't think Plummer was meant to play much this year, but with Perofeta out and Otere not doing very well, he's been pushed into a starting role already.
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@kiwiinmelb I told you Ardie was going to be the man.
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I'm hoping that Perofeta is the starting fullback next year. Thats where he has played his best rugby for Taranaki. Judging by the pre-season matches I think MacDonald was intending to use him there too
If you look at the fullbacks for the other sides - DMac, Jordie, Havili/Jordan, Smith - they all come into first receiver and are kicking options.
Nanai has had a great year but he does not play that role.It's particularly bad when aerial ping pong breaks out. Plummer is the only one who will kick for position. It's too easy for the opposition to see what is coming
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@Duluth said in Crusaders v Blues:
I'm hoping that Perofeta is the starting fullback next year. Thats where he has played his best rugby for Taranaki. Judging by the pre-season matches I think MacDonald was intending to use him there too
If you look at the fullbacks for the other sides - DMac, Jordie, Havili/Jordan, Smith - they all come into first receiver and are kicking options.
Nanai has had a great year but he does not play that role.It's particularly bad when aerial ping pong breaks out. Plummer is the only one who will kick for position. It's too easy for the opposition to see what is coming
And Nanai's best form was on the wing, having go to fullback has blunted his attacking game. Shame Trainor was injured too.
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@African-Monkey said in Crusaders v Blues:
@KiwiMurph I wouldn't take what he says too seriously. He moaned and sulked for months on end after the Mitre 10 Cup last year lol and is probably still sulking about it despite his team being by far the best in Super Rugby.
Justifiably so, when he knows his team only even made the final through the shady dealings of Hansen and the Canterbury mafia getting Joe Moody released to play in the semi.
Look at those other Canterbury props getting stuffed! It's an outrage!
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@African-Monkey said in Crusaders v Blues:
@KiwiMurph I wouldn't take what he says too seriously. He moaned and sulked for months on end after the Mitre 10 Cup last year lol and is probably still sulking about it despite his team being by far the best in Super Rugby.
I’m still sulking about that too
when you’re used to winning, losing hurts! -
@SammyC said in Crusaders v Blues:
@African-Monkey said in Crusaders v Blues:
@KiwiMurph I wouldn't take what he says too seriously. He moaned and sulked for months on end after the Mitre 10 Cup last year lol and is probably still sulking about it despite his team being by far the best in Super Rugby.
I’m still sulking about that too
when you’re used to winning, losing hurts!What game are you talking about it? Don’t recall anything like that ever occurring.
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@Kirwan said in Crusaders v Blues:
@Duluth said in Crusaders v Blues:
I'm hoping that Perofeta is the starting fullback next year. Thats where he has played his best rugby for Taranaki. Judging by the pre-season matches I think MacDonald was intending to use him there too
If you look at the fullbacks for the other sides - DMac, Jordie, Havili/Jordan, Smith - they all come into first receiver and are kicking options.
Nanai has had a great year but he does not play that role.It's particularly bad when aerial ping pong breaks out. Plummer is the only one who will kick for position. It's too easy for the opposition to see what is coming
And Nanai's best form was on the wing, having go to fullback has blunted his attacking game. Shame Trainor was injured too.
Agree Nanai is a far better winger and he uses the sideline with his in and out swerve very well.
Overall though I think he had been very good this season and despite a few brain fades, his game has matured as a result of being at that back.
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Watching this I think we can all agree Nanai should have been carded:
For that matter so should Moody for a blatant neck roll.
