Highlanders v Hurricanes - now at 3:05pm
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@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
@antipodean said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
I think that's the rule isn't it? BB used to take lessons from Mehrts, then he actually realised he was a decent size and then improved in that area.
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@Bovidae said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Mehrts used to avoid tackles while the current 1st 5s resemble doormats.
I didn't say Mehrts was a good coach.
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Highlanders v Hurricanes: Saturday 15 August, 7:05pm, Forsyth Barr Stadium, Dunedin
Referee: Brendon Pickerill
Assistant Referee 1: Mike Fraser
Assistant Referee 2: James Doleman
TMO: Chris Hart
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@antipodean said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
Hadn't noticed that about him - is he high up in the missed stats then?
@Bones said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@antipodean said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
Hadn't noticed that about him - is he high up in the missed stats then?
Mo'unga being a bad tackler is a myth; and he's not playing behind a Rolls Roys pack anymore, either. Here are some stats (based on ESPN stats):
Tackles made Missed tackles Tackle success rate x rounds of SRA starting at: Black 22 3 88% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 22 Mo'unga 48 9 84.2% 7 games starting at 10 Jordan 15 3 83.3% 5 games starting at 15, 1 at 14 and 1 at 23 M Hunt 35 10 77.8% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 15 J Ioane 10 3 76.9% 2 games starting at 10, 1 at 22 B Barrett 24 9 72.7% 5 games starting at 15, 2 at 10 Cruden 38 15 71.7% 4 games starting at 10, 3 at 22 J Barrett 12 6 66.7% 5 games starting at 15 McKenzie 20 11 64.5% 8 games starting at 15 -
@Bones said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@antipodean said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
Hadn't noticed that about him - is he high up in the missed stats then?
Mo'unga being a bad tackler is a myth; and he's not playing behind a Rolls Roys pack anymore, either. Here are some stats (based on ESPN stats):
Tackles made Missed tackles Tackle success rate x rounds of SRA starting at: Black 22 3 88% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 22 Mo'unga 48 9 84.2% 7 games starting at 10 Jordan 15 3 83.3% 5 games starting at 15, 1 at 14 and 1 at 23 M Hunt 35 10 77.8% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 15 J Ioane 10 3 76.9% 2 games starting at 10, 1 at 22 B Barrett 24 9 72.7% 5 games starting at 15, 2 at 10 Cruden 38 15 71.7% 4 games starting at 10, 3 at 22 J Barrett 12 6 66.7% 5 games starting at 15 McKenzie 20 11 64.5% 8 games starting at 15 Nice post.
Jordan has done a better job on defense than it sometimes looks.
One thing he really needs to work on are turnovers. From my reading of the same stats, he conceded 12 turnovers!
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@Bones said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@antipodean said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
Hadn't noticed that about him - is he high up in the missed stats then?
Mo'unga being a bad tackler is a myth; and he's not playing behind a Rolls Roys pack anymore, either. Here are some stats (based on ESPN stats):
Tackles made Missed tackles Tackle success rate x rounds of SRA starting at: Black 22 3 88% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 22 Mo'unga 48 9 84.2% 7 games starting at 10 Jordan 15 3 83.3% 5 games starting at 15, 1 at 14 and 1 at 23 M Hunt 35 10 77.8% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 15 J Ioane 10 3 76.9% 2 games starting at 10, 1 at 22 B Barrett 24 9 72.7% 5 games starting at 15, 2 at 10 Cruden 38 15 71.7% 4 games starting at 10, 3 at 22 J Barrett 12 6 66.7% 5 games starting at 15 McKenzie 20 11 64.5% 8 games starting at 15 @Stargazer said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@Bones said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@antipodean said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
Hadn't noticed that about him - is he high up in the missed stats then?
Mo'unga being a bad tackler is a myth; and he's not playing behind a Rolls Roys pack anymore, either. Here are some stats (based on ESPN stats):
Tackles made Missed tackles Tackle success rate x rounds of SRA starting at: Black 22 3 88% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 22 Mo'unga 48 9 84.2% 7 games starting at 10 Jordan 15 3 83.3% 5 games starting at 15, 1 at 14 and 1 at 23 M Hunt 35 10 77.8% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 15 J Ioane 10 3 76.9% 2 games starting at 10, 1 at 22 B Barrett 24 9 72.7% 5 games starting at 15, 2 at 10 Cruden 38 15 71.7% 4 games starting at 10, 3 at 22 J Barrett 12 6 66.7% 5 games starting at 15 McKenzie 20 11 64.5% 8 games starting at 15 I'd be wary of quoting statistics without context (and we all know the Professor's thought about them).
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@Stargazer said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@Bones said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@antipodean said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
@sparky said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
Josh Ioane's passing and kicking make him the 3rd best AB 10 IMHO.
He and Mounga have been taking defence lessons from Mehrtens.
Hadn't noticed that about him - is he high up in the missed stats then?
Mo'unga being a bad tackler is a myth; and he's not playing behind a Rolls Roys pack anymore, either. Here are some stats (based on ESPN stats):
Tackles made Missed tackles Tackle success rate x rounds of SRA starting at: Black 22 3 88% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 22 Mo'unga 48 9 84.2% 7 games starting at 10 Jordan 15 3 83.3% 5 games starting at 15, 1 at 14 and 1 at 23 M Hunt 35 10 77.8% 5 games starting at 10, 2 at 15 J Ioane 10 3 76.9% 2 games starting at 10, 1 at 22 B Barrett 24 9 72.7% 5 games starting at 15, 2 at 10 Cruden 38 15 71.7% 4 games starting at 10, 3 at 22 J Barrett 12 6 66.7% 5 games starting at 15 McKenzie 20 11 64.5% 8 games starting at 15 I'd be wary of quoting statistics without context (and we all know the Professor's thought about them).
@antipodean Yeah, I agree with that, but these stats show that people making general claims about some players being bad tacklers are just plain wrong.
By the way, using stats - to make general claims - to talk up players should be treated with the same amount of reservation as using stats to say that certain players are not good/not good enough/average/bad.
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tackling stats are meaningless when it comes to effective defense.
when watching a game, a poor read on defence, and not close enough to attempt a tackle doesnt get counted as a miss.
Also do they count tackle assists or when more than 1 person was part of a tackle?
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when watching a game, a poor read on defence, and not close enough to attempt a tackle doesnt get counted as a miss.
Also do they count tackle assists or when more than 1 person was part of a tackle?
@taniwharugby said in Highlanders v Hurricanes:
when watching a game, a poor read on defence, and not close enough to attempt a tackle doesnt get counted as a miss.
Also do they count tackle assists or when more than 1 person was part of a tackle?
ah yes, the Nathan Hindmarsh "40 tackles" stat. 15 tackles and 25 flops
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when watching a game, a poor read on defence, and not close enough to attempt a tackle doesnt get counted as a miss.
Also do they count tackle assists or when more than 1 person was part of a tackle?
@taniwharugby thats probably more of an issue for outside backs though isn't it? getting caught out of position
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If a 1st 5 is defending in their channel the opposing player will be running at you so a missed tackle usually means you've been sat on your arse, or slipped off a tackle. A fullback has much more space to defend in comparison so it's not surprising their success % will be lower.
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@taniwharugby thats probably more of an issue for outside backs though isn't it? getting caught out of position
@Kiwiwomble many on that list are outside backs or sometimes drop back to defend back as well.
BUt as @Bovidae says, often if a 10 misses, he is usually speed bumped, but by the same token, if a 10 holds on by the foot and the 7 finishes, the 10 still gets a 'tackle'
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