Highlanders v Force
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Yeah, I agree with all that, but I don't agree that Kahui was completely upright and didn't make an effort to adjust his height. He did, just not enough I guess. Problem of bigger player vs small player.
To me, a head clash like this is a different category to that where players go into a tackle shoulder first and then hit their opponent in the face (Laulala, Klein, for example), but the punishment is the same.
Anyway, I hope Mitch Hunt is alright. That's the most important thing after incidents like these.
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Yeah, I agree with all that, but I don't agree that Kahui was completely upright and didn't make an effort to adjust his height. He did, just not enough I guess. Problem of bigger player vs small player.
To me, a head clash like this is a different category to that where players go into a tackle shoulder first and then hit their opponent in the face (Laulala, Klein, for example), but the punishment is the same.
Anyway, I hope Mitch Hunt is alright. That's the most important thing after incidents like these.
@Stargazer said in Highlanders v Force:
but I don't agree that Kahui was completely upright and didn't make an effort to adjust his height. He did, just not enough I guess.
yeah his front leg was bent 90 deg at contact, and looked to be on the ground, Hunt wasnt at full height either.
Not great, but red card worthy, not so sure, def YC...again, broken record, for me, we need to find a better way to deal with these accidental contacts; between coaches, players, administrators and refs.
For me, the red stays for grub acts (and 20 mins) that one, maybe an orange card, so player is gone, but the team is only down for 10 mins like a YC.
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@Stargazer said in Highlanders v Force:
but I don't agree that Kahui was completely upright and didn't make an effort to adjust his height. He did, just not enough I guess.
yeah his front leg was bent 90 deg at contact, and looked to be on the ground, Hunt wasnt at full height either.
Not great, but red card worthy, not so sure, def YC...again, broken record, for me, we need to find a better way to deal with these accidental contacts; between coaches, players, administrators and refs.
For me, the red stays for grub acts (and 20 mins) that one, maybe an orange card, so player is gone, but the team is only down for 10 mins like a YC.
@taniwharugby said in Highlanders v Force:
grub acts
It's a fine line though eh. It's a pretty grub act to knock another player out just because you were too careless/reckles and wanted to lay on a big, high hit.
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@taniwharugby said in Highlanders v Force:
grub acts
It's a fine line though eh. It's a pretty grub act to knock another player out just because you were too careless/reckles and wanted to lay on a big, high hit.
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@Bones i think you know the difference, pretty clear line to me between that and a grub act.
@taniwharugby said in Highlanders v Force:
@Bones i think you know the difference, pretty clear line to me between that and a grub act.
So that's not a grub act to you?
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damn...i know i shouldn't have read this thread
I enjoyed that, yeah there were questionable calls...but there always have been, we just didnt use to have snippets of them posted on social media
and the questionable calls didn't take take away some of the best actual rugby by the highlanders this season, i loved seeing us try and counter ruck, we want the fucking pill...something that hasn;t been coming through in games before now
the semantics of Gilbert playing 10 but not first five are a little bizarre to me, not all players play the same way and i dont see the same comments, he still decided when to pass and kick, he carried well and offloaded...and quite frankly, when you have Smith firing, why not let him decided things.....maybe thats an answer to the rush defense, dont make the a guy under pressure make the big calls
we weren't perfect but there was actually something we could build off, fast fast slow, tight tight wide, get points early. I think where we looked lost was because we were surprised it was working, that team is going to be fizzing come training and may have un done some of the damage done earlier in the season
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damn...i know i shouldn't have read this thread
I enjoyed that, yeah there were questionable calls...but there always have been, we just didnt use to have snippets of them posted on social media
and the questionable calls didn't take take away some of the best actual rugby by the highlanders this season, i loved seeing us try and counter ruck, we want the fucking pill...something that hasn;t been coming through in games before now
the semantics of Gilbert playing 10 but not first five are a little bizarre to me, not all players play the same way and i dont see the same comments, he still decided when to pass and kick, he carried well and offloaded...and quite frankly, when you have Smith firing, why not let him decided things.....maybe thats an answer to the rush defense, dont make the a guy under pressure make the big calls
we weren't perfect but there was actually something we could build off, fast fast slow, tight tight wide, get points early. I think where we looked lost was because we were surprised it was working, that team is going to be fizzing come training and may have un done some of the damage done earlier in the season
@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
the semantics of Gilbert playing 10 but not first five are a little bizarre to me, not all players play the same way and i dont see the same comments, he still decided when to pass and kick, he carried well and offloaded...
Did he make the decisions on when to kick and pass? I honestly do not remember him being the traditional first receiver during the game. I was very interested in his move to 10 so was watching him closely. Happy to be proven wrong.
I am beginning to think the comments about Gilbert not playing like a regular first five have been taken as a criticism by some. They weren't meant that way at all. It was an observation on the style he was playing. It worked for the Highlanders. It will be interesting to see if it is used again against the better teams and if so, how it goes.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
the semantics of Gilbert playing 10 but not first five are a little bizarre to me, not all players play the same way and i dont see the same comments, he still decided when to pass and kick, he carried well and offloaded...
Did he make the decisions on when to kick and pass? I honestly do not remember him being the traditional first receiver during the game. I was very interested in his move to 10 so was watching him closely. Happy to be proven wrong.
I am beginning to think the comments about Gilbert not playing like a regular first five have been taken as a criticism by some. They weren't meant that way at all. It was an observation on the style he was playing. It worked for the Highlanders. It will be interesting to see if it is used again against the better teams and if so, how it goes.
@Crazy-Horse fair enough and i will admit i was never a 10, i just mean i dont think Smith was doing more than he normally does, hes always making plays from the back...and Gilbert is standing at 10 and i saw him run, kick and pass during the game...and didn;t seem to be asking smith what to do, so the difference between 10 and first five much be really nuanced
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@Crazy-Horse fair enough and i will admit i was never a 10, i just mean i dont think Smith was doing more than he normally does, hes always making plays from the back...and Gilbert is standing at 10 and i saw him run, kick and pass during the game...and didn;t seem to be asking smith what to do, so the difference between 10 and first five much be really nuanced
@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
@Crazy-Horse fair enough and i will admit i was never a 10, i just mean i dont think Smith was doing more than he normally does, hes always making plays from the back...and Gilbert is standing at 10 and i saw him run, kick and pass during the game...and didn;t seem to be asking smith what to do, so the difference between 10 and first five much be really nuanced
Yeah it's a load of bollocks, hence why I posted a picture of one of the best first fives in the world as a reply - although apparently he doesn't play first five so fucked if I know.
Carter probably didn't play first five either because he was often second receiver after first phase.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
@Crazy-Horse fair enough and i will admit i was never a 10, i just mean i dont think Smith was doing more than he normally does, hes always making plays from the back...and Gilbert is standing at 10 and i saw him run, kick and pass during the game...and didn;t seem to be asking smith what to do, so the difference between 10 and first five much be really nuanced
Yeah it's a load of bollocks, hence why I posted a picture of one of the best first fives in the world as a reply - although apparently he doesn't play first five so fucked if I know.
Carter probably didn't play first five either because he was often second receiver after first phase.
@Bones said in Highlanders v Force:
@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
@Crazy-Horse fair enough and i will admit i was never a 10, i just mean i dont think Smith was doing more than he normally does, hes always making plays from the back...and Gilbert is standing at 10 and i saw him run, kick and pass during the game...and didn;t seem to be asking smith what to do, so the difference between 10 and first five much be really nuanced
Yeah it's a load of bollocks, hence why I posted a picture of one of the best first fives in the world as a reply - although apparently he doesn't play first five so fucked if I know.
Carter probably didn't play first five either because he was often second receiver after first phase.
He didn't play like we normally see our first fives play. If you don't get that, fine, there is plenty of shit I don't understand.
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@Bones said in Highlanders v Force:
@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
@Crazy-Horse fair enough and i will admit i was never a 10, i just mean i dont think Smith was doing more than he normally does, hes always making plays from the back...and Gilbert is standing at 10 and i saw him run, kick and pass during the game...and didn;t seem to be asking smith what to do, so the difference between 10 and first five much be really nuanced
Yeah it's a load of bollocks, hence why I posted a picture of one of the best first fives in the world as a reply - although apparently he doesn't play first five so fucked if I know.
Carter probably didn't play first five either because he was often second receiver after first phase.
He didn't play like we normally see our first fives play. If you don't get that, fine, there is plenty of shit I don't understand.
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even if we conceded the "fact" he didn't play like our 1st 5's normally do...that suggests BB, Richie, DC and Mertz all played the same way....because i dont remember people saying any of them didnt play like a first five....but they weren't all the same type of player...so its just weird we can say different first fives have different styles...except him...he's different...but in a different way....its just a bit weird to me
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@Crazy-Horse I understand what you're trying to say, I don't understand why you think that.
@Bones said in Highlanders v Force:
@Crazy-Horse I understand what you're trying to say, I don't understand why you think that.
I know you don't understand why I think that.
But I think it was interesting. First Five has been a position whose the role has not changed as much as other backline positions over the years. Half Back probably the other one. We have tended to use first fives as the go to guy, the one who is there there to facilitate for others, to put them in space or guide the team around. Gilbert did not play that role. I noticed they often used CGB and TUJ. Then Hunt came on and they used him a bit. A someone said at the time it went to shit then.
Crusaders did it to a lessor degree when Havilli was at 10.
The sideline commentator (Tanana?) tried to say something along these lines but Marshall talked over him so he gave up.
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even if we conceded the "fact" he didn't play like our 1st 5's normally do...that suggests BB, Richie, DC and Mertz all played the same way....because i dont remember people saying any of them didnt play like a first five....but they weren't all the same type of player...so its just weird we can say different first fives have different styles...except him...he's different...but in a different way....its just a bit weird to me
@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
even if we conceded the "fact" he didn't play like our 1st 5's normally do...that suggests BB, Richie, DC and Mertz all played the same way....because i dont remember people saying any of them didnt play like a first five....but they weren't all the same type of player...so its just weird we can say different first fives have different styles...except him...he's different...but in a different way....its just a bit weird to me
Yeah 9 to 10 who then decides the play happens most times, if it's not a crash up of some sort (normally dictated by the tens call), but 9 was making the calls, Gilbert was more often 2nd receiver. Pretty non standard style. yes all 10s do it, but not as much as he did it that match.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Highlanders v Force:
even if we conceded the "fact" he didn't play like our 1st 5's normally do...that suggests BB, Richie, DC and Mertz all played the same way....because i dont remember people saying any of them didnt play like a first five....but they weren't all the same type of player...so its just weird we can say different first fives have different styles...except him...he's different...but in a different way....its just a bit weird to me
Yeah 9 to 10 who then decides the play happens most times, if it's not a crash up of some sort (normally dictated by the tens call), but 9 was making the calls, Gilbert was more often 2nd receiver. Pretty non standard style. yes all 10s do it, but not as much as he did it that match.
@Machpants thanks for explaining a bit more than "he's not a normal 1st 5"
that makes sense, my feeling was he was running a lot but trying to feed and distribute, not just going to ground like a crash ball, so to a dumb front rower it just looks like another form of play making, just the opposite end of the scale to a first 5 whole kicks everything away
