Brumbies vs Blues
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@Rocky-Rockbottom Money in the bank for me then. Bring it on.
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Well, crap.
Brumbies game plan so simple - milk penalties, score tries against our shithouse maul defence.
In general, I think our general play defence has been solid this year. It's taken a bit to break down, and we've scrambled really well. We just have no answers to rolling mauls, and can't set one to save our life. Really don' tknow why - but it's been bloody years.
Anyway, some positives - we did enough to win (missed kicks), even with 14 players for 20 minutes. When we kept the ball in hand we looked good. I particularly like (@African-Monkey ) the direct running we do from time to time. When we do it, hard running onto the ball, it just opens up space outside. Three phases just after one of the tries and we made 40 m.
Ma'a seems to be getting better and better. His gas is probably still not there, but I'm wavering on him as a fringe squaddies for the RWC. He's no ALB at this stage, but still playing really really well.
Otere had a shocker. Can see why he got yanked ... but now we still don't know who our number 1 ten is. Sound familiar?
Scrum was a real concern. Seeing KT getting manhandled was unusual. Really not sure why - think loosies had a lot to do with it. Scrum's been weird - dominant against Chiefs and Landers (except for one PT vs landers), but absolutely smoked last night.
Ah well, that was one of the critical games to win and we dropped our bundle. Baby steps, and we go backwards after a few going forward. I'm still happier to go and support these lads - they may play dumb rugby from time to time, but by crikey no shortage of effort for teh 80. That's going to pay off at some stage (optimstic, I know)
@nzzp said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Scrum was a real concern. Seeing KT getting manhandled was unusual. Really not sure why - think loosies had a lot to do with it. Scrum's been weird - dominant against Chiefs and Landers (except for one PT vs landers), but absolutely smoked last night.
The Bumbies don't have a bad scrum. They've got two class props and their forward pack like to do the hard, grafting work. You can be assured they're all pushing.
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@nzzp just watched last nights game, that’s an hour that I will never get back..about 10 minutes in reset scrums, thank god for my sky..
Agree with much of your coms..
I have always thought Otere Black is no more than a journeyman first five, even as up and down as Ihaia West could be, at least he had X factor..
Black came north with a reputation as a consistent goal kicker, but he’s not even showing me that he will win games consistently with his kicking, and the 2 offside penalties were unforgivable, basically piggy backed the Brumbies up the field to in a position to where they were able to sustain a long period of pressure and repeated infringements by the Blues.
I just wonder if they would be better off sticking with Plummer to see if the young guy can cut the mustard..give the young pairing of Nock and Plummer an opportunity as a combo..
Look at what the Highlanders have done with Josh Ioane admittedly the injury to Banks has helped, but to be fair Ioane has taken his opportunities and kept Gatland well and truly out of the frame..he’s got real X factor and more importantly..pace and having seen him knock over clutch kicks in short lived career..temperament..!A couple of other things, just making good practical decisions appears to be foreign practice to this group wether it’s in and around exit strategies ,defending multiple phases without conceding penalties..
The message does not seem to get through and unfortunately it’s like something out of repetitive dream..
It’s case 2 steps forward and about 4 back..@Steven-Harris said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Black came north with a reputation as a consistent goal kicker, but he’s not even showing me that he will win games consistently with his kicking, and the 2 offside penalties were unforgivable, basically piggy backed the Brumbies up the field to in a position to where they were able to sustain a long period of pressure and repeated infringements by the Blues.
Yes, it was that period of play that put the Blues under tremendous pressure and contributed in a massive way the attitude of the referee who only had eyes for the defending team.
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Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
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Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
@SammyC said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
I wonder what his numbers are, because he doesn't look fit.
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@nzzp just watched last nights game, that’s an hour that I will never get back..about 10 minutes in reset scrums, thank god for my sky..
Agree with much of your coms..
I have always thought Otere Black is no more than a journeyman first five, even as up and down as Ihaia West could be, at least he had X factor..
Black came north with a reputation as a consistent goal kicker, but he’s not even showing me that he will win games consistently with his kicking, and the 2 offside penalties were unforgivable, basically piggy backed the Brumbies up the field to in a position to where they were able to sustain a long period of pressure and repeated infringements by the Blues.
I just wonder if they would be better off sticking with Plummer to see if the young guy can cut the mustard..give the young pairing of Nock and Plummer an opportunity as a combo..
Look at what the Highlanders have done with Josh Ioane admittedly the injury to Banks has helped, but to be fair Ioane has taken his opportunities and kept Gatland well and truly out of the frame..he’s got real X factor and more importantly..pace and having seen him knock over clutch kicks in short lived career..temperament..!A couple of other things, just making good practical decisions appears to be foreign practice to this group wether it’s in and around exit strategies ,defending multiple phases without conceding penalties..
The message does not seem to get through and unfortunately it’s like something out of repetitive dream..
It’s case 2 steps forward and about 4 back..@Steven-Harris said in Brumbies vs Blues:
I just wonder if they would be better off sticking with Plummer to see if the young guy can cut the mustard..give the young pairing of Nock and Plummer an opportunity as a combo..
Look at what the Highlanders have done with Josh Ioane admittedly the injury to Banks has helped, but to be fair Ioane has taken his opportunities and kept Gatland well and truly out of the frame..he’s got real X factor and more importantly..pace and having seen him knock over clutch kicks in short lived career..temperament..!I would start Plummer but it's worth noting how early in his career it is. He's the only 20yr old flyhalf in the NZ SR squads.
For instance, some other youngish 10's are a few years older - Ioane is 23, Cameron is 22.I fully expect some silly errors with a 10 that green. His kicking from hand lacks distance and his placement isn't consistent enough yet.
However he is a much better passer, plays flatter, takes the ball to the line and is considerably better defender than Black. If his goal kicking is back where it was 12months ago he'll be an upgrade.I suspect if he does start it will be with his provincial halfback
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Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
@SammyC Agree. Where was Akira? He protects rucks but rarely takes up the ball. Needs to be bench for a week until he decides he wants to play. Not even close to being an AB. Seems like he is going backwards
When the Blues are playing it in the forwards they are pretty good.
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@Steven-Harris said in Brumbies vs Blues:
I just wonder if they would be better off sticking with Plummer to see if the young guy can cut the mustard..give the young pairing of Nock and Plummer an opportunity as a combo..
Look at what the Highlanders have done with Josh Ioane admittedly the injury to Banks has helped, but to be fair Ioane has taken his opportunities and kept Gatland well and truly out of the frame..he’s got real X factor and more importantly..pace and having seen him knock over clutch kicks in short lived career..temperament..!I would start Plummer but it's worth noting how early in his career it is. He's the only 20yr old flyhalf in the NZ SR squads.
For instance, some other youngish 10's are a few years older - Ioane is 23, Cameron is 22.I fully expect some silly errors with a 10 that green. His kicking from hand lacks distance and his placement isn't consistent enough yet.
However he is a much better passer, plays flatter, takes the ball to the line and is considerably better defender than Black. If his goal kicking is back where it was 12months ago he'll be an upgrade.I suspect if he does start it will be with his provincial halfback
@Duluth said in Brumbies vs Blues:
I would start Plummer but it's worth noting how early in his career it is. He's the only 20 year old flyhalf in any of the NZ SR squads.
For instance, some other youngish 10's are a few years older - Ioane is 23, Cameron is 22.I fully expect some silly errors with a 10 that green. His kicking from hand lacks distance and his placement isn't consistent enough yet.
However he is a much better passer, plays flatter, takes the ball to the line and is considerably better defender than Black. If his goal kicking is back where it was 12months ago he'll be an upgrade.I suspect if he does start it will be with his provincial halfback
100% on board with Plummer.
20 isn't young. He will be 21 in June and Cruden, Mehrtens, Spencer, Carter and Barrett all won their first test caps at 21. Slade was 22. Obviously the game evolves but it's hardly insane to hand the reigns of a Super Franchise to a kid of that age. Mistakes will be made but if he is worth persevering with you will see flashes of brilliance early.
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@Duluth said in Brumbies vs Blues:
I would start Plummer but it's worth noting how early in his career it is. He's the only 20 year old flyhalf in any of the NZ SR squads.
For instance, some other youngish 10's are a few years older - Ioane is 23, Cameron is 22.I fully expect some silly errors with a 10 that green. His kicking from hand lacks distance and his placement isn't consistent enough yet.
However he is a much better passer, plays flatter, takes the ball to the line and is considerably better defender than Black. If his goal kicking is back where it was 12months ago he'll be an upgrade.I suspect if he does start it will be with his provincial halfback
100% on board with Plummer.
20 isn't young. He will be 21 in June and Cruden, Mehrtens, Spencer, Carter and Barrett all won their first test caps at 21. Slade was 22. Obviously the game evolves but it's hardly insane to hand the reigns of a Super Franchise to a kid of that age. Mistakes will be made but if he is worth persevering with you will see flashes of brilliance early.
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Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
@SammyC said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
I didn't see this match, but Akira has played big minutes and tends to carry his team a bit which takes its toll. I am worried the same will happen to Ardie who is carrying the Canes back on his lonesome at the moment - we need him firing later in the year.
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Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
@SammyC said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
While I'm not sure that is 100% true, but as already been mentioned by @No-Quarter, he gets constantly worked at the Blues, while all his "competitors" in other squads have rests at various times of the competition.
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@rotated said in Brumbies vs Blues:
20 isn't young
20 isn't too young, but it is young
I was just pointing out he is 2-3 years earlier in his development than any of the other new, young, emerging tens
@Duluth said in Brumbies vs Blues:
@rotated said in Brumbies vs Blues:
20 isn't young
20 isn't too young, but it is young
I was just pointing out he is 2-3 years earlier in his development than any of the other new, young, emerging tens
It's a fair point Sopoaga and Mounga blossomed slighlty later and were both servicable and title winning 10s. Perhaps the game is moving more in that direction. But in general expecting first fives to develop after their very early 20's has been a fool's errand.
That said the Blues flushed Anscombe at 21 so perhaps give Plummer the remainder of the season and make a call on his future then?
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@Duluth said in Brumbies vs Blues:
@rotated said in Brumbies vs Blues:
20 isn't young
20 isn't too young, but it is young
I was just pointing out he is 2-3 years earlier in his development than any of the other new, young, emerging tens
It's a fair point Sopoaga and Mounga blossomed slighlty later and were both servicable and title winning 10s. Perhaps the game is moving more in that direction. But in general expecting first fives to develop after their very early 20's has been a fool's errand.
That said the Blues flushed Anscombe at 21 so perhaps give Plummer the remainder of the season and make a call on his future then?
@rotated Sopoaga and Black made their SR debut at 20, just like Plummer. BB made his debut as a WTG member as an injury replacement at the age of 19. Mo'unga and Cruden made their SR debut at 21.
By the way, the age at which a player (first five or not) develops as a successful SR player doesn't only depend on whether a player is an early developer or a late blossomer, but also who is in the queue ahead of him. Plummer hasn't had star players blocking his way. Black, as a WTG member, was in the queue behind BB (and probably also behind James Marshall and Jason Woodward); BB in his WTG year was sitting behind Cruden (not a star yet at the time); Cruden in his first year was competing with Willy Ripia (never been a star); and Sopoaga's first year was behind Slade (who was already capped, but injured). Mo'unga was in the queue behind Carter, Slade, Taylor (during his year in the WTG).
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@SammyC said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
I didn't see this match, but Akira has played big minutes and tends to carry his team a bit which takes its toll. I am worried the same will happen to Ardie who is carrying the Canes back on his lonesome at the moment - we need him firing later in the year.
@No-Quarter Akira & Tom Robinson have played 776 and 775 mins respectively (Nanai on 800 only blues player ahead)
Next forward is Parsons at 596, then GCT and PT on 566 & 534 respectively...rest under 500.
If Nock gets the chance to start again, he needs to back it up, consistency been a big issue for him
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@No-Quarter Akira & Tom Robinson have played 776 and 775 mins respectively (Nanai on 800 only blues player ahead)
Next forward is Parsons at 596, then GCT and PT on 566 & 534 respectively...rest under 500.
If Nock gets the chance to start again, he needs to back it up, consistency been a big issue for him
@taniwharugby said in Brumbies vs Blues:
@No-Quarter Akira & Tom Robinson have played 776 and 775 mins respectively (Nanai on 800 only blues player ahead)
Next forward is Parsons at 596, then GCT and PT on 566 & 534 respectively...rest under 500.
If Nock gets the chance to start again, he needs to back it up, consistency been a big issue for him
And both Robinson and Akira are starting to play like it. Being played into the ground a bit, which is doing neither the team or the players any favours.
Not sure why either, you could have Dalton spelling Robinson (or vice versa), and I really liked Sotutu for Auckland, surely it's worth trying him at some point as well?
Both Robinson and Akira are very busy players, and get through a mountain of work, I can't see how playing them so much will work over a full season.
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@SammyC said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
I didn't see this match, but Akira has played big minutes and tends to carry his team a bit which takes its toll. I am worried the same will happen to Ardie who is carrying the Canes back on his lonesome at the moment - we need him firing later in the year.
@No-Quarter said in Brumbies vs Blues:
@SammyC said in Brumbies vs Blues:
Brumbies are very one dimensional... but I disagree it made for a boring game. It was tight and the result could have gone either way.
Enjoyed the contrast of styles and the contest.
Nock was good for the blues, has an awesome box kick. I love watching Tom Robinson play
Akira’s season starting to look a bit like last year, he was unstoppable for the first half of the comp and faded towards the end.
Karl T looks fatter than last year, i thought the opposite was supposed to happen.
I didn't see this match, but Akira has played big minutes and tends to carry his team a bit which takes its toll. I am worried the same will happen to Ardie who is carrying the Canes back on his lonesome at the moment - we need him firing later in the year.
Difference being, for me at least, Ardie is a class above and him being in the ABs environment for a while now, he would’ve learned how to manage his game better.
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I am hearing TTT is on the Blues recruitment list..thoughts..?
I have long held the belief we have recruited very poorly in key positions..in what other NZ franchise team would either Otere Black,Jonathan Ruru or James Parsons be starters ..?.in the case of Ruru,he would struggle to make a match day 23 in any other squad as for Parsons, no more than a bench warmer.
I would still have,Coles,Taylor,Coltman,Harris,Amua and Rikitelli ahead of Parsons..I would even have former Grammar Tech hooker Andrew Makalio now with the Saders ahead of Parsons just simply because of his physicality .(nice one AK rugby, got told he was too fat)Just on Sam Nock, having tried to have a conversation with the guy, he’s very much an introvert..
Answers questions yes or no without adding to much detail..I can only assume not being a yapper does not help when you are trying to direct forwards especially mauls are either being driven or defended.
I thought he did play well the other night, with Pulu looking like he is on the move next year, do we persist with Nock & Ruru or do we clear the decks..?
Personally I would have a crack at another youngster say like Folau Fakatava or Jamie Booth from the Sunwolves who impresses me no end with his high energy ,running game and continuous chat..
