Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc
-
@JA said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
Do the media think the general public are too thick too absorb content like this?
Surely there’s space for a grassroots type podcast/Youtube channel to fill this obvious void? There’s a bunch of South African ones but mileage varies greatly with these.Podcasts are generally started by individuals, and want enough watching them to get a few $s don't they?
So if there is genuinely a hole for certain type of podcast, here is your chance to make some $s. mate! -
@gt12 said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
The second big issue - and if anyone from NZRU is listening , please do something about it - is that these guys talk about stats that the average engaged fan cannot easily reach and certainly can’t reach through the sort of channels that Silver lake money and +NZR were meant to unlock. So Gypper can explain away a poor performance by focusing on an upward trend in key stats that regular punters can’t get a hold of (easily, at least).
Same as politics on MSM
It’s their only USP
It’s certainly not the quality of analysis
-
UK based and focussed but very knowledgeable about the global game
All on YouTube
Squidge
Rugby Analyst
Eggchasers
Welsh Rugby PodcastI dip into Rugby Pod and The Good, The Bad, The Rugby but too often it’s about them and in jokes
-
@MiketheSnow said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
UK based and focussed but very knowledgeable about the global game
All on YouTube
Squidge
-
@antipodean said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@MiketheSnow said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
UK based and focussed but very knowledgeable about the global game
All on YouTube
Squidge
You may not like the medium - I find it irritating as fuck - but the message is always on point
-
@MiketheSnow the same bloke that said England would win the RWC under Eddie Jones?
-
@antipodean said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@MiketheSnow the same bloke that said England would win the RWC under Eddie Jones?
That's predictions
His analysis is very good
-
@Windows97 said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
And apologies for yet another tangent especially after poor Duluth split this tread already
But one of the issues I have with rugby in regards to how it promotes "the game" is that it's promoted as fun and entertaining and about mate ship/team work and passion (all of which are great things) but there's very little effort is put into promoting the intellectual aspect of the game.
It's great pity because there's lots of smart people in rugby, the thought that goes into developing attacking and defensive systems is really impressive. As a rugby community I think we kinda miss a bit of a trick here.
I hate this about all sports to be honest. At least other sports also try to throw in something for the intellectual (for lack of a better word) in their coverage.
Also, actually having more technical programming that allows the fans to get more of an insider's knowledge about tactics etc. helps fans develop their understanding of the game and therefore deepen their connection to the game. Passionate and knowledgeable fans are far more likely to spend time and money watching, playing, purchasing subscriptions, buying tickets to matches etc.
What use are millions of casual fans who only watch highlights on Youtube?
-
@JA said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
I listen to a lot of podcasts and it genuinely gobsmacks me at the continued ineptitude of the rugby analysis we get in NZ. You’d think we would have the best technical analysis of games in the world given the prominence rugby has in NZ culture.
Contrast to that Ireland – smaller playing population and rugby competes with Gaelic Football and Soccer. Despite that, there’s 3 Irish podcasts I regularly listen to. (There’s a bunch of other lesser options too.) Yes, they are horribly biased but know way more about the any opposition Ireland plays than any NZ rugby analyst. They tear into the team when they lose and actually spend time to analyse the game and tactics - we get told someone had a good game because they scored a try. It puts almost anything we get to shame.
Do the media think the general public are too thick too absorb content like this?
Surely there’s space for a grassroots type podcast/Youtube channel to fill this obvious void? There’s a bunch of South African ones but mileage varies greatly with these.The rugby-industrial-complex in NZ is too small and no one wants to piss of their mates or anyone in power. While Rattue was a massive prick, the way he was frozen out completely by The Cartel has proved to be a salutary lesson for his colleagues and is probably part of the reason why we have the media we do.
-
@junior said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@JA said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
I listen to a lot of podcasts and it genuinely gobsmacks me at the continued ineptitude of the rugby analysis we get in NZ. You’d think we would have the best technical analysis of games in the world given the prominence rugby has in NZ culture.
Contrast to that Ireland – smaller playing population and rugby competes with Gaelic Football and Soccer. Despite that, there’s 3 Irish podcasts I regularly listen to. (There’s a bunch of other lesser options too.) Yes, they are horribly biased but know way more about the any opposition Ireland plays than any NZ rugby analyst. They tear into the team when they lose and actually spend time to analyse the game and tactics - we get told someone had a good game because they scored a try. It puts almost anything we get to shame.
Do the media think the general public are too thick too absorb content like this?
Surely there’s space for a grassroots type podcast/Youtube channel to fill this obvious void? There’s a bunch of South African ones but mileage varies greatly with these.The rugby-industrial-complex in NZ is too small and no one wants to piss of their mates or anyone in power. While Rattue was a massive prick, the way he was frozen out completely by The Cartel has proved to be a salutary lesson for his colleagues and is probably part of the reason why we have the media we do.
That's a great point.
In general humans have a tendency toward groupthink because there is much more safety in staying with the herd than being outspoken.
People who stand up and rebel against systems oftentimes don't last all that long. And systems will always try to perpetuate and eradicate any threat to them by outsiders asking too many inconvenient questions or upsetting the apple cart.
So in essence NZ rugby does not exist in a climate where speaking truth to power is easily accomplished and can therefore not be accurately audited.
-
@junior Fully agreed about the local media not wanting to upset their mates or contacts. But that’s why I bought up Ireland – similar population and rugby competes with other sports, just like we do.
So why are their options for detailed analysis so much better than ours? I don’t know the answer.
More examples – the 42ie. It will have multiple articles from Kinsella or whoever breaking down one facet of the game in minute detail. A dozen stills and a video to show how one strike play evolved and was executed. Can you imagine Stuff or the Herald doing similar?
Tim from Eggchasers can go deep into the AB’s depth chart and discuss random players off the top of his head. Could you imagine the Breakdown guys discussing the merits of England’s fourth choice tighthead or Prendergast’s tackling technique? Ha!
-
@junior said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@JA said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
I listen to a lot of podcasts and it genuinely gobsmacks me at the continued ineptitude of the rugby analysis we get in NZ. You’d think we would have the best technical analysis of games in the world given the prominence rugby has in NZ culture.
Contrast to that Ireland – smaller playing population and rugby competes with Gaelic Football and Soccer. Despite that, there’s 3 Irish podcasts I regularly listen to. (There’s a bunch of other lesser options too.) Yes, they are horribly biased but know way more about the any opposition Ireland plays than any NZ rugby analyst. They tear into the team when they lose and actually spend time to analyse the game and tactics - we get told someone had a good game because they scored a try. It puts almost anything we get to shame.
Do the media think the general public are too thick too absorb content like this?
Surely there’s space for a grassroots type podcast/Youtube channel to fill this obvious void? There’s a bunch of South African ones but mileage varies greatly with these.The rugby-industrial-complex in NZ is too small and no one wants to piss of their mates or anyone in power. While Rattue was a massive prick, the way he was frozen out completely by The Cartel has proved to be a salutary lesson for his colleagues and is probably part of the reason why we have the media we do.
Yup, the NFL realised that it’s an effective form of promotion and freely allows their game content to be dissected by random Youtubers. Whereas World Rugby or Six Nations started giving Squidge copyright strikes for using a 3 second clip of a game.
-
@antipodean said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@MiketheSnow said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
UK based and focussed but very knowledgeable about the global game
All on YouTube
Squidge
Here's an excellent case in point
-
@MiketheSnow I won't watch it for the simple reason every video of his I've seen is tiresome, with stupid cuts, pointing out the obvious or just plain wrong. His analysis is generally reddit level dogshit - catering to casuals when in reality it's more often than not surface-level, selective, or just flat-out wrong. I'm uninterested in his cherry-picked clips to retrospectively fit a narrative proven wrong within short order.
-
@antipodean said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@MiketheSnow I won't watch it for the simple reason every video of his I've seen is tiresome, with stupid cuts, pointing out the obvious or just plain wrong. His analysis is generally reddit level dogshit - catering to casuals when in reality it's more often than not surface-level, selective, or just flat-out wrong. I'm uninterested in his cherry-picked clips to retrospectively fit a narrative proven wrong within short order.
Keep enjoying The Breakdown
-
@MiketheSnow said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
Here's an excellent case in point
I quite like the guy – he tries to be creative and actually say something new which is more than you can say for 95% of rugby media – but the video is a pretty good example of why I don’t love him.
Every video there’s something that genuinely irks me. At the 16m16s mark, he’s talking about how the Canadian attacking shape is very fluid, showing how they can align on the fly even when it looks like they’re all out of position. As an example, he uses their game against the Black Ferns in Christchurch where Tessier, the Canadian 12, scores after such a spontaneous realignment.
The problem is that it’s a very bad example. The Canadian 11, Farries, runs immediately behind her own player as a result of the poor alignment, which means that the try is eventually disallowed. So rather than working as an example arguing for Canada’s attacking shape, it’s an argument against it, showing the potential downsides of playing too loosely and without structure.
Squidge Rugby doesn’t mention any of this. And that is bad and lazy writing. If you’ve ever attended a class on how to write, one of the first rules will always be to “kill your darlings”. Squidge was probably very proud of his insight on the fluidity of the Canadian attacking shape. But if you can’t find a good example of it actually working – rather than an example which ends up being counter-productive – then you simply need to bin it. If you don’t, it threatens to undermine the whole thing.
You could argue that it’s a stupid rule, that it stifles the creative spirit. But rules are there for a reason. As a wise man once said: “Socks before or after trousers, but never socks before pants, that's the rule. Makes a man look scary, like a chicken.”
And isn’t that the real insight?
-
@MiketheSnow said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@antipodean said in Quality of rugby media - TV Shows etc:
@MiketheSnow I won't watch it for the simple reason every video of his I've seen is tiresome, with stupid cuts, pointing out the obvious or just plain wrong. His analysis is generally reddit level dogshit - catering to casuals when in reality it's more often than not surface-level, selective, or just flat-out wrong. I'm uninterested in his cherry-picked clips to retrospectively fit a narrative proven wrong within short order.
Keep enjoying The Breakdown
I don't watch it and I'm not the Lone Ranger here for reasons well documented.
-
Yeah, I find Squidge to be insufferable for the reasons outlined above.
-
