All Blacks vs Springboks II
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I was watching one of the sky NZ Rugby shows earlier in the year where one of them pundits said the Wallabies were likely to finish no better than third.
Now we've got this crazy bullshit
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Hard to fathom for most of you after such a drubbing but better decisions and ball retention and this match is very, very different
The game plan is a far bigger problem than cattle
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Hard to fathom for most of you after such a drubbing but better decisions and ball retention and this match is very, very different
The game plan is a far bigger problem than cattle
I agree.
However we need a captain. It's obvious.
Roigard will make a big difference.
We need a 10. -
@canefan said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@kidcalder said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@game_film Not sure Sotutu is the answer
One player isn't the answer. Our inability to clinically perform fundamentals such as kick receptions, line outs and scrums seems to be increasingly apparent as games go on. Sometimes we scrape home, this time we got pumped. Fault lies with the everyone from the coaches to the players. There are some fundamental problems in how we are approaching the game at the moment. And we have a coach who is impeding the progress of the whole group because of his selections
I think we have seen the importance of having quality players across your whole 23. Or at the minimum players who can perform their core role and let others shine..
Seriously how does someone like Brodie McCallister get selected for the All Blacks with problematic lineout throwing? Why was this not noted after his debut or picked up at practice this week? It is like a time warp back to Anton Oliver where core roles are not a big deal if you are a good bloke and rugged team man.
@tubbyj said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@canefan said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@kidcalder said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@game_film Not sure Sotutu is the answer
One player isn't the answer. Our inability to clinically perform fundamentals such as kick receptions, line outs and scrums seems to be increasingly apparent as games go on. Sometimes we scrape home, this time we got pumped. Fault lies with the everyone from the coaches to the players. There are some fundamental problems in how we are approaching the game at the moment. And we have a coach who is impeding the progress of the whole group because of his selections
I think we have seen the importance of having quality players across your whole 23. Or at the minimum players who can perform their core role and let others shine..
Seriously how does someone like Brodie McCallister get selected for the All Blacks with problematic lineout throwing? Why was this not noted after his debut or picked up at practice this week? It is like a time warp back to Anton Oliver where core roles are not a big deal if you are a good bloke and rugged team man.
There were two very poor throws, then another stuff up on the lift, and then one he hit Holland.
Yes it’s disappointing but Anton was our first choice hooker when those woes occurred. Brodie is 4th choice. Also we have a long history of hookers not being great at hitting a target when they first become ABs. ADM, Sami, Hammett, even Mealamu was pot luck.
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@brodean said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
So far we've had the 2nd worst defence in the comp.
The defensive workrate of our primary 7 leads a lot to be desired.
Completed Tackles per 80 Minutes
17.26 Parker
14.31 Lio Willie
13.55 Kirifi
12.88 Finau
11.05 Sititi
10.43 Vaa'i
10.2 SaveaLowest defensive workrate of the loose forwards.
Also Tupou Vaa'i's tackle success this season is 77% which is shocking for a loose forward/lock even at NPC level.
I dont understand why Lio Willie wasn't fully selected in the squad to start with and when he did play well vs France why he didnt make the squad for The Rugby Championship. Instead foodbill Jacobson takes up a spot whilst Razor rotates 8 between Savea, Parker and Sititi
I understand he's a tad small in an ideal world but in terms of what we have I thought he got shafted.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@brodean said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
So far we've had the 2nd worst defence in the comp.
The defensive workrate of our primary 7 leads a lot to be desired.
Completed Tackles per 80 Minutes
17.26 Parker
14.31 Lio Willie
13.55 Kirifi
12.88 Finau
11.05 Sititi
10.43 Vaa'i
10.2 SaveaLowest defensive workrate of the loose forwards.
Also Tupou Vaa'i's tackle success this season is 77% which is shocking for a loose forward/lock even at NPC level.
I dont understand why Lio Willie wasn't fully selected in the squad to start with and when he did play well vs France why he didnt make the squad for The Rugby Championship. Instead foodbill Jacobson takes up a spot whilst Razor rotates 8 between Savea, Parker and Sititi
I understand he's a tad small in an ideal world but in terms of what we have I thought he got shafted.
He is small but he has a well balanced game and he seemed good enough to compete with the French forwards who though no the best were still physical.
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I just do not fu@@cking understand
We all knew the Boks would bring fire to the scrums,would try to dominate line outs and would coat the ball with snow when they kicked
....
.
And they did and here we sit sucking our thumbs
This defeat has been coming for a while though -
@canefan said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Anyway women up in our hotel room in Wellington, and I still pissed at what I saw. I actually said to Mrs, that could save us some money, as I feel I won't probably bother to coming to a test again. I can handle us losing, but not thinking an AB team pulled the plug with 15 minutes to go. If I see any press conference and Razor or anyone makes excuses, apart from pointing out how bad they seem to of been coached and played, I will kick the tv. And I can't afford a new one!
This is such a negative post by your standards Dan, a huge indictment on the team. They have failed us all
I know mate, as a matter of principle, I try to avoid being negative, in here ( or any forum), but like most of us I am hurting!
@Dan54 said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@canefan said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Anyway women up in our hotel room in Wellington, and I still pissed at what I saw. I actually said to Mrs, that could save us some money, as I feel I won't probably bother to coming to a test again. I can handle us losing, but not thinking an AB team pulled the plug with 15 minutes to go. If I see any press conference and Razor or anyone makes excuses, apart from pointing out how bad they seem to of been coached and played, I will kick the tv. And I can't afford a new one!
This is such a negative post by your standards Dan, a huge indictment on the team. They have failed us all
I know mate, as a matter of principle, I try to avoid being negative, in here ( or any forum), but like most of us I am hurting!
I woke up in the middle of the night, remembered what happened, and was shocked. Could hardly believe it.
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@NTA f*ck does that mean we can still win it.
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@NTA f*ck does that mean we can still win it.
Looks to me like anyone can.
Boks have to be favourites tho after last night and games to come at Kings Park and ?Twickenham??
I'm expecting the ABs to roar back into it with a backlash performance at Eden Park, then Perth will determine if they're a shot.
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The other thing, I noticed once we got close to halftime , and until end of game, if we did anything to look at getting a head of steam up, a Bok would go down injured. I know it's a piss off etc, but I never saw Scooter get in refs ear. I was sitting just in front a few touring Bok supporters who laughed and said it was there game. We weren't arguing etc, just agreeing, and the bottom line is if our captain etc are doing job, we should stay switched on anyway!
Was noticeable that they had a wterboy on sideling, conveying message non stop, he would use hand signals, and quite often just hold uo a number of fingers. Again why not us?@Dan54 said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
The other thing, I noticed once we got close to halftime , and until end of game, if we did anything to look at getting a head of steam up, a Bok would go down injured. I know it's a piss off etc, but I never saw Scooter get in refs ear. I was sitting just in front a few touring Bok supporters who laughed and said it was there game. We weren't arguing etc, just agreeing, and the bottom line is if our captain etc are doing job, we should stay switched on anyway!
Was noticeable that they had a wterboy on sideling, conveying message non stop, he would use hand signals, and quite often just hold uo a number of fingers. Again why not us?Same thing in the BF game. Their big fatties went down periodically with some "injury". Out comes the ice bag and the others are there sucking in the big ones
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Player wise.
Proctor has been given a real shot at centre but is not improving. Get rid.
Wallace Sititi got heaps of shit but watching it he was literally the only loose forward doing anything. When he went off we had no one cleaning anything up.
Vaai some good, lots bad, no physical presence when we needed it.
Barrett was shit.My random thoughts (all of which I qualify with "but alcohol may have affected my judgement and memory"):
- Thought Proctor had his best game in black. Not a massively high bar, but saw the glimmerings of promise.
- Thought Sititi was pretty good myself.
- Also thought Vaa'i was OK
- He's got to find the courage to drop Barrett
I agree with your comment about that attacking lineout just before half time.
That was begging for a standard throw to 2 or 4 and a maul.
I didn't notice the backs down, but maybe ABs did which tempted them in to the high risk option.
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- Thought Proctor had his best game in black. Not a massively high bar, but saw the glimmerings of promise.
Mate, if his best game includes throwing Kolbe a dog biscuit we’re in trouble.
@game_film said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
- Thought Proctor had his best game in black. Not a massively high bar, but saw the glimmerings of promise.
Mate, if his best game includes throwing Kolbe a dog biscuit we’re in trouble.
I'm a fan. But some guys look born ready for the big stage, and I'm not sure he does. Doesn't look any better than Rieko so far, and at least Rieko was a watertight defender
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@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@NTA f*ck does that mean we can still win it.
Looks to me like anyone can.
Boks have to be favourites tho after last night and games to come at Kings Park and ?Twickenham??
I'm expecting the ABs to roar back into it with a backlash performance at Eden Park, then Perth will determine if they're a shot.
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@NTA f*ck does that mean we can still win it.
Looks to me like anyone can.
Boks have to be favourites tho after last night and games to come at Kings Park and ?Twickenham??
I'm expecting the ABs to roar back into it with a backlash performance at Eden Park, then Perth will determine if they're a shot.
We have been very good for periods. Generally early in a game. But our second half performances have generally been poo. If we can't put enough points on your lot in the first half you should have a chance to pass us down the stretch
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@Tim said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@antipodean Jesus Christ, rugby media is so fucking servile and clueless!
This came up on my timeline a week or so ago. - what a load of simpering intellectual masturbation
"What’s striking about Razor’s coaching style is how thoughtfully holistic it is.
Scott Robertson has mastered both rugby tactics and behavioural science. The self-proclaimed visionary lends his creativity to game-breaking attacking schemes and stifling defence. His IQ is impressive and while clearly a cut above the rest, what separates him is his EQ".
The messages that are delivered are carefully crafted to be concise and clear. Robertson’s experience at coaching workshops worldwide – at Saracens, the Brisbane Broncos, the Melbourne Storm, West Ham, the San Antonio Spurs and the Dallas Cowboys to name a few – have all informed and developed this skill.
This one quote sums up his approach perfectly: “I don’t motivate people, I inspire people to be motivated”
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
self-proclaimed visionary
Amongst a heap of flashing orange lights in that write-up... that's a massive red one.
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This post-mortem from Two Cents Rugby is as good as anything I've seen and heard outside the Fern since yesterday's disaster.
Only thing I don't like is an All Blacks fan wearing a Springbok jersey. Let the Boks enjoy their triumph and our moment of total humiliation, don't jump on their band wagon.
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This post-mortem from Two Cents Rugby is as good as anything I've seen and heard outside the Fern since yesterday's disaster.
Only thing I don't like is an All Blacks fan wearing a Springbok jersey. Let the Boks enjoy their triumph and our moment of total humiliation, don't jump on their band wagon.
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Just watched the 2nd half again. Williams saved two tries with his sheer pace, he's a freakish talent. The number of X factor backs the Boks have now is scary. In the past you just had to gain parity with their pack and you had them beat, now their backs can create opportunities from all over the field even if you nullify their pack. They are the complete package now.
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I didn't watch yesterday, so knowing the score and reading the thread I actually expected much worse.
I thought at half time both coaches would have been very happy. We were by far the better team, imposed ourselves and were in front. They had been outplayed but were close.
Huge turning point in that first half was we have an attacking lineout off that awesome BB kick, they have backs down all over the place. Who ever our retard of a lineout caller is, calls an overly complicated lineout, the ref lets thrm close the gap an upset our pod, turnover followed by THAT DMac chip kick. Chance to establish a big lead gone in like 30 seconds.
2nd half again we were actually really good for 29 minutes. Bok try was brilliant off that scrum, but we're in touch. Then two things happen at the same time. We sub a midfielder on our line, and once again our lineout call is idiotic. Try.
The next 4 minutes is an absolute horror show. 2 will Jordan errors, a shocker of a BB kick. Just low IQ rugby. And it never recovers.
South Africa though, wow. That 2nd half was perfect. Fast, accurate and brutal. What should concern everyone in NZ is i do not believe this AB team has that level of rugby in them. Maybe only France do TBH.
Absolute horror show last quarter for us. Absolutely sublime for South Africa. Well done to them I'm very fucking impressed.
@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
I didn't watch yesterday, so knowing the score and reading the thread I actually expected much worse.
I thought at half time both coaches would have been very happy. We were by far the better team, imposed ourselves and were in front. They had been outplayed but were close.
Huge turning point in that first half was we have an attacking lineout off that awesome BB kick, they have backs down all over the place. Who ever our retard of a lineout caller is, calls an overly complicated lineout, the ref lets thrm close the gap an upset our pod, turnover followed by THAT DMac chip kick. Chance to establish a big lead gone in like 30 seconds.
2nd half again we were actually really good for 29 minutes. Bok try was brilliant off that scrum, but we're in touch. Then two things happen at the same time. We sub a midfielder on our line, and once again our lineout call is idiotic. Try.
The next 4 minutes is an absolute horror show. 2 will Jordan errors, a shocker of a BB kick. Just low IQ rugby. And it never recovers.
South Africa though, wow. That 2nd half was perfect. Fast, accurate and brutal. What should concern everyone in NZ is i do not believe this AB team has that level of rugby in them. Maybe only France do TBH.
Absolute horror show last quarter for us. Absolutely sublime for South Africa. Well done to them I'm very fucking impressed.
Belter of a post.
Huge factor in this game was how Boks staff work was excellent while ABs’ was pretty average - that midfield sub being just one example.
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@sparky He's not jumping on the bandwagon - he always wears the jersey of the lowest ranked team (going into the game)
Although, I have a spare Bok jersey for ya
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Player wise.
Proctor has been given a real shot at centre but is not improving. Get rid.
Wallace Sititi got heaps of shit but watching it he was literally the only loose forward doing anything. When he went off we had no one cleaning anything up.
Vaai some good, lots bad, no physical presence when we needed it.
Barrett was shit.My random thoughts (all of which I qualify with "but alcohol may have affected my judgement and memory"):
- Thought Proctor had his best game in black. Not a massively high bar, but saw the glimmerings of promise.
- Thought Sititi was pretty good myself.
- Also thought Vaa'i was OK
- He's got to find the courage to drop Barrett
I agree with your comment about that attacking lineout just before half time.
That was begging for a standard throw to 2 or 4 and a maul.
I didn't notice the backs down, but maybe ABs did which tempted them in to the high risk option.
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Just watched the 2nd half again. Williams saved two tries with his sheer pace, he's a freakish talent. The number of X factor backs the Boks have now is scary. In the past you just had to gain parity with their pack and you had them beat, now their backs can create opportunities from all over the field even if you nullify their pack. They are the complete package now.
