Ashes 2025/6
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@NTA said in Ashes 2025/6:
@MN5 said in Ashes 2025/6:
Then again, in 1999 Air New Zealand did paint a plane with the Otago/All Black front row so maybe we're almost as bad sometimes.
How quickly you all forget 1991 through to 2011...
how long has it been for Australia?
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@mariner4life Yep. They play like they have ADHD.
Contrast that with the likes of McGrath, Hadlee etc. -
@nostrildamus said in Ashes 2025/6:
@NTA said in Ashes 2025/6:
@MN5 said in Ashes 2025/6:
Then again, in 1999 Air New Zealand did paint a plane with the Otago/All Black front row so maybe we're almost as bad sometimes.
How quickly you all forget 1991 through to 2011...
how long has it been for Australia?
you need to be more specific, how long has it been since Australia last won a RWC, or how long has it been since they held the Bledisloe Cup, how long since they have beaten us at Eden Park or how long since they beaten us....
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@reprobate said in Ashes 2025/6:
@mariner4life Yep. They play like they have ADHD.
Contrast that with the likes of McGrath, Hadlee etc.Paddles never resorted to cheap intimidation. His bowling spoke for him.
McGrath was much the same although blotted the copybook a bit by threatening to rip Ramnaraesh Sarwans throat out.
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@nostrildamus said in Ashes 2025/6:
@NTA said in Ashes 2025/6:
@MN5 said in Ashes 2025/6:
Then again, in 1999 Air New Zealand did paint a plane with the Otago/All Black front row so maybe we're almost as bad sometimes.
How quickly you all forget 1991 through to 2011...
how long has it been for Australia?
You say that now of course, but you've got to remember the bad times and the good. For example, and not to derail the cricket thread any furth- nah fuck it:
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@Virgil said in Ashes 2025/6:
you need to be more specific, how long has it been since Australia last won a RWC, or how long has it been since they held the Bledisloe Cup, how long since they have beaten us at Eden Park or how long since they beaten us....
Could be all of it - I'm feeling magnanimous.
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@mariner4life said in Ashes 2025/6:
what has done my head way more than the batting approach has been the bowling "plans". How much short wide shit did they serve up at the 'gabba? the difference in the pitch maps between the two attacks could not have been more stark.
When Scott Boland, and absolute bunny, was occupying the crease they were chucking short shit at him rather than just hitting the top of off and waiting for the inevitable mistake? Boring? Yes. But that's test cricket some times. Chucking short shit at him might make you feel like a tough fluffybunny, but it makes you look stupid.
its telling when you look at the all time best bowling records of pace bowlers in OZ how far down the list any English bowlers are.
Min 50 wicketsCB Turner 63 wickets @ 14.84
Boland 56 wickets @ 15.14
Bumrah 64 wickets @ 17.15
Sir Paddles 77 wickets @ 17.83followed by the likes of Ambrose, Cummins, McGrath and a who's who of greats.
First Pom in the list is SF Barnes who played 120 odd years ago followed by Larwood who used the much loved Bodyline tactic to nullify Bradman
The best modern bowler for the poms is Botham with 69 wickets @ 28.44 in 30th place..
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@Virgil said in Ashes 2025/6:
@mariner4life said in Ashes 2025/6:
what has done my head way more than the batting approach has been the bowling "plans". How much short wide shit did they serve up at the 'gabba? the difference in the pitch maps between the two attacks could not have been more stark.
When Scott Boland, and absolute bunny, was occupying the crease they were chucking short shit at him rather than just hitting the top of off and waiting for the inevitable mistake? Boring? Yes. But that's test cricket some times. Chucking short shit at him might make you feel like a tough fluffybunny, but it makes you look stupid.
its telling when you look at the all time best bowling records of pace bowlers in OZ how far down the list any English bowlers are.
Min 50 wicketsCB Turner 63 wickets @ 14.84
Boland 56 wickets @ 15.14
Bumrah 64 wickets @ 17.15
Sir Paddles 77 wickets @ 17.83followed by the likes of Ambrose, Cummins, McGrath and a who's who of greats.
First Pom in the list is SF Barnes who played 120 odd years ago followed by Larwood who used the much loved Bodyline tactic to nullify Bradman
The best modern bowler for the poms is Botham with 69 wickets @ 28.44 in 30th place..
A real piston wristed gibbon according to the Aussie crowds of the 80s.
Paddles didn't have a bad record against anyone but he particularly lifted when playing across the ditch didn't he ?
I think Beefys stats probably mirrored his overall career stats. First 50 odd tests he was untouchable, next 50 odd he was there solely on reputation, batting and bowling figures suffered. I still would have thought he'd have a better average than that though. His whole reputation and legacy is built around how he went in the Ashes.......
No Anderson, Broad, Willis, Snow etc is pretty telling.......
Larwood sounds like he was a character. Despite the controversy over how he bowled at Bradman he emigrated to Oz and lived there the rest of his life.
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while im digging, had a look at NZ's bowlers record in Oz...
min 250 balls bowled. We havent had the same number of opportunities to tour there of course.
Ignoring obvious part timers, though allowing Coney...Paddles as we know = GOAT
Coney 6 wickets @ 18.00
Wagner 17 wickets @ 22.76
Dayle Hadlee 8 wickets @ 28.75then it gets ugly..
Cairns Snr 15 wickets @ 35.86
Chats 9 wickets @ 37.55
Vettori 36 wickets @ 38.22
Boult 18 wickets @ 38.33
Cairns Jnr 28 wickets @ 39.03
Southee 28 wickets @ 40.00
Coldplay 20 wickets @ 41.00
Doull 11 wickets @ 46.45
Danny Morrison 15 wickets @ 61.40!! -
@Virgil said in Ashes 2025/6:
while im digging, had a look at NZ's bowlers record in Oz...
min 250 balls bowled. We havent had the same number of opportunities to tour there of course.
Ignoring obvious part timers, though allowing Coney...Paddles as we know = GOAT
Coney 6 wickets @ 18.00
Wagner 17 wickets @ 22.76
Dayle Hadlee 8 wickets @ 28.75then it gets ugly..
Cairns Snr 15 wickets @ 35.86
Chats 9 wickets @ 37.55
Vettori 36 wickets @ 38.22
Boult 18 wickets @ 38.33
Cairns Jnr 28 wickets @ 39.03
Southee 28 wickets @ 40.00
Coldplay 20 wickets @ 41.00
Doull 11 wickets @ 46.45
Danny Morrison 15 wickets @ 61.40!!DK was SO much better than his stats suggested.
Border always seemed to struggle against him ( although others didn't judging by that record
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as much as i am loath to give more oxygen to yet another fucking historical cricket discussion taking over another fucking thread
if you are going to turn up to australia as a 130km swing bowler you are going to have a shitty time.
And as a touring bowler, you can't get carried away with the pace and bounce. i have seen far too many guys come here and think pace and bounce means you have to bowl short and blast guys out. The good guys who come here work out real quick you let the lift off a length do the work for you. For sure, have a short plan for when guys are set and you need something different, but it should never ever be your main plan.
The gabba is a good batting deck disguised as a bowling deck. you have to work hard and hit your lengths over and over.
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@mariner4life said in Ashes 2025/6:
as much as i am loath to give more oxygen to yet another fucking historical cricket discussion taking over another fucking thread
if you are going to turn up to australia as a 130km swing bowler you are going to have a shitty time.
And as a touring bowler, you can't get carried away with the pace and bounce. i have seen far too many guys come here and think pace and bounce means you have to bowl short and blast guys out. The good guys who come here work out real quick you let the lift off a length do the work for you. For sure, have a short plan for when guys are set and you need something different, but it should never ever be your main plan.
The gabba is a good batting deck disguised as a bowling deck. you have to work hard and hit your lengths over and over.
its all relevant, well not so much the tripe @NTA posted about McCaw
also filling in time until England's next humiliation which is over a week away..im loathe to agree with you but you are right, the pitches and conditions over there mean you have to bowl with patience and the right length. Which is why Hadlee did so well.
Why McGrath had such a great career, bowl around 4th stump on a nagging length and watch the batsmen take the bait. -
@Virgil said in Ashes 2025/6:
@mariner4life said in Ashes 2025/6:
as much as i am loath to give more oxygen to yet another fucking historical cricket discussion taking over another fucking thread
if you are going to turn up to australia as a 130km swing bowler you are going to have a shitty time.
And as a touring bowler, you can't get carried away with the pace and bounce. i have seen far too many guys come here and think pace and bounce means you have to bowl short and blast guys out. The good guys who come here work out real quick you let the lift off a length do the work for you. For sure, have a short plan for when guys are set and you need something different, but it should never ever be your main plan.
The gabba is a good batting deck disguised as a bowling deck. you have to work hard and hit your lengths over and over.
its all relevant, well not so much the tripe @NTA posted about McCaw
also filling in time until England's next humiliation which is over a week away..im loathe to agree with you but you are right, the pitches and conditions over there mean you have to bowl with patience and the right length. Which is why Hadlee did so well.
Why McGrath had such a great career, bowl around 4th stump on a nagging length and watch the batsmen take the bait.He would be THE most consistently accurate bowler I've ever seen, even more so than Paddles.
Seven brilliant batsmen, him, Warne and a couple of others who were more than decent.....it's no wonder they demolished all before them.
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@MN5 said in Ashes 2025/6:
@Virgil said in Ashes 2025/6:
while im digging, had a look at NZ's bowlers record in Oz...
min 250 balls bowled. We havent had the same number of opportunities to tour there of course.
Ignoring obvious part timers, though allowing Coney...Paddles as we know = GOAT
Coney 6 wickets @ 18.00
Wagner 17 wickets @ 22.76
Dayle Hadlee 8 wickets @ 28.75then it gets ugly..
Cairns Snr 15 wickets @ 35.86
Chats 9 wickets @ 37.55
Vettori 36 wickets @ 38.22
Boult 18 wickets @ 38.33
Cairns Jnr 28 wickets @ 39.03
Southee 28 wickets @ 40.00
Coldplay 20 wickets @ 41.00
Doull 11 wickets @ 46.45
Danny Morrison 15 wickets @ 61.40!!DK was SO much better than his stats suggested.
His stats should be adjusted.
Another deal making Frenchie in here?
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@mariner4life said in Ashes 2025/6:
as much as i am loath to give more oxygen to yet another fucking historical cricket discussion taking over another fucking thread
if you are going to turn up to australia as a 130km swing bowler you are going to have a shitty time.
And as a touring bowler, you can't get carried away with the pace and bounce. i have seen far too many guys come here and think pace and bounce means you have to bowl short and blast guys out. The good guys who come here work out real quick you let the lift off a length do the work for you. For sure, have a short plan for when guys are set and you need something different, but it should never ever be your main plan.
The gabba is a good batting deck disguised as a bowling deck. you have to work hard and hit your lengths over and over.
We should leave Zac Foulkes at home next summer to ensure we're not tempted to play him.
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@NTA said in Ashes 2025/6:
Hazlewood ruled out for the series. Achilles.. He might be lucky to get back into Test cricket tbh.
So next game we've only got Cummins, Starc, Boland, and Lyon
We know what it’s like when you have a great set bowling attack and they slowly break apart, we went through that with Boult, Southee and Wagner
Re Hazelwood it’s not like you need him. Shit you haven’t needed Cummins and Lyon’s
Impressed with Neser hope he gets picked again
