Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown & Dublin Duel

[ACT Crusader]

@taniwharugby said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

very interesting line-up.

Obviously the biggest 'issue' is at lock, but Tuipulotu is a very good player, we know Kaino can play a bit, so disruption will be minimal, it will likely be us disrupting their lineout ball that will suffer the most.

That is a strong running backline, is this the first time Savea & Naholo have played together?

This will be their third test start together I think. There was a RWC pool game and they got a start vs Wales earlier this year.

[MN5]

@taniwharugby said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

very interesting line-up.

Obviously the biggest 'issue' is at lock, but Tuipulotu is a very good player, we know Kaino can play a bit, so disruption will be minimal, it will likely be us disrupting their lineout ball that will suffer the most.

That is a strong running backline, is this the first time Savea & Naholo have played together?

At the risk of getting all @Canes4life on us......should we be worried that Ireland have a guy who is about 20 feet tall in their lineup ? our locks look pretty sawn off in comparison.

Gonna be a tough day for the Irish outside backs with Moala, Savea and Naholo running hard and straight.

[Stargazer]

http://twitter.com/IrishRugby/status/794260510422265860

[taniwharugby]

@ACT-Crusader I thought they probably had done in the RWC but couldn't recall any others.

[antipodean]

@Daffy-Jaffy That's an interesting selection. Isn't Soldier Field narrow compared to normal rugby pitches? So the coaches would expect a more direct game - there's a lot of very physical individuals in that lineup.

[booboo]

Any bets on Sexton trying out our wings under the high ball?

[taniwharugby]

@kidcalder said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

Look I realise as usual the chances of the Irish having a full 80 against us is medium - but they showed in 2013 that that has improved.
Just think we have had the high of taking the record had a few injuries (best locking pair in the world out) a centre pairing that are solid but not creative...
I think the bench will have to save us from a tough time.

looking at their lineup and the players that could have played if Schmidt wanted to, you'd think they are more targeting Dublin.

This is a feeler game, see how they go, hopefully keep it close to give belief for the Dublin test...however if its a blowout....

[Derm McCrum]

@taniwharugby said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@kidcalder said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

Look I realise as usual the chances of the Irish having a full 80 against us is medium - but they showed in 2013 that that has improved.
Just think we have had the high of taking the record had a few injuries (best locking pair in the world out) a centre pairing that are solid but not creative...
I think the bench will have to save us from a tough time.

looking at their lineup and the players that could have played if Schmidt wanted to, you'd think they are more targeting Dublin.

This is a feeler game, see how they go, hopefully keep it close to give belief for the Dublin test...however if its a blowout....

I'd agree with that. It has a 'feeler' look about it. And I think New Zealand lineup has a touch of the same. Neither coach fully showing their hand or putting it on the table in the first up.

The team hasn't played any test rugby since June, and they've had about 5-6 days to prepare so rustiness is a big factor, particularly when compared to the match-hardened experience that NZ have.

Will Schmidt seek to keep it tight and careful, long balls into touch/crowd rather than Garryowens, test the NZ lineout, and keep the scoreline as tight as possible in the first half. Was also wondering if Schmidt is going to delay replacements by a few minutes extra than normal - maybe closer to the 55-60 minute mark - and then unleash the bench during the expected NZ try flood that normally occurs.

[KiwiMurph]

At first I thought Ofa T covering loosehead was a strange selection - but it makes sense - if they genuinely see Ofa T as having ability to cover loosehead, this is probably the easiest game on tour to try that out - probably easier than Italy's scrummaging ability, Ireland in Ireland and France.

Moala has barely played in months but i'm guessing he must be going ok at training if he is given the start.

[Nepia]

@ACT-Crusader said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

Only real surprise is Moala, and IMO a pleasing one. I like his game either at centre or wing. He has some areas to develop when it comes to passing but I like his footwork and he has excellent reactions.

A very good 23. It will be interesting to see how they use the bench.

I think Kaino is a real shock at lock, one that I didn't even notice the first time I read the team list - I just saw Kaino and assumed it was as 6. Interesting to see how he goes as a starter as opposed to a late in the match swap.

[Duluth]

If we sub on Ofa, Fuamuina and Savea that would probably be the best ball carrying eight the ABs have ever had on the field

[Rapido]

2 wingers who are unco under the high ball, a relatively midget lineout v a team with a giraffe in the lineout and accurate kicking halves.

Hmmmm, it's almost like Hansen is asking them to kick it?

It's a TRAP!

[Derm McCrum]

@Rapido said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

2 wingers who are unco under the high ball, a relatively midget lineout v a team with a giraffe in the lineout and accurate kicking halves.

Hmmmm, it's almost like Hansen is asking them to kick it?

It's a TRAP!

Agreed. Grubbers all day required.

[No Quarter]

@Pot-Hale said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@taniwharugby said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@kidcalder said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

Look I realise as usual the chances of the Irish having a full 80 against us is medium - but they showed in 2013 that that has improved.
Just think we have had the high of taking the record had a few injuries (best locking pair in the world out) a centre pairing that are solid but not creative...
I think the bench will have to save us from a tough time.

looking at their lineup and the players that could have played if Schmidt wanted to, you'd think they are more targeting Dublin.

This is a feeler game, see how they go, hopefully keep it close to give belief for the Dublin test...however if its a blowout....

I'd agree with that. It has a 'feeler' look about it. And I think New Zealand lineup has a touch of the same. Neither coach fully showing their hand or putting it on the table in the first up.

The team hasn't played any test rugby since June, and they've had about 5-6 days to prepare so rustiness is a big factor, particularly when compared to the match-hardened experience that NZ have.

Will Schmidt seek to keep it tight and careful, long balls into touch/crowd rather than Garryowens, test the NZ lineout, and keep the scoreline as tight as possible in the first half. Was also wondering if Schmidt is going to delay replacements by a few minutes extra than normal - maybe closer to the 55-60 minute mark - and then unleash the bench during the expected NZ try flood that normally occurs.

All good questions and a reason why I've really enjoyed the 3-match tours we've had recently in NZ. Makes the tactical battle far more interesting when it's more than a one-off test. How cool would it be to have a 3 match tour of Ireland? Won't happen but I'm sure the Irish would love 3 cracks in a row against the ABs at home.

[hydro11]

@No-Quarter said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@Pot-Hale said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@taniwharugby said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@kidcalder said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

Look I realise as usual the chances of the Irish having a full 80 against us is medium - but they showed in 2013 that that has improved.
Just think we have had the high of taking the record had a few injuries (best locking pair in the world out) a centre pairing that are solid but not creative...
I think the bench will have to save us from a tough time.

looking at their lineup and the players that could have played if Schmidt wanted to, you'd think they are more targeting Dublin.

This is a feeler game, see how they go, hopefully keep it close to give belief for the Dublin test...however if its a blowout....

I'd agree with that. It has a 'feeler' look about it. And I think New Zealand lineup has a touch of the same. Neither coach fully showing their hand or putting it on the table in the first up.

The team hasn't played any test rugby since June, and they've had about 5-6 days to prepare so rustiness is a big factor, particularly when compared to the match-hardened experience that NZ have.

Will Schmidt seek to keep it tight and careful, long balls into touch/crowd rather than Garryowens, test the NZ lineout, and keep the scoreline as tight as possible in the first half. Was also wondering if Schmidt is going to delay replacements by a few minutes extra than normal - maybe closer to the 55-60 minute mark - and then unleash the bench during the expected NZ try flood that normally occurs.

All good questions and a reason why I've really enjoyed the 3-match tours we've had recently in NZ. Makes the tactical battle far more interesting when it's more than a one-off test. How cool would it be to have a 3 match tour of Ireland? Won't happen but I'm sure the Irish would love 3 cracks in a row against the ABs at home.

It doesn't work so well with Ireland only playing international at one stadium. Playing 3 times in a row at the Aviva would be a bit dull.

[No Quarter]

@hydro11 said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@No-Quarter said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@Pot-Hale said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@taniwharugby said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

@kidcalder said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

Look I realise as usual the chances of the Irish having a full 80 against us is medium - but they showed in 2013 that that has improved.
Just think we have had the high of taking the record had a few injuries (best locking pair in the world out) a centre pairing that are solid but not creative...
I think the bench will have to save us from a tough time.

looking at their lineup and the players that could have played if Schmidt wanted to, you'd think they are more targeting Dublin.

This is a feeler game, see how they go, hopefully keep it close to give belief for the Dublin test...however if its a blowout....

I'd agree with that. It has a 'feeler' look about it. And I think New Zealand lineup has a touch of the same. Neither coach fully showing their hand or putting it on the table in the first up.

The team hasn't played any test rugby since June, and they've had about 5-6 days to prepare so rustiness is a big factor, particularly when compared to the match-hardened experience that NZ have.

Will Schmidt seek to keep it tight and careful, long balls into touch/crowd rather than Garryowens, test the NZ lineout, and keep the scoreline as tight as possible in the first half. Was also wondering if Schmidt is going to delay replacements by a few minutes extra than normal - maybe closer to the 55-60 minute mark - and then unleash the bench during the expected NZ try flood that normally occurs.

All good questions and a reason why I've really enjoyed the 3-match tours we've had recently in NZ. Makes the tactical battle far more interesting when it's more than a one-off test. How cool would it be to have a 3 match tour of Ireland? Won't happen but I'm sure the Irish would love 3 cracks in a row against the ABs at home.

It doesn't work so well with Ireland only playing international at one stadium. Playing 3 times in a row at the Aviva would be a bit dull.

Geographically it might be dull, but all 3 matches would be crackers and would give Ireland a chance to take learnings and adjust their tactics across the 3 games, instead of thinking "well 3 years ago we nearly beat them, what will we do differnently this time? Well the AB team and game plan is different to what it was 3 years ago, so probably can't take much out of it...".

[No Quarter]

On the team - very exciting selections in the backline. Looking for big games from both J Savea and Naholo - if they are both given freedom to come off their wings looking for work they will be a real handful.

Very happy with Moala, ALB has more then taken his chances and a rest will do the young man some good to reflect on what he's achieved. Crotty-Moala has a good feel to it. Can't understand the calls for Crotty to be replaced long term, if he keeps playing like he has this year I don't want him replaced until either his form dips or someone else's form demands it. He's a high quality player at test level, and is in the form of his life, he's not a stopgap player at all.

[Stargazer]

@No-Quarter said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

On the team - very exciting selections in the backline. Looking for big games from both J Savea and Naholo - if they are both given freedom to come off their wings looking for work they will be a real handful.

Very happy with Moala, ALB has more then taken his chances and a rest will do the young man some good to reflect on what he's achieved. Crotty-Moala has a good feel to it. Can't understand the calls for Crotty to be replaced long term, if he keeps playing like he has this year I don't want him replaced until either his form dips or someone else's form demands it. He's a high quality player at test level, and is in the form of his life, he's not a stopgap player at all.

Agree with you 100%. Some people have put a label "not-strong-enough, boring and no x-factor, so he can't replace Nonu at 12" on Crotty, ignoring the fact that

1. he didn't have many caps before he got the 12 jersey in June, so was still developing as an AB,
2. Conrad wasn't that powerful player with x-factor either, but he was solid in other respects, which was crucial for the ABs,
3. the Conrad type player (Hansen sees Crotty as such a player) doesn't have to play at 13, but can also play in the 12 jersey,
4. Crotty has some exceptional skills that are often overlooked, such as a being a great communicator and organiser, solid on defence, being able to run great lines of other players (particularly Beauden) etc etc,
5. We don't need a clone of the Nonu-Conrad combo to have a great midfield; a Crotty + ALB/Moala/Ngatai/Fekitoa/SBW/Rieko* combo might be or become just as good or better. (*just providing the whole list of contenders, regardless of current preferred position),
6. SBW or Ngatai aren't certainties for the 12 jersey when/if they become available for selection. Neither player was an incumbent (Nonu was), so the "nobody loses their spot because of injury" principle shouldn't apply. They will have to prove they are better than all current midfielders, just like any other challenger for the 12/13 spot.

Unfortunately, labels put on people are usually just as hard to remove as labels glued to packaging.

[Rancid Schnitzel]

@kidcalder said in Ireland v NZ - Chicago Showdown:

Look I realise as usual the chances of the Irish having a full 80 against us is medium - but they showed in 2013 that that has improved.
Just think we have had the high of taking the record had a few injuries (best locking pair in the world out) a centre pairing that are solid but not creative...
I think the bench will have to save us from a tough time.

I would tend to agree, but whenever we say "potential banana peel" before an Ireland game it tends to be a blow out, while when a blow out is expected it ends up that last minute heroics are required.

I think they should be right here, but who bloody knows with Ireland.

[mariner4life]

About fucking time! Something to talk about! Thanks Shag

I wonder if the narrow field has resulted in us picking large brown men to run through the Irish, rather than our usual game plan when there is more space? In Savea and Moala we have raw power out wide, while Naholo brings the pace to get through small gaps.

Kaino, Tuipolotu and Squire are all line benders rather than our usual assortment of distance runners. Cane back gives more punch at 7 as well. Then Ofa and Faumauina are again power players. It's a very specific set of selections.

Fekitoa needs to show something on this tour to ensure he retains his spot next year, and he'll be a little nervous that Moala gets first shot at decent minutes.

All in all, i am excited to see what a very different looking AB side brings to the table