Bledisloe 2
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I actually thought it was a good percentage play by Hooper at the end. I would have given them the turnover if I was ref, and he forced Owens to make a decision. That decision was 'I'm giving remedial halfback coaching lessons so I'll give you unlimited seconds and 3 shouted earnings to use it, but not actually make you use it, and penalise the opposition for having the temerity to think my "use it" warning was actually genuine'
@Rapido Rubbish
There is a sanction for a halfback not "using it" and it is independent of the actions of the opposition.
That was about as effective a percentage play as sacrificing a goat on the pitch and hoping to regather possession with 10 seconds remaining.
He tried something that will never work in the hope that it would
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Lot's of ball traveling forward from hands and not called in my myopic viewing. a bizarre one where an AB knocked on a high kick in the 2nd half
Involved both teams but seemed like a few went forward yet never acted on
Not "clear and obvious" I guess
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I'll post here now giving tuppence - in no particular sort of order - before reading the thread.
I expect the general reaction on here is doom and gloom, the All Blacks are hopeless etc etc.
However, personally in the end I really enjoyed that. Even when Beale scored and it looked gone.
It was a pretty one-sided performance really. After the first 20 or so minutes it was 35 - 12. Throw in some questionable TMO decisions and it's even uglier for the West Islanders.
DMac will get deserved shit for his pass. He may as well have been called Izzy on to it. But you're going to get a bit of that with him on attack. I know there are those mumbling about "error free, error fee, error free ..." which kind of makes me feel we'd end up with Michael Collins. I'd be more concerned about his reliability on D and I didn't see too many frailties there apart from the ovious main concern being his height or lack thereof against Folau. Just remember not everyone is Ben Smith.
TMO.
I'll wear the Ben Smith one (even though I had awarded it and took advantage of the break as a comfort stop). One replay did seem to show him loding contact.But what the hell was Nige doing for Brodie's? Are the protocols somehow different to Super Rugby? On field try = clear and obvious reason not to award it. No evidence to the contrary = on field decision stands = try. Weird.
Not greatly fussed about the Genia knock on. To my one eye in looked a knock on but I wonder if that was more in hope than objectivity. Happy with the call that it was not clear and obvious. See more below re "lucky'.
Whilst I had some issues with some of Nige's calls he generally managed to explain them.
I was blowing up about the penalty that Hanigan gave away. But was happy with his explanation that Smith blew that by Genia-ing it forward into him. If he'd actually just passed the ball or had held back ... actually no fuck it. That was wrong. He was offside and prevented a near certain try.
I reckon "near certain" would meet the threshold of "probable".
Get the cameras off Krusty. It's an extremely poor advertisement for the game.
While we're discussing Klownboy. The man is delusional. After match he reckoned Aus "deserved to win". On what basis Michael?
A little more honest self assessment is required from the Wobs. All we heard last week was how they won the second half. This week it was "we deserved to win" after being dominated and getting lucky early.
Message for the Aussies here. You need to be more like NZ: Pessismistic bastards. Never fucking happy with the performance. The reaction to this game will be close to universally negative on the RHS of the ditch, whilst you fellas will talk it up. Consider the result and the record and pause for a bit.
Talking of lucky. How do you score from that scrum? I find it hard to blame Ardie as the 8 were committed to destroying the Wobs so he was occupied and pushing. But hell that'd be gutting for the forwards.
Ardie though was poor missing Genia for his try.
But good and powerful with ball in hand.
And do you think the choice of haka was a trubute to Tree? I thought they might go Kapa o Pango as special recognition. But then I thought it would be appropiriate to do tge one Tree used to do.
More random thoughts when I think of them ...
@booboo
Yeah the Hanigen offside was a wrong decision and looking at a replay in full speed I think wee nugget actually was just finding the fastes way to get the ball to an unmarked ReikoRugby laws of late have demonstrated that you can have the purest of intentions but if you fuck up, you're gone. Henigan had to be yellowed - harsh but true
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Lot's of ball traveling forward from hands and not called in my myopic viewing. a bizarre one where an AB knocked on a high kick in the 2nd half
Involved both teams but seemed like a few went forward yet never acted on
Not "clear and obvious" I guess
@Siam The break that lead to Genias try, BFA was hard done by not to get a t/o as he was being cleared out he had hands on the ball and was dragging Genia along the deck who was clinging for dear life, a few phases later he was up and scoring a great try...
For the most part Owens was good, but he did miss a fair bit, which he seems to do to let it flow, obviously my AB eye patch is he missed a bit more our way, but I expect Aussies will see it the other way.
INteresting moving odds stats from the TAB:
FIRST HALF
Odds at Kickoff: New Zealand $1.04 v Australia $9.001 Minute: New Zealand 0-5 Australia
Israel Folau grabs an intercept and races away for the opening try.
Odds: New Zealand $1.11 v Australia $5.5012 Minutes: New Zealand 0-12 Australia
Michael Hooper finds his way through a gap for the Wallabies second try.
Odds: New Zealand $1.20 v Australia $4.0014 Minutes: New Zealand 0-17 Australia
Bernard Foley scores Australia's thrid try inside the opening 14 minutes.
Odds: New Zealand $1.42 v Australia $2.6021 Minutes: New Zealand 7-17 Australia
The All Blacks finally get on the board courtesy of a Rieko Ioane try.
Odds: New Zealand $1.16 v Australia $4.5040 Minutes: New Zealand 14-17 Australia
Aaron Smith dives over for the All Blacks' second try with the final act of the first half.
Odds: New Zealand $1.11 v Australia $5.50SECOND HALF
60 Minutes: New Zealand 21-17 Australia
The All Blacks finally hit the lead after Beauden Barrett sneaks across the line.
Odds: New Zealand $1.20 v Australia $4.0067 Minutes: New Zealand 21-22 Australia
The Wallabies strike back through Will Genia and re-take the lead.
Odds: New Zealand $1.40 v Australia $2.7072 Minutes: New Zealand 28-22 Australia
The All Blacks string together 22 phases before Ben Smith finds some space to score the home side's fourth try of the night.
Odds: New Zealand $1.07 v Australia $6.75 -
To be honest, the 'oh, just passionate' defence gets me more than a bit pissy. It's insulting to the guys and gals at the highest level who work their guts out to succeed but don't feel the need to carry on like a douchebag.
Passion should not be measured by how many times you say fucking fluffybunny in a coaching box. It's so much more than that - getting up when you get knocked down. Wanting to learn, wanting to improve. Being able to admire greatness in others. Striving for excellence. Mumbling to yourself in the middle of the night because you have an idea and need to talk it through. Failing heaps and still having the drive to get up the next day with a bounce in your step. Loving what you do. -
Not a big deal, but I'm wondering how Owens' performance wasn't the same as a scatty frenchman's appraisal
I mean sure the game flowed and all that but you put a Poite or Garces face on that reffing display and he'd get roasted.
No?
Awarding tries and then changing? bloke stops a certain try and nothing? even the Retallick thing?
still no?
ok fair enough
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Not a big deal, but I'm wondering how Owens' performance wasn't the same as a scatty frenchman's appraisal
I mean sure the game flowed and all that but you put a Poite or Garces face on that reffing display and he'd get roasted.
No?
Awarding tries and then changing? bloke stops a certain try and nothing? even the Retallick thing?
still no?
ok fair enough
@Siam I think his biggest clanger was the awarding of a try and then claiming he had awarded a penalty not a try...watched the replay this morning and he definitely signalled try, he got down and was looking very hard at it before awarding it, only to overturn it.
Was a very bizaare decision by him, in that situation, I think it was clear the ball was grounded, eventually, but I dont think he saw it grounded, but knew it was, then the TMO has maybe said hey bro we should have a wee looksy at this one, no try...
Seen others like BFAs given, although I think this one was correct, on another day I think Foley's try is not given as I reckon there was a touch off the hand of Genia, but last night it was a try.
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Could understand the no Smith try but BBBR was bizzare
Owens seemed to have the best view and awarded it yet went to the TMO
Those sort of groundings are nearly impossible to pick up unless there's a fluke camera angle -
Anyone else think "Matt Todd" when Genia turnstiled Savea?
Nothing really against Ardie but we've been pretty comfortable with a tightish number 7 for a long time now...
@Siam said in Bledisloe 2:
Anyone else think "Matt Todd" when Genia turnstiled Savea?
Nothing really against Ardie but we've been pretty comfortable with a tightish number 7 for a long time now...
I'd put Todd in to start if Cane was ruled out. But on the bench you kind of have to go for flexibility.
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@Siam said in Bledisloe 2:
Anyone else think "Matt Todd" when Genia turnstiled Savea?
Nothing really against Ardie but we've been pretty comfortable with a tightish number 7 for a long time now...
I'd put Todd in to start if Cane was ruled out. But on the bench you kind of have to go for flexibility.
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Blaming the ref gets you nowhere, over enough games it all evens out. At the end of the day the most important thing are the points in the bank. If you don't end the game with more than the opposition you lose.
I respect Hansen for never publicaly criticising the ref, even after the Lions clanger he kept his cool. Refs are human and make mistakes, we all like to look for excuses when things don't go our way.
We are told as kids to always play to the refs whistle whether we like it or not.
I really don't like the message he is sending to young kids watching. The swearing and antics is offensive and should be dealt with by World Rugby IMO.
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Blaming the ref gets you nowhere, over enough games it all evens out. At the end of the day the most important thing are the points in the bank. If you don't end the game with more than the opposition you lose.
I respect Hansen for never publicaly criticising the ref, even after the Lions clanger he kept his cool. Refs are human and make mistakes, we all like to look for excuses when things don't go our way.
We are told as kids to always play to the refs whistle whether we like it or not.
I really don't like the message he is sending to young kids watching. The swearing and antics is offensive and should be dealt with by World Rugby IMO.
@chimoaus Blaming the ref is a cop out
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Not a big deal, but I'm wondering how Owens' performance wasn't the same as a scatty frenchman's appraisal
I mean sure the game flowed and all that but you put a Poite or Garces face on that reffing display and he'd get roasted.
No?
Awarding tries and then changing? bloke stops a certain try and nothing? even the Retallick thing?
still no?
ok fair enough
@Siam said in Bledisloe 2:
Not a big deal, but I'm wondering how Owens' performance wasn't the same as a scatty frenchman's appraisal
I mean sure the game flowed and all that but you put a Poite or Garces face on that reffing display and he'd get roasted.
No?
Awarding tries and then changing? bloke stops a certain try and nothing? even the Retallick thing?
still no?
ok fair enough
Owens didn't actually award that try. He just blew for a penalty and people thought it was a try. Owens has always been a bit weird in the way he awards penalties and sometimes points his arm the other way and then turns around.
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Just watched the game again. DMac made one big mistake which was the intercept pass. He was pretty good otherwise and created the Ben Smith try. Looks like he's going to be one of those players whose errors are going to be magnified by the public. I wouldn't feel comfortable seeing him start a game against a NH team or even SA but he is being unfairly criticised for his two performances against the Wallabies. BB made a lot of blunders as well but nobody is calling him up for them
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@Siam said in Bledisloe 2:
Not a big deal, but I'm wondering how Owens' performance wasn't the same as a scatty frenchman's appraisal
I mean sure the game flowed and all that but you put a Poite or Garces face on that reffing display and he'd get roasted.
No?
Awarding tries and then changing? bloke stops a certain try and nothing? even the Retallick thing?
still no?
ok fair enough
Owens didn't actually award that try. He just blew for a penalty and people thought it was a try. Owens has always been a bit weird in the way he awards penalties and sometimes points his arm the other way and then turns around.
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@Siam said in Bledisloe 2:
Not a big deal, but I'm wondering how Owens' performance wasn't the same as a scatty frenchman's appraisal
I mean sure the game flowed and all that but you put a Poite or Garces face on that reffing display and he'd get roasted.
No?
Awarding tries and then changing? bloke stops a certain try and nothing? even the Retallick thing?
still no?
ok fair enough
Owens didn't actually award that try. He just blew for a penalty and people thought it was a try. Owens has always been a bit weird in the way he awards penalties and sometimes points his arm the other way and then turns around.
@hydro11 dunno, he got down on his knee, blew like a try, pointed to where BBBR has likely grounded it...why did he not say that when the ABs got up congratulating one another on a try, when they were walking back, when BB was lining up he even went back and told him to hold as they were looking at it, not hey BB this is a penalty kick not conversion, why has your team gone to half way, that confident in your boot even when we hadnt taken a single PK in the game, then when he got the TMO to look at it? All evidence points to him awarding a try.
Reckon it was a complete shambles.
