Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz
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@antipodean said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
Coote is baffled: "There I was being careful. It is quite hard slowing from 100km/h to 80km/h.
That's why there's a middle pedal you dumb bitch.
Hard slowing down.....the actual fuck?!?!?
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Perhaps we need a thread for Cretins Who Are Legitimately News
Digging near an oil pipeline. That's not going to end up horrendously expensive for all concerned...
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11923238
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@Donsteppa The head of NZ was on radio this morning and debunks this as fake news
Really good interview for anyone interested. Also clearly explains why there is no back-up pipe
Jet fuel shortage: 'Absolutely sorry' - Refining NZ boss
Fuel supplies to Auckland have been disrupted after a digger working on a farm damaged the pipeline between Auckland Airport and the Marsden Point refinery. Refining New Zealand chief executive Sjoerd Post joins us.
@No-Quarter the 80 km speed limit is to increase the throughput of the tunnel. At 80 kph cars will bunch up more because they will feel safe following a bit closer. As a result even though the journey will take a bit longer for an individual vehicle in any given period more vehicles pass through the tunnel - this was explained to me by a NZTA traffic engineer
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@dogmeat said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
@Donsteppa The head of NZ was on radio this morning and debunks this as fake news
Really good interview for anyone interested. Also clearly explains why there is no back-up pipe
Jet fuel shortage: 'Absolutely sorry' - Refining NZ boss
Fuel supplies to Auckland have been disrupted after a digger working on a farm damaged the pipeline between Auckland Airport and the Marsden Point refinery. Refining New Zealand chief executive Sjoerd Post joins us.
@No-Quarter the 80 km speed limit is to increase the throughput of the tunnel. At 80 kph cars will bunch up more because they will feel safe following a bit closer. As a result even though the journey will take a bit longer for an individual vehicle in any given period more vehicles pass through the tunnel - this was explained to me by a NZTA traffic engineer
""A digger has scraped over it, that's the only fact we have." Anything further is supposition, he says."
Either way, there's still a digger driver in the mix who is causing a lot of financial damage to a number of parties.
I wouldn't expect there to be a backup pipeline. Though the cynic in me would suggest that if the pipeline had affected AIA's nearby property development activities they'd have had about eight back up options as cover, but as it only affects running of the actual airport, they haven't been as bothered
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most digger drivers are likely to only have $1-2,000,000 liability policies too....
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cheers for the link to the CEO. He basically said it's $325M for a duplicate line from Tauranga. Bonds cost 8%, so they have to levy around 10% to make it work, ie $30M a year.
Given the line has operated without incident for 30 years, to secure supplies will be in the order of $900M.
The alternative is a 2 week downtime while it gets fixed -- and there are supply restrictions. For context, he talked about Buncefield in the UK, where Heathrow had years of supply restrictions.
sounds like the kauri log story is fake news. And you wonder why we don't trust media.
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@Donsteppa The Wiri pipeline was built at the same time as, and under the umbrella of the Marsden Point extension in the early 80s. The fact there is no second line can be put down to Piggy Muldoon who defined the scope along with all the other Think Big projects. Probably a good thing he stopped there to be fair, as what he did initiate almost bankrupted the country as it was. Turns out he was equally as good at project management as he was at engineering.
I was in the piping inspection team on the project in the latter parts. Frankly I'm surprised it didn't erupt in a ball of flame the moment it was first used and absolutely amazed it has survived intact till now. The stories I could tell.
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@dogmeat said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
@Donsteppa The head of NZ was on radio this morning and debunks this as fake news
Really good interview for anyone interested. Also clearly explains why there is no back-up pipe
Jet fuel shortage: 'Absolutely sorry' - Refining NZ boss
Fuel supplies to Auckland have been disrupted after a digger working on a farm damaged the pipeline between Auckland Airport and the Marsden Point refinery. Refining New Zealand chief executive Sjoerd Post joins us.
@No-Quarter the 80 km speed limit is to increase the throughput of the tunnel. At 80 kph cars will bunch up more because they will feel safe following a bit closer. As a result even though the journey will take a bit longer for an individual vehicle in any given period more vehicles pass through the tunnel - this was explained to me by a NZTA traffic engineer
I love these "throughput vs slowing individuals down" conundrums, they seem so counter-intuitive until you actually study them. The same principle applies to escalators on Tube stations. Having two columns of people standing on an escalator means greater throughput than a line of people standing on the right leaving the left hand side for people walking. When its busy there are often queues to get onto the right side of the elevator to stand, while the left side is under used.
They actually trialed this at a number of Tube stations once but it caused an absolute shitstorm of impatient people.
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@TeWaio The science (for want of a better word) on traffic throughput, congestion and so on is quite interesting and often counter intuitive. I have a mate that used to be in the local council and got involved in this area and he was full of stuff that at first sight seemed just odd, but on looking into it more it made and odd sort of sense.
A bit like on the M25 outer London orbital motorway, when there is congestion they reduce the speed limit and traffic goes faster.
Somehow.
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@Catogrande said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
@TeWaio The science (for want of a better word) on traffic throughput, congestion and so on is quite interesting and often counter intuitive. I have a mate that used to be in the local council and got involved in this area and he was full of stuff that at first sight seemed just odd, but on looking into it more it made and odd sort of sense.
A bit like on the M25 outer London orbital motorway, when there is congestion they reduce the speed limit and traffic goes faster.
Somehow.
Reminds me of that trial they did in one underground station of telling people to stand on both sides of the escalator. They had studied it and decided that although the left hand side fast lane got some people up more quickly, the total number of people being moved would increase if all gaps were filled.
Consequently the trial failed as there was no ability to fast track for the 25% that do and it just led to pissed off people.
An example of meddling in something that people have worked out for themselves as the 'most approved' over years.
I'm also not sure that the M25 is the best poster-child for traffic management. -
@Crucial I'm told the M25 is an exemplary piece of road. It's the traffic that makes it a crock of shit.
#notfitforpurpose
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@Catogrande said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
@Crucial I'm told the M25 is an exemplary piece of road. It's the traffic that makes it a crock of shit.
#notfitforpurpose
So true.
Have you ever looked out the window of a plane in holding pattern coming into Heathrow and noticed that every single interchange on the M25 looks to have been designed by a different person? It is like they played some internal design contest with a years subscription to Train Spotters Monthly as first prize and a packet of chocolate biscuits as a consolation prizes for 'most confusing' and 'least effective'
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I thought traffic and congestion management was well understood and accepted these days? Less speed means less gaps, which means more cars can use the road which creates greater throughput.
The greatest difficulty and something a lot of people appear to forget when complaining about road design is traffic increases to the capacity of the route. Build more lanes; more cars use it. Then you find another choke point...
And very few roads should ever be designed for peak hour capacity simply because of the enormous cost.
Brisbane is a city that has experienced enormous growing pains over the last two decades and the ability to get from one side to the other is hamstrung because of how few bridges there are for a river city. Try explaining to people that more bridges would mean more paths, with less congestion on what have developed to be the major (and only) routes.
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@taniwharugby said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
the world is gonna end...again!!
Shit, I hate it when that happens.
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@taniwharugby Day of: Virgin panic. Day after: Regrets, ER treating a fuckton of arm wounds that suspiciously match the patient's teeth.
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@crucial said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
@Catogrande said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
@TeWaio The science (for want of a better word) on traffic throughput, congestion and so on is quite interesting and often counter intuitive. I have a mate that used to be in the local council and got involved in this area and he was full of stuff that at first sight seemed just odd, but on looking into it more it made and odd sort of sense.
A bit like on the M25 outer London orbital motorway, when there is congestion they reduce the speed limit and traffic goes faster.
Somehow.
Reminds me of that trial they did in one underground station of telling people to stand on both sides of the escalator. They had studied it and decided that although the left hand side fast lane got some people up more quickly, the total number of people being moved would increase if all gaps were filled.
Consequently the trial failed as there was no ability to fast track for the 25% that do and it just led to pissed off people.
An example of meddling in something that people have worked out for themselves as the 'most approved' over years.
I'm also not sure that the M25 is the best poster-child for traffic management.Haha, is there an echo in here?!
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@antipodean said in Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz:
I thought traffic and congestion management was well understood and accepted these days? Less speed means less gaps, which means more cars can use the road which creates greater throughput.
The theory is fine if everyone travels at the same speed and don't leave big unnecessary gaps. As soon as you have a slow driver or big gapper everyone tries to get around them with lane changes into a 'full' lane which does that bounce effect and about 1km back the lane comes to a halt.
