Aussie Pro Rugby
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@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
Or they just keep their out of touch opinions to themselves?
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@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
Folau is entitled to his own beliefs but he clearly choses to put his head above the parapet, same as the not as big in real life Pocock. They both get derision for it and so be it. Folau should have just ignored the guy and not try to give him "guidance" (that bit almost made me spit out my coffee from laughter).
I also find it odd that he still talks about only ever wanting to play NRL yet he's still in rugby.
I like the Players Voice site, there's been some interesting reads on there.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
Folau is entitled to his own beliefs but he clearly choses to put his head above the parapet, same as the not as big in real life Pocock. They both get derision for it and so be it. Folau should have just ignored the guy and not try to give him "guidance" (that bit almost made me spit out my coffee from laughter).
I also find it odd that he still talks about only ever wanting to play NRL yet he's still in rugby.
I like the Players Voice site, there's been some interesting reads on there.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
Or they just keep their out of touch opinions to themselves?
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
Or they just keep their out of touch opinions to themselves?
Perhaps to them, their opinions aren't out of touch. Just because you might not like what they have to say, doesn't mean they should be silenced.
@nepia said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Folau is entitled to his own beliefs but he clearly choses to put his head above the parapet, same as the not as big in real life Pocock. They both get derision for it and so be it.
I'm not saying Folau should be exempt from criticism - I'm just the person who says while he's not disparaging his employer, sponsors etc. and isn't doing anything illegal, he's allowed to say what he wants.
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Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
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Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
If Izzy thinks i am giving up mudcrab, prawns, and moreton bay bugs, he is so very very much mistaken
#chillicrab4life
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Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
Yup, just need to let it blow over. The outrage mob will move on before long and it will be a distant memory. Just gotta stop fanning the flames.
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
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Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
As an atheist, I've never understood that line of argument: You believe this, therefore you have to believe it all. Seems to be a good example of the no true Scotsman fallacy.
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@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
As an atheist, I've never understood that line of argument: You believe this, therefore you have to believe it all. Seems to be a good example of the no true Scotsman fallacy.
@antipodean I think it comes down to people picking and choosing the bits they like, and feeling they're superior for doing it.
@no-quarter said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
So we can now move away from the religious angle and get on with the rugby talk. Fully aware that I was part of it, but I've finished, so the rest of you can move on with me
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@antipodean I think it comes down to people picking and choosing the bits they like, and feeling they're superior for doing it.
@no-quarter said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
So we can now move away from the religious angle and get on with the rugby talk. Fully aware that I was part of it, but I've finished, so the rest of you can move on with me
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean I think it comes down to people picking and choosing the bits they like, and feeling they're superior for doing it.
Without wanting to get into a detailed theological discussion, throwing passages from Leviticus around doesn't help much.
Plenty of stuff in the Old Testament that is widely ignored, or used more as a historical context rather than any sort of guidebook for life.
Folau probably needs to spin his way into the new-age Christian, the 'God loves all children' model where the gays, Muslims and adulterers all receive the love of Christ whether they want it or not.
I'm not sure he's smart enough for that sadly.
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@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@antipodean said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@crucial said in Aussie Rugby in general:
It is in his contract though. But then, back to the reality (as @dogmeat @MajorRage lays out) where his services are deemed more important than their rules.
As to your second point, you are free to say what you want but you must take the consequences of that against your contract.I haven't seen his contract, so I'll defer to your knowledge. But my opinion on the baroader matter isn't changed.
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Must be cool having your highest profile and best player from the age of stoning adulterers and drowning witches.
cough, Michael Jones...
Cough, Sir Michael Jones...
A lot of religious rugby players out there, can’t recall any with the archaic beliefs that Falou keeps putting out there
Perhaps some of them haven't been asked on social media. Or someone hasn't taken offence and made an issue of it?
Or they just keep their out of touch opinions to themselves?
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Or they just keep their out of touch opinions to themselves?
Given the number of Polynesian players in Aussie rugby (and Kiwi rugby for that matter), I think you'd be surprised how many people agree with Izzy. He's had some support from current players on social media.
It's a real risk for the ARU, because if they are perceived to be anti-Christian then there could be big consequences for the retention of Islander players at all levels.
As Nick would know, while they can sometimes be hard to deal with (organisationally) you can't deny how important those communities are to the grassroots of the game.
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I’ve been around a lot of religious types, grown up with best mates that are Christian, worked and flatted with a few too.
Biggest thing I can take away from my experiences is most of them are the biggest hypocrites and nut bars you will come across.
One was a flat who wouldn’t let her son watch Harry Potter because it encoraged witch craft, yet she was happy to piss it up and bring the odd guy home..I wonder how many of Gods laws Izzy is happy to break while condemning gays.
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Just to take the discussion back to the demise of rugby in Australia.
Country rugby in Queensland continues its slow death. It's not too long since the Country championship in Qld saw the rep sides from the different regions play each other to find the best in the State. A Qld Country team was then selected from that. It was great, between 6 & 8 games a year, with away trips every other weekend.
The funding for that dried up (via the disaster when they got the Brisbane Prem sides involved, and we copped some absolute floggings) and it is now reduced to the point where inside the 3 major regions (North/Central/South Qld) the sides play each other over the course of a weekend, to select a regional rep side. So local players play at most 3 rep games, the better players get a couple more.
North Queensland was supposed to have their 'tournament" in Mackay this year. They have since pulled out. They couldn't put together a rep side to play in their own back yard. That's pretty fucking damning
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In further evidence of the decline, Brothers had a 37 year old make his club debut running around for them in premier grade last weekend.
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@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
Yup, just need to let it blow over. The outrage mob will move on before long and it will be a distant memory. Just gotta stop fanning the flames.
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
@no-quarter said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
Yup, just need to let it blow over. The outrage mob will move on before long and it will be a distant memory. Just gotta stop fanning the flames.
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
So he's choosing to hate the gays then!
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@no-quarter said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
Yup, just need to let it blow over. The outrage mob will move on before long and it will be a distant memory. Just gotta stop fanning the flames.
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
So he's choosing to hate the gays then!
@nepia said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@no-quarter said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
Yup, just need to let it blow over. The outrage mob will move on before long and it will be a distant memory. Just gotta stop fanning the flames.
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
So he's choosing to hate the gays then!
It's a bit more nuanced than that. Paul of Tarsus' theology was that the kosher and other rules of the old testament don't apply to Christians anymore, so they don't need to apply them. However there is arguably reference to homosexuality as sinful in the new testament as well. Therefore he would say he is justified in his position on both gays and shellfish (and tattoos).
More to the point, I suspect Israel pays more attention to what his pastors tell than what is actually in the bible. It's undeniable that a lot of modern day churches have a problem with homosexuality, so all he's doing is reflecting that position.
Note that I am an atheist, so am not defending folou, just trying to put his position in context.
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@nepia said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@no-quarter said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
Yup, just need to let it blow over. The outrage mob will move on before long and it will be a distant memory. Just gotta stop fanning the flames.
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
So he's choosing to hate the gays then!
It's a bit more nuanced than that. Paul of Tarsus' theology was that the kosher and other rules of the old testament don't apply to Christians anymore, so they don't need to apply them. However there is arguably reference to homosexuality as sinful in the new testament as well. Therefore he would say he is justified in his position on both gays and shellfish (and tattoos).
More to the point, I suspect Israel pays more attention to what his pastors tell than what is actually in the bible. It's undeniable that a lot of modern day churches have a problem with homosexuality, so all he's doing is reflecting that position.
Note that I am an atheist, so am not defending folou, just trying to put his position in context.
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@nepia said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@no-quarter said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@nta said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Behold the TRUTH according to the word of the LORD as handed down in the BIBLE:
Leviticus 11:9-12 King James Version (KJV) 9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat. 10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you: 11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination. 12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.So does Israel like him a bit of crustacean?
Yes, the bible is ridiculous. But if he wants to believe in it, then he has to take the whole lot at face value.
I think it has been blown out of proportion at this point. Everyone might just do better to shut up and rugby.
Yup, just need to let it blow over. The outrage mob will move on before long and it will be a distant memory. Just gotta stop fanning the flames.
Also, there is not a single religious person of any faith that takes all of their holy books at face value, namely because their holy books are full of contradictions.
So he's choosing to hate the gays then!
It's a bit more nuanced than that. Paul of Tarsus' theology was that the kosher and other rules of the old testament don't apply to Christians anymore, so they don't need to apply them. However there is arguably reference to homosexuality as sinful in the new testament as well. Therefore he would say he is justified in his position on both gays and shellfish (and tattoos).
More to the point, I suspect Israel pays more attention to what his pastors tell than what is actually in the bible. It's undeniable that a lot of modern day churches have a problem with homosexuality, so all he's doing is reflecting that position.
Note that I am an atheist, so am not defending folou, just trying to put his position in context.
@damo said in Aussie Rugby in general:
More to the point, I suspect Israel pays more attention to what his pastors tell than what is actually in the bible. It's undeniable that a lot of modern day churches have a problem with homosexuality, so all he's doing is reflecting that position.
At least Israel quoted a few New Testament verses that back his position pretty clearly.
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@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Or they just keep their out of touch opinions to themselves?
Given the number of Polynesian players in Aussie rugby (and Kiwi rugby for that matter), I think you'd be surprised how many people agree with Izzy. He's had some support from current players on social media.
It's a real risk for the ARU, because if they are perceived to be anti-Christian then there could be big consequences for the retention of Islander players at all levels.
As Nick would know, while they can sometimes be hard to deal with (organisationally) you can't deny how important those communities are to the grassroots of the game.
@barbarian said in Aussie Rugby in general:
@virgil said in Aussie Rugby in general:
Or they just keep their out of touch opinions to themselves?
Given the number of Polynesian players in Aussie rugby (and Kiwi rugby for that matter), I think you'd be surprised how many people agree with Izzy. He's had some support from current players on social media.
It's a real risk for the ARU, because if they are perceived to be anti-Christian then there could be big consequences for the retention of Islander players at all levels.
As Nick would know, while they can sometimes be hard to deal with (organisationally) you can't deny how important those communities are to the grassroots of the game.
That's assuming they all belong to the same church, read the same version of the bible, have had the same upbringing and, therefore, believe in the same interpretation of the scriptures. This quote is from Digby Ioane (published in the Daily Telegraph), who doesn't agree with Folau:
I don't care what people say, the God i grew up with loves everyone, no matter who you are. He made you the way you are with one mission only: LOVE. Don't let anyone tell you you are not worth it, believe me, you are worth [it] to God.What bothers me most about Folau's public expressions is not the content of them (although I strongly disagree with him), but the impact they may have on young gay - particularly, Polynesion - persons, who are still struggling with their sexuality. Whatever you think of MP Louisa Wall, I think she hits the nail on the head here:
Speaking to 1 NEWS today, Wall made it clear that Folau's comments should not be taken lightly, adding that they are dangerous given the fullback's stature within Australian sport. "He doesn't really realise that what he's said literally means to a gay person that there's something wrong with you, and you should suffer for the rest of your life unless you repent," she said. "He needs to reflect on his role as a public figure, and what he says and how it influences, particularly young people. "I'm sure he'd be distressed to know his comments can kill, and they kill because young people feel despair because (they feel) there's something wrong with them, and they should take their own lives.Also, I don't think his homophobic tweets/article qualifies as hate speech, and he legally has the right to say them (unless his contract says otherwise), but he may need to be reminded that sometimes it's better not to say things publically because they may actually harm others (vulnerable people who look up to him and believe what he says as the truth). I wonder whether such things are discussed when new players get media training?
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@damo said in Aussie Rugby in general:
More to the point, I suspect Israel pays more attention to what his pastors tell than what is actually in the bible. It's undeniable that a lot of modern day churches have a problem with homosexuality, so all he's doing is reflecting that position.
At least Israel quoted a few New Testament verses that back his position pretty clearly.
@barbarian For each quote, there is another translation or interpretation.
