The Semenya Rule
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People overthink these things.
Was she born a woman? Yes. She's a woman. Has she taken any performance enhancing drugs? No. Let her compete.
News flash people ... not everybody has the natural attributes to be world champions. Every single world record holder, multiple champion, is undoubtedly a freak of nature born with some luck on their side - be it physical attributes, naturally high levels of whatever chemical or pinpoint hand eye co ordination.
If she ain't cheating just bloody deal with it that she got lucky. I bet she trains just has hard as anybody else and is deserving of whatever she wins.
@majorrage 100% agree with this. It's like saying Bolt shouldn't compete with male sprinters as he has long legs AND fast turnover, whereas its normal to only have one or the other.
Semanya should not be conflated with transgender athletes, two different issues.
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Why do we even have handicapped sporting events? An antiquated 19th Century mystery to me. I’m all for equality, and I don’t like restrictions based on gender, NOT EVER, not under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, so let’s make athletic events Open — and I mean, truly OPEN — to everybody — EVERY-BODY — every race, every sex, and all 57 genders. And if that means for the time-being that women get underrepresented in some events, like at the Olympic Games, then tough-titties baby, you wanted equality, you got it. They’ll just have to train harder to qualify, or find something else to do. It’s the right thing. Zero discrimination. Each by their own merit. TRUE athletic competition. Of course, the sheilas will still dominate ultra-long distance swimming events, because they have physical advantages, just like they can have babies, whereas men, regardless of what “Loretta” thinks about the “right to have a baby,” men just can’t do it.
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@mn5 41 and done aye!!
@paekakboyz don't think this is a recent thing for him...although given this is the internet and I have never met @MN5 I probably shouldn't assume gender.
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@paekakboyz don't think this is a recent thing for him...although given this is the internet and I have never met @MN5 I probably shouldn't assume gender.
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@paekakboyz don't think this is a recent thing for him...although given this is the internet and I have never met @MN5 I probably shouldn't assume gender.
Thanks, I'll get offended just in case though.
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@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@paekakboyz don't think this is a recent thing for him...although given this is the internet and I have never met @MN5 I probably shouldn't assume gender.
Thanks, I'll get offended just in case though.
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
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@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
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@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
@godder said in The Semenya Rule:
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
The horses or the people? What gender horse dominates? And do any horses identify as non-binary? This could open a big can of worms in the horse racing industry.
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@godder said in The Semenya Rule:
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
The horses or the people? What gender horse dominates? And do any horses identify as non-binary? This could open a big can of worms in the horse racing industry.
@no-quarter said in The Semenya Rule:
@godder said in The Semenya Rule:
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
The horses or the people? What gender horse dominates? And do any horses identify as non-binary? This could open a big can of worms in the horse racing industry.
The sky is falling!
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Why do we even have handicapped sporting events? An antiquated 19th Century mystery to me. I’m all for equality, and I don’t like restrictions based on gender, NOT EVER, not under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, so let’s make athletic events Open — and I mean, truly OPEN — to everybody — EVERY-BODY — every race, every sex, and all 57 genders. And if that means for the time-being that women get underrepresented in some events, like at the Olympic Games, then tough-titties baby, you wanted equality, you got it. They’ll just have to train harder to qualify, or find something else to do. It’s the right thing. Zero discrimination. Each by their own merit. TRUE athletic competition. Of course, the sheilas will still dominate ultra-long distance swimming events, because they have physical advantages, just like they can have babies, whereas men, regardless of what “Loretta” thinks about the “right to have a baby,” men just can’t do it.
@salacious-crumb said in The Semenya Rule:
Why do we even have handicapped sporting events? An antiquated 19th Century mystery to me. I’m all for equality, and I don’t like restrictions based on gender, NOT EVER, not under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, so let’s make athletic events Open — and I mean, truly OPEN — to everybody — EVERY-BODY — every race, every sex, and all 57 genders. And if that means for the time-being that women get underrepresented in some events, like at the Olympic Games, then tough-titties baby, you wanted equality, you got it. They’ll just have to train harder to qualify, or find something else to do. It’s the right thing. Zero discrimination. Each by their own merit. TRUE athletic competition. Of course, the sheilas will still dominate ultra-long distance swimming events, because they have physical advantages, just like they can have babies, whereas men, regardless of what “Loretta” thinks about the “right to have a baby,” men just can’t do it.
No handicap events?
Just in case this is actually what you think, and not a Poe.
No age handicaps? No weight handicaps?
All adult rugby is open grade -- no President's grade and no Colts. Schools can play a 20-year-old provided he is enrolled?
All weightlifting, boxing etc is open grade?
Or are you happy with small men being allowed their own events? Just not women.
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@godder said in The Semenya Rule:
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
The horses or the people? What gender horse dominates? And do any horses identify as non-binary? This could open a big can of worms in the horse racing industry.
@no-quarter said in The Semenya Rule:
@godder said in The Semenya Rule:
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
The horses or the people? What gender horse dominates? And do any horses identify as non-binary? This could open a big can of worms in the horse racing industry.
Yeah and what about the para-events? At the very least I expect to see a horse with a wheel on it or something.
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@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
@godder said in The Semenya Rule:
@taniwharugby said in The Semenya Rule:
@mn5 at which part, or just offended in general, at me, the internet?
Surely all of the above - isn't that what we do on the internet?
Is equestrian (and horse racing) reasonably evenly matched between men and women?
I don't know about horse racing (I think there is aa arguable strength element) but in show jumping and eventing there is no issue with one gender having an advantage. In eventing there used to be a slight advantage due to the old 'roads and tracks' phase (with has now disappeared). Top male riders would sometimes get fit enough to run alongside their mounts and save 'wear and tear' on the horse. It was never a biggie though as can be noticed by heavy smokers such as Toddy.
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Can't remember which other thread we are talking about this in...
Transgender athletes get places 1 and 2 in sprint race
Caught this from a reddit thread and in the comments they were talking about the transgender MMA fighter Fallon Fox, who actually got beaten (via choke hold) by a more talented female fighter. But that was after s/he'd smashed a bunch of less technically talented female fighters. So the extra strength was enough to beat down on 'lesser' fighters, but once someone skilled came along it was nite nite.
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Can't remember which other thread we are talking about this in...
Transgender athletes get places 1 and 2 in sprint race
Caught this from a reddit thread and in the comments they were talking about the transgender MMA fighter Fallon Fox, who actually got beaten (via choke hold) by a more talented female fighter. But that was after s/he'd smashed a bunch of less technically talented female fighters. So the extra strength was enough to beat down on 'lesser' fighters, but once someone skilled came along it was nite nite.
@Paekakboyz said in The Semenya Rule:
Can't remember which other thread we are talking about this in...
Transgender athletes get places 1 and 2 in sprint race
Caught this from a reddit thread and in the comments they were talking about the transgender MMA fighter Fallon Fox, who actually got beaten (via choke hold) by a more talented female fighter. But that was after s/he'd smashed a bunch of less technically talented female fighters. So the extra strength was enough to beat down on 'lesser' fighters, but once someone skilled came along it was nite nite.
It's the old rule isn't it -
skill is better than size, but size and skill is damn near unbeatable
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@Paekakboyz said in The Semenya Rule:
Can't remember which other thread we are talking about this in...
Transgender athletes get places 1 and 2 in sprint race
Caught this from a reddit thread and in the comments they were talking about the transgender MMA fighter Fallon Fox, who actually got beaten (via choke hold) by a more talented female fighter. But that was after s/he'd smashed a bunch of less technically talented female fighters. So the extra strength was enough to beat down on 'lesser' fighters, but once someone skilled came along it was nite nite.
It's the old rule isn't it -
skill is better than size, but size and skill is damn near unbeatable@nzzp I have lived or storied if we go by BSG tags
experience of this. I played reserve grade rugby in wellington and we had a couple of really good seasons. Enough so that our coach decided to put us up a grade the following season, without much consultation... at least that's how I remember it. I was playing front row and while we did front up against bigger front rows the skills were pretty much on par.But that next grade up? fuck me. Packing down against guys at least 20-30kg heavier, who had often played at least a bit in prems, and were only playing the current grade due to not wanting to train harder, or from other commitments. Had two rib injuries that year, and one scrum I will never forget where my neck was screaming due to the pressure. Scary shit!
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@nzzp I have lived or storied if we go by BSG tags
experience of this. I played reserve grade rugby in wellington and we had a couple of really good seasons. Enough so that our coach decided to put us up a grade the following season, without much consultation... at least that's how I remember it. I was playing front row and while we did front up against bigger front rows the skills were pretty much on par.But that next grade up? fuck me. Packing down against guys at least 20-30kg heavier, who had often played at least a bit in prems, and were only playing the current grade due to not wanting to train harder, or from other commitments. Had two rib injuries that year, and one scrum I will never forget where my neck was screaming due to the pressure. Scary shit!
@Paekakboyz said in The Semenya Rule:
@nzzp I have lived or storied if we go by BSG tags
experience of this. I played reserve grade rugby in wellington and we had a couple of really good seasons. Enough so that our coach decided to put us up a grade the following season, without much consultation... at least that's how I remember it. I was playing front row and while we did front up against bigger front rows the skills were pretty much on par.But that next grade up? fuck me. Packing down against guys at least 20-30kg heavier, who had often played at least a bit in prems, and were only playing the current grade due to not wanting to train harder, or from other commitments. Had two rib injuries that year, and one scrum I will never forget where my neck was screaming due to the pressure. Scary shit!
It's so shit when you pop your head above your ceiling. I've had a few humbling experiences that brought back the stark reality of how untalented and physically limited i really was.
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I've always thought rugby follows the axiom that a good big man will always beat a good little man.
As us little blokes found out the hard way in the 80s and 90s when more PI kids took up rugby@Siam said in The Semenya Rule:
I've always thought rugby follows the axiom that a good big man will always beat a good little man.
As us little blokes found out the hard way in the 80s and 90s when more PI kids took up rugbyabsolutely. You have to be quick, strong, or smart.
And smart will only get you so far.
As a quick aside, now that it's off season, the NFL Instagram has been showing video of the Draft Combine performances of some of the stars. Jesus the level of athletic ability is just amazing.
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@rembrandt said in The Semenya Rule:
@toddy said in The Semenya Rule:
@mooshld said in The Semenya Rule:
@tordah said in The Semenya Rule:
as men are of course outperforming women in every sport (weirdly, bar long distance swimming, or so I read somewhere).
Ultra running as well. Once you go over 150kms gender is very much less relevant.
Is that true? A quick Google of ultra running distances (100miles) has men well ahead of women. The fastest man running 100miles on a track is over 2 hours quicker than the best female.
Even looking at 24 - 48 hour races have the best men covering a lot more distance than the females.
Yeah it was one of those convincing claims in that very popular book "born to run". I think there were a few claims that weren't exactly true.
Check out what Courtney Dauwalter did in the Maub 240. On a race by race basis you get woman winning a lot more frequently then you would if you looked at shorter distances. I didn't say its a 50 50 but like I said gender is less of an issue and you do sometimes get woman winning outright.
@mooshld said in The Semenya Rule:
@rembrandt said in The Semenya Rule:
@toddy said in The Semenya Rule:
@mooshld said in The Semenya Rule:
@tordah said in The Semenya Rule:
as men are of course outperforming women in every sport (weirdly, bar long distance swimming, or so I read somewhere).
Ultra running as well. Once you go over 150kms gender is very much less relevant.
Is that true? A quick Google of ultra running distances (100miles) has men well ahead of women. The fastest man running 100miles on a track is over 2 hours quicker than the best female.
Even looking at 24 - 48 hour races have the best men covering a lot more distance than the females.
Yeah it was one of those convincing claims in that very popular book "born to run". I think there were a few claims that weren't exactly true.
Check out what Courtney Dauwalter did in the Maub 240. On a race by race basis you get woman winning a lot more frequently then you would if you looked at shorter distances. I didn't say its a 50 50 but like I said gender is less of an issue and you do sometimes get woman winning outright.
She’s a freak athlete, I remember heariNg there was an hour or more between her and the next runner.
I’m not sure I buy everything in Born to run but he’s a great writer imho .
