Bledisloe II
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I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
As stated earlier I hope JB and BFA swap around a bit to get Ben in a good position to observe and direct.@crucial said in Bledisloe II:
I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
Seems to me they've had a desire to develop players at 12 & 13 since the Nonu/Smith departure 3 years ago - and we still don't have a settled, reliable midfield combination.
Big worry IMHO.
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@crucial said in Bledisloe II:
I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
Seems to me they've had a desire to develop players at 12 & 13 since the Nonu/Smith departure 3 years ago - and we still don't have a settled, reliable midfield combination.
Big worry IMHO.
@victor-meldrew said in Bledisloe II:
@crucial said in Bledisloe II:
I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
Seems to me they've had a desire to develop players at 12 & 13 since the Nonu/Smith departure 3 years ago - and we still don't have a settled, reliable midfield combination.
Big worry IMHO.
I'd disagree with that. I think Crotty & SBW are clearly the desired first team combination. It's just that both are made of glass and that option isn't available to us as often as we'd like.
Goodhue looked fine last week, ALB has also been good, and now Laumape is given another shot.
For me, it's a long way down our list of worries. I'd have blind side, aging of Ben Smith, inability of our props to keep their fists to themselves, Beauden Barret to kick goals and Naholo to avoid yellow card brain farts all as worries far above and beyond our centres.
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@bovidae I seem to remember the ABs actually making presentations to centurions in the opposition ranks after tests? Here was one time anyway: https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11324575
@beardie said in Bledisloe II:
@bovidae I seem to remember the ABs actually making presentations to centurions in the opposition ranks after tests?
Yes, they showed that on the TV news tonight. I'm talking about whether all the opposition stayed on the field for the presentation to the other AB centurions. It was great that the ABs did acknowledge JdV but I'm not sure they have done that on every previous occasion. George Smith and Adam Ashley-Cooper also played their 100th tests against NZ.
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@bovidae said in Bledisloe II:
Laumape was kept quiet in the 3rd Lions test so an organised defence can negate his runs. He'll be running down Beale's channel a lot.
All of the AB backs were kept quiet against the Lions, though I remember him making a break or two in the third test so not completely contained. He also wrecked havoc against their B team which is why he was selected for the 3rd test.
His form hasn't been great this year, I was really hoping he'd develop his game further, but he is very far from one-dimensional. In his 2nd Super season he displayed all the skills - hard running, deft chips and a great passing game putting the likes of Aso away on a regular basis. Hence the comparisons with Nonu.
I do think ALB deserves the starting spot given his form this year, but this isn't the most controversial selection - Laumape has the goods and if the AB coaches think they can get the best out of him then he will be a force to be reckoned with.
@no-quarter said in Bledisloe II:
@bovidae said in Bledisloe II:
Laumape was kept quiet in the 3rd Lions test so an organised defence can negate his runs. He'll be running down Beale's channel a lot.
All of the AB backs were kept quiet against the Lions, though I remember him making a break or two in the third test so not completely contained. He also wrecked havoc against their B team which is why he was selected for the 3rd test.
There weren't many other options available come the 3rd test. Crotty was injured (sound familiar?), SBW was suspended and BFA was also injured. Fekitoa was on the outer but made the bench. So Laumape and ALB it was.
I'm interested to see what Laumape can do. He has a familiar face at 1st 5 so that combination won't be a problem but he hasn't played with Goodhue before.
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@beardie said in Bledisloe II:
@bovidae I seem to remember the ABs actually making presentations to centurions in the opposition ranks after tests?
Yes, they showed that on the TV news tonight. I'm talking about whether all the opposition stayed on the field for the presentation to the other AB centurions. It was great that the ABs did acknowledge JdV but I'm not sure they have done that on every previous occasion. George Smith and Adam Ashley-Cooper also played their 100th tests against NZ.
@bovidae said in Bledisloe II:
@beardie said in Bledisloe II:
@bovidae I seem to remember the ABs actually making presentations to centurions in the opposition ranks after tests?
Yes, they showed that on the TV news tonight. I'm talking about whether all the opposition stayed on the field for the presentation to the other AB centurions. It was great that the ABs did acknowledge JdV but I'm not sure they have done that on every previous occasion. George Smith and Adam Ashley-Cooper also played their 100th tests against NZ.
Bollox, I remember the AAC match (He's one of my fave Ozzie players) and the ABs mentioned him often in the build up. I can't find a Gregan image but ABs are all about respect - and smashing those respected blokes into the turf!
EDIT: Gregan played his hundy vs the Boks, that's why no image.
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@victor-meldrew said in Bledisloe II:
@crucial said in Bledisloe II:
I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
Seems to me they've had a desire to develop players at 12 & 13 since the Nonu/Smith departure 3 years ago - and we still don't have a settled, reliable midfield combination.
Big worry IMHO.
I'd disagree with that. I think Crotty & SBW are clearly the desired first team combination. It's just that both are made of glass and that option isn't available to us as often as we'd like.
Goodhue looked fine last week, ALB has also been good, and now Laumape is given another shot.
For me, it's a long way down our list of worries. I'd have blind side, aging of Ben Smith, inability of our props to keep their fists to themselves, Beauden Barret to kick goals and Naholo to avoid yellow card brain farts all as worries far above and beyond our centres.
@majorrage said in Bledisloe II:
@victor-meldrew said in Bledisloe II:
@crucial said in Bledisloe II:
I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
Seems to me they've had a desire to develop players at 12 & 13 since the Nonu/Smith departure 3 years ago - and we still don't have a settled, reliable midfield combination.
Big worry IMHO.
I'd disagree with that. I think Crotty & SBW are clearly the desired first team combination. It's just that both are made of glass and that option isn't available to us as often as we'd like.
Goodhue looked fine last week, ALB has also been good, and now Laumape is given another shot.
For me, it's a long way down our list of worries. I'd have blind side, aging of Ben Smith, inability of our props to keep their fists to themselves, Beauden Barret to kick goals and Naholo to avoid yellow card brain farts all as worries far above and beyond our centres.
I think if you asked Hansen, he'd say that SBW and Crotty are our No. 1 combination, but I'm not sure that's what he'd be completely thinking.
Goodhue is "The way of the future" and I reckon they'll try pairing him with various combinations. By the time RWC comes around, I'll be surprised if he's not the starting centre for the big games - if he's not, he will be shortly after.
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It's funny when these disrespect things come up every now and then, I am basically looking all this rugby thing from the outside to in and for me it looks that the All Blacks are the side that most respect their opponents. Of course when you win everything for a decade people are going to look for any flaws in you, but disrespecting their opponents isn't one of them.
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@majorrage said in Bledisloe II:
@victor-meldrew said in Bledisloe II:
@crucial said in Bledisloe II:
I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
Seems to me they've had a desire to develop players at 12 & 13 since the Nonu/Smith departure 3 years ago - and we still don't have a settled, reliable midfield combination.
Big worry IMHO.
I'd disagree with that. I think Crotty & SBW are clearly the desired first team combination. It's just that both are made of glass and that option isn't available to us as often as we'd like.
Goodhue looked fine last week, ALB has also been good, and now Laumape is given another shot.
For me, it's a long way down our list of worries. I'd have blind side, aging of Ben Smith, inability of our props to keep their fists to themselves, Beauden Barret to kick goals and Naholo to avoid yellow card brain farts all as worries far above and beyond our centres.
I think if you asked Hansen, he'd say that SBW and Crotty are our No. 1 combination, but I'm not sure that's what he'd be completely thinking.
Goodhue is "The way of the future" and I reckon they'll try pairing him with various combinations. By the time RWC comes around, I'll be surprised if he's not the starting centre for the big games - if he's not, he will be shortly after.
@chris-b 100% agree in regards to Goodhue. He reminds me so much of Conrad Smith. He reads the game brilliantly, manages to snake his way through defenses minus super speed and has a cool and calm demeanor that allows our outsides to flourish. Now to find that Nonu-esque player to partner him for the next 10 years.
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The powers at be may not agree but I can see Jordie as out long term 12. He could be devastating with his size and skillset crashing into the line and could be a great partner with Goodhue and to whoever that 1st five may be after the world cup - most probably Mo'unga, unless Beaudy sticks around.
More of this please.
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It's funny when these disrespect things come up every now and then, I am basically looking all this rugby thing from the outside to in and for me it looks that the All Blacks are the side that most respect their opponents. Of course when you win everything for a decade people are going to look for any flaws in you, but disrespecting their opponents isn't one of them.
@sapetyvi Yeah Nonu even gave John Smit his boot on his 100th test!
Three All Blacks even spoke on the field afterwards, and obviously the whole team and crew were there to show their respect.
"Three of the more experienced All Blacks - the captain Richie McCaw, lock Brad Thorn and hooker Keven Mealamu - spoke of how they felt for Smit and the immense "disappointment" he must have felt after losing such a huge game in such a desperate way.'
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Few thoughts:
With Laumape attached to squad, was it always a thought to give him a run in second game?
Crotty and ALB are very skilful, but not effective crash ballers. AB backs were ineffective off set piece in BC1 and Laumape allows them to try a different approach.
Defences often tighter in first 60, which could argue for crash baller. When things loosen up, a player like ALB, with good footwork and tactical awareness, is ideal to come on.
Goodhue seems to have an old fashioned centre's approach of keeping straight, maintaining space for winger, and drawing the man before passing. Sure he'd make a go of 12, but his skills at 13 seem rare nowadays, so a shame to waste them.
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Good to see the gloves come off a bit this week.
@kiwimurph said in Bledisloe II:
Good to see the gloves come off a bit this week.
All Black locks should marry tall women in order to have tall children who would later grow enough to become AB locks.
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@victor-meldrew said in Bledisloe II:
@crucial said in Bledisloe II:
I did think they may go ALB on the bench as a known quality with versatility and a desire to develop Laumape.
Seems to me they've had a desire to develop players at 12 & 13 since the Nonu/Smith departure 3 years ago - and we still don't have a settled, reliable midfield combination.
Big worry IMHO.
I'd disagree with that. I think Crotty & SBW are clearly the desired first team combination. It's just that both are made of glass and that option isn't available to us as often as we'd like.
Goodhue looked fine last week, ALB has also been good, and now Laumape is given another shot.
For me, it's a long way down our list of worries. I'd have blind side, aging of Ben Smith, inability of our props to keep their fists to themselves, Beauden Barret to kick goals and Naholo to avoid yellow card brain farts all as worries far above and beyond our centres.
@majorrage said in Bledisloe II:
It's just that both are made of glass and that option isn't available to us as often as we'd like.
That's what I meant by a reliable combination.
I'd be more than happy with ALB & Goodhue getting regular starting slots. The more experience they get between now and RWC2019 the better
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Hansen didn't know who to choose between ALB and Laumape, so he watched 1.50 of this video featuring the two. And just like that...........
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@broughie If you are looking for evidence just watch a replay of the Hurricanes vs Chiefs quarter final this year. Laumape blew Ngatai and ALB off the park and shut down everything they threw at him. He is far from one dimensional and your comment probably suggests you haven't watched any Hurricanes games this year. There was a reason he was named Canes player of the year - he has been brilliant and probably deserves an opportunity more than ALB.
@canes4life Hard to compare super rugby and combinations. Laumape also had Barret on the inside of him. That being said I acknowledge that he is a direct runner and don’t have anything against the man. I don’t see the comparisons to Nonu that some suggest. And ALB was pretty dam good last week. Laumape will also be playing as an AB and will be on the winning team which will often mask weakness that may be exposed with better competition.
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Tries 1 & 3 he should have drawn and passed.
Shit tackling saw him score
@mikethesnow said in Bledisloe II:
Tries 1 & 3 he should have drawn and passed.
Shit tackling saw him score
Yep. Just like the most famous RWC try ever. Should have passed to Oz. Instead we have an iconic moment.
To quote Keith Quinn: "Lomu! ... Oh! Oh!".
There is something to be said for doing things differently sometimes.
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@hooroo said in Bledisloe II:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Bledisloe II:
@no-quarter said in Bledisloe II:
@mikethesnow said in Bledisloe II:
@no-quarter said in Bledisloe II:
Wallabies would be better to start Pocock and have Hooper on the bench to up the anti in the final 20. Like Ardie I don't think he's big/physical enough but could be effective against tired legs.
Looked to me that Hooper was more effective in taking the ball forward than Pocock and similar in defence.
If both are in the 23 then Pocock really has to start as I can't see him making much of an impact from the bench.
Both players are vastly overrated.
Pocock's running game is an absolute joke. He'd be great in NFL with just one specifically defined role, but in rugby you should have both attacking and defending skills, particularly if you're essentially an open side flanker.
Do you mean running game with ball in hand? Because Ritchie was pretty average with ball in hand as well.
On the first bolded bit - the modern standard for taking the ball forward was led by Thierry Dusautoir, French captain; Sam Warburton of Wales; Chris Robshaw, England; Irishmen Peter O'Mahony and Sean O'Brien; Schalk Burger; and your very own back three, from Kaino and Messam onward to Sam Cane. Our bloke cannot get near that level, nor can the other, so they have one of 'em wear No 8 - work that out! These fellas I name are/were also a bit useful in the line out because they are inches taller.
For the second bolded piece: Sir Richie spent his last four or five years running more often, in combinations with Kieran Read off the scrum and freelancing solo, aiming at selected opponents and gaps, thundering down on them using his size, scoring the odd try and giving the last pass a lot - not bad for "pretty average with ball in hand".
But you were talking about a bloke named "Ritchie".:winking_face:Ooops - that was a near thing! I just went back to see who typed that only to find Hooroo, a man of much higher standing in these parts than myself, a mere furriner. I near ended up ground out as berley for next time y'all go fishing for more of that tasty New Zealand schnapper!
78-=78-=8-0000000- -
@hooroo said in Bledisloe II:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Bledisloe II:
@no-quarter said in Bledisloe II:
@mikethesnow said in Bledisloe II:
@no-quarter said in Bledisloe II:
Wallabies would be better to start Pocock and have Hooper on the bench to up the anti in the final 20. Like Ardie I don't think he's big/physical enough but could be effective against tired legs.
Looked to me that Hooper was more effective in taking the ball forward than Pocock and similar in defence.
If both are in the 23 then Pocock really has to start as I can't see him making much of an impact from the bench.
Both players are vastly overrated.
Pocock's running game is an absolute joke. He'd be great in NFL with just one specifically defined role, but in rugby you should have both attacking and defending skills, particularly if you're essentially an open side flanker.
Do you mean running game with ball in hand? Because Ritchie was pretty average with ball in hand as well.
On the first bolded bit - the modern standard for taking the ball forward was led by Thierry Dusautoir, French captain; Sam Warburton of Wales; Chris Robshaw, England; Irishmen Peter O'Mahony and Sean O'Brien; Schalk Burger; and your very own back three, from Kaino and Messam onward to Sam Cane. Our bloke cannot get near that level, nor can the other, so they have one of 'em wear No 8 - work that out! These fellas I name are/were also a bit useful in the line out because they are inches taller.
For the second bolded piece: Sir Richie spent his last four or five years running more often, in combinations with Kieran Read off the scrum and freelancing solo, aiming at selected opponents and gaps, thundering down on them using his size, scoring the odd try and giving the last pass a lot - not bad for "pretty average with ball in hand".
But you were talking about a bloke named "Ritchie".:winking_face:Ooops - that was a near thing! I just went back to see who typed that only to find Hooroo, a man of much higher standing in these parts than myself, a mere furriner. I near ended up ground out as berley for next time y'all go fishing for more of that tasty New Zealand schnapper!
78-=78-=8-0000000-@mick-gold-coast-qld I stopped reading at Chris Robshaw.
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@hooroo said in Bledisloe II:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Bledisloe II:
@no-quarter said in Bledisloe II:
@mikethesnow said in Bledisloe II:
@no-quarter said in Bledisloe II:
Wallabies would be better to start Pocock and have Hooper on the bench to up the anti in the final 20. Like Ardie I don't think he's big/physical enough but could be effective against tired legs.
Looked to me that Hooper was more effective in taking the ball forward than Pocock and similar in defence.
If both are in the 23 then Pocock really has to start as I can't see him making much of an impact from the bench.
Both players are vastly overrated.
Pocock's running game is an absolute joke. He'd be great in NFL with just one specifically defined role, but in rugby you should have both attacking and defending skills, particularly if you're essentially an open side flanker.
Do you mean running game with ball in hand? Because Ritchie was pretty average with ball in hand as well.
On the first bolded bit - the modern standard for taking the ball forward was led by Thierry Dusautoir, French captain; Sam Warburton of Wales; Chris Robshaw, England; Irishmen Peter O'Mahony and Sean O'Brien; Schalk Burger; and your very own back three, from Kaino and Messam onward to Sam Cane. Our bloke cannot get near that level, nor can the other, so they have one of 'em wear No 8 - work that out! These fellas I name are/were also a bit useful in the line out because they are inches taller.
For the second bolded piece: Sir Richie spent his last four or five years running more often, in combinations with Kieran Read off the scrum and freelancing solo, aiming at selected opponents and gaps, thundering down on them using his size, scoring the odd try and giving the last pass a lot - not bad for "pretty average with ball in hand".
But you were talking about a bloke named "Ritchie".:winking_face:Ooops - that was a near thing! I just went back to see who typed that only to find Hooroo, a man of much higher standing in these parts than myself, a mere furriner. I near ended up ground out as berley for next time y'all go fishing for more of that tasty New Zealand schnapper!
78-=78-=8-0000000-@mick-gold-coast-qld said in Bledisloe II:
For the second bolded piece: Sir Richie spent his last four or five years running more often,
the GOAT didn't really have weaknesses, but fair to say that his running game wasn't a massive strength. To be honest, by the end of his career, I think he just did everything pretty well, but did it all the damn time, all over the paddock, all game. Just incredible.
By comparison, I'd classify Pocock's running game as a consistent weakness. It's amazing, that a guy with such apparent balance and strength just can't seem to get through contact well or find open spaces (1 run at the weekend excepted). This has been noticeable for a while.
