Bledisloe II
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@stargazer No offence but does it really matter who plays in that 3rd hooker spot as they're all on about the same level anyway? We could pick Greg Pleasants Tate and it wouldn't make a difference.
@african-monkey Harris is the 2nd hooker as long as Coles isn't back playing.
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@wreck-diver said in Bledisloe II:
So are all the people that were bitching about Barrett last week, are you satisfied or do you still want to drop him?
When Marty Holah was playing for the ABs he was a really good openside. A top quality international who never let his side down. Yet he was dropped for a noob. That's how it works at the top.
No-one much thinks Barrett is bad. Some of us aren't so blinded by his brilliant bits that we don't see his weaknesses though.
Some people suspect Mo'unga might be better* We'll never know if we never play him on the basis that Barrett is good enough, will we?
And we'd have missed years of McCaw if we followed your logic.
[* I am not one of them. But I know that Barrett does have weaknesses. To me he is one of those brilliant players who isn't able to use his brilliance in a way that makes others better too.]
@chester-draws said in Bledisloe II:
@wreck-diver said in Bledisloe II:
So are all the people that were bitching about Barrett last week, are you satisfied or do you still want to drop him?
When Marty Holah was playing for the ABs he was a really good openside. A top quality international who never let his side down. Yet he was dropped for a noob. That's how it works at the top.
No-one much thinks Barrett is bad. Some of us aren't so blinded by his brilliant bits that we don't see his weaknesses though.
Some people suspect Mo'unga might be better* We'll never know if we never play him on the basis that Barrett is good enough, will we?
And we'd have missed years of McCaw if we followed your logic.
[* I am not one of them. But I know that Barrett does have weaknesses. To me he is one of those brilliant players who isn't able to use his brilliance in a way that makes others better too.]
I'm sorry that last comment was nuts. Just ask the entire Canes backline.
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@bones said in Bledisloe II:
I'm interested in how he doesn't make others better.
An unsympathetic shovel pass mostly.
Also he doesn't stand flat to the line like Carter and Cruden did, so he doesn't pose the same defensive quandaries, which makes it easier to mark the 2nd-five.
Beauden's at his best in space, attacking from the back on counter and when defenses tire. Back lines outside him seem to struggle to penetrate organised back lines, like the Lions or Crusaders. Or not tired Aussies, for that matter.
The ABs seem to be working around this by trying to ensure oppositions always tire enough. I suspect cannier teams than Australia will pace themselves better.
@chester-draws said in Bledisloe II:
@bones said in Bledisloe II:
I'm interested in how he doesn't make others better.
An unsympathetic shovel pass mostly.
Also he doesn't stand flat to the line like Carter and Cruden did, so he doesn't pose the same defensive quandaries, which makes it easier to mark the 2nd-five.
Beauden's at his best in space, attacking from the back on counter and when defenses tire. Back lines outside him seem to struggle to penetrate organised back lines, like the Lions or Crusaders. Or not tired Aussies, for that matter.
The ABs seem to be working around this by trying to ensure oppositions always tire enough. I suspect cannier teams than Australia will pace themselves better.
He scored two tries in the first half ffs. Shit, what more does the guy have to do? You reckon Carter was tearing up defences in the first 30? Taking on the line and breaching it in the opening exchanges? This is just knit picking bullshit. Btw anybody who reckons BB can't control a game should be forced to watch that game Clockwork Orange style.
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Congrats to Owen Franks for playing 100 tests without scoring a single point, a record that's unlikely to ever be beaten.
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@gumboot said in Bledisloe II:
Congrats to Owen Franks for playing 100 tests without scoring a single point, a record that's unlikely to ever be beaten.
How many did Jason Leonard play before he scored his try?
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Haven't read comments, was out last night and just watched game.
For me this was a game where everyone did there job and played well. Thought Laumape had ex work rate. For me best backs BB and BFA. How fast and elusive did BFA look!
In forwards Taylor was head and shoulders best, watch again his impact and workrate, outstanding. 2nd was Squire, again workrate, use in lineout, defence. He is being used in middle of field on attack now with Retallick and impact can be seen, against France he started to be ousted there but with Brodie's ball skills it looks so much better. -
While we are urging the citing commissioner to have a look at things, maybe POcocks swinging arm on BB and I think it was H-P's 'judo hip throw' of D-Mac after he made a break...but I expect while close scrutiny is made on shit done to Saint Dave, anything he does is not looked at with more than a passing glance.
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Apropos of nothing, last night after the game I was sitting talking and beering with my bro and every so often Mrs JC, who was doing something else, said something I couldn’t catch. It turned out that every time she heard “Hansen” she was saying “Mmm Bop” to herself. Didn’t even realise she was doing it. She’s a keeper. And I’ll be referring to the coach as Mmm Bop from now on.
That is all, carry on.
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@gumboot was about half way through his career v Arg in 1996
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@gumboot was about half way through his career v Arg in 1996
@taniwharugby Cheers
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The Walrus’s assessment in The Times. Not much to argue with, although he thinks Folau is on suspension.
Two players at opposite ends of the scoring spectrum featured strongly in this savaging of the Wallabies by the All Blacks.
Owen Franks, the enduring prop, later received a presentation to mark his 100th cap for his country, a titanic career that has brought him not one single try. The supercharged Beauden Barrett, meanwhile, scored four in this single match, picking off Australia with his pace, skill and vision on the back of the communal ruthlessness of the team. No All Black had ever scored four in a match against Australia and perhaps it was the fourth try that summarised the whole day.
A few minutes before it came, Barrett had crossed in the far right corner for what appeared to be his try number four. However, a replay of play from way back in the same move showed a tiny knock-on by Ardie Savea, so the try was wiped off.
Almost immediately, the All Black machine burst into life again with their devastating ability to score from a counterattack, with forwards often handling like backs. Barrett came gliding up to score in exactly the same corner, almost as if by this time the All Blacks were able to do whatever they pleased. This win had elements of a complete performance and tilted world rugby on its axis. It rather devalued Ireland’s fine Test series win over Australia, it gave the lie to thoughts that the rest of the game was catching up with New Zealand.
It also offered the frightening thought that with Barrett and company so dazzling on the counter, to win possession against the All Blacks might be worse for the opposition than not winning it. The power of the home squad was illustrated vividly. Ryan Crotty withdrew and was replaced by Ngani Laumape in midfield. The young centre was immense, in style and power a dead ringer for the great Frank Bunce of old.
The whole environment does nothing for Australia. First, they refuse to recall any but a tiny handful of players who are employed overseas. They have to review that policy right away. Second, they have to play this superb New Zealand side three times in most seasons. The team is being shattered but Northern Hemisphere teams might well suffer the same fate if they had three All Black fixtures per season, sometimes two of them in New Zealand.
It was a shame because Australia have some fine new forwards emerging in Lukhan Tui in the back tow and Allan Alaalatoa at prop, who both played yesterday, and Taniela Tupou, who did not. Their powerful centres, Tevita Kuridrani and Samu Kerevi, were also injured and Israel Folau suspended.
What was left was a team who clearly did not expect to win, could not retain the ball under pressure and who were hit on the counter in barrage after barrage of attacks.
Beauden Barrett — one of three Barrett brothers to appear in the match — scored the first try, angling in on a run by Aaron Smith, and by half-time he had scored again, supporting a run by Jack Goodhue. The match was over as a contest after half-time with an electric try scored with a powerhouse finishing burst by Joe Moody. Brodie Retallick ushered Liam Squire over for another and two more from Barrett completed the rout. Australia scored a try in each half, from Will Genia and Reece Hodge. Three further New Zealand touchdowns were disallowed.
Questions concerning the reign of Michael Cheika, the Australia coach, will now be asked. His record is poor. But he does have an ability to galvanise teams going into the World Cup. His employers really must hold their nerve. Few teams can look accomplished with an opponent as devastating as New Zealand. England are in the firing line in the autumn at Twickenham, in what will be their most important home match in years
Star man: Beauden Barrett (New Zealand)
New Zealand: Tries: Barret 4, Moody, Squire Cons: Barrett 5
Australia: Tries: Genia, Hodge Con: Foley
Referee: Wayne Barnes
Attendance: 50,000 -
Shit I hope there's some way Pinetree can watch Brodie play. We've had so many outstanding locks over the years but jesus the shit Brodie does all over the paddock blows my mind
Wayne Barnes makes me think of Stuart Broad, usual pedantry at times but it works and his attention to ruck cleanouts was welcomed
Is Dane HP, BFA lite? That's a compliment
I thought the RM is better than BB banter was bored preselection fern trash talk.
Jesus, just leave Barrett there. He's our number 10 till 2020 at least. Play RM at 10 if injury strikes the incumbent and leave DM with 20 something on his back for all games. SimplesYay Bledisloe!
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Not a fan of Naholo.He looked lost a couple of times last night on the left. There was one time in the second half someone was trying to run him into space and the angle Naholo ran was all wrong and the move died as a result.
I thought Goodhue went ok. Apart from looking really awkward at the back when he threw that dodgy pass I thought he did the basics well. That pass he threw forward at the start of the game showed how good this kid is/could be. It was a lovely pass despite it going forward. Worked hard and made good decisions on defense too. I hope he is seen as the number one centre.
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Not a fan of Naholo.He looked lost a couple of times last night on the left. There was one time in the second half someone was trying to run him into space and the angle Naholo ran was all wrong and the move died as a result.
I thought Goodhue went ok. Apart from looking really awkward at the back when he threw that dodgy pass I thought he did the basics well. That pass he threw forward at the start of the game showed how good this kid is/could be. It was a lovely pass despite it going forward. Worked hard and made good decisions on defense too. I hope he is seen as the number one centre.
@crazy-horse thing is, the pass travelled forward, but was passed backwards as is allowed under the laws (argh, as also pointed out by Marshall
) so the call was wrong, although it did look forward, so can see why a ref (other than Barnes) might see it that way. -
I think Goodhue is awesome. A few iffy things last night, but he just looks class. Considering his age and lack of experience I think we have alot to look forward to in the future.
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Always good to lock the big cup up for another year.
BBBR and BB have to be the best players in the world by some margin.
On the BB debate, i know anything other than BB is awesome at 10 seems to be getting shouted down now but I would love to see a back three of
11. Ioane 14. Smith 15. BBWith another 10 in to run the backline. Whether that 10 is Mounga or they convince Cruden to come back it doesn't matter.
BB getting more space at the back and injecting himself at first receiver would be even more lethal.Our backs as a unit at the moment seem to be dangerous from broken play or on the counter but we suffer when there is a more structured defence with passes going behind and players being flat footed. We rely heavily on Ioane to use his gas for set piece moves and it is often guys like BBBR making a half break or offload that get us into that unstructured play that we score off.
BB scoring 4 tries doesn't really change that.Anyway just like Akira getting a game i don't see them moving BB to 15 so we can forget about it.
Back on the game, Harris is serious deadwood in this team his lineout throwing is a liability that threatens to take our lineout back to the bad old days when he is on.
Thought that non try off the Ardie knock on was bullshit. Not clear and obvious enough to take it all that way back IMO. Maybe the TMO was annoyed they have been told to stop the constant "check check " crap in open play that he decided he would stick his nose in wherever he could.
Edit: the formatting seems to have messed with my numbers. BB to 15 not 13.
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@crazy-horse thing is, the pass travelled forward, but was passed backwards as is allowed under the laws (argh, as also pointed out by Marshall
) so the call was wrong, although it did look forward, so can see why a ref (other than Barnes) might see it that way.@taniwharugby jesus, Marshall actually disagreed with a call that went against the ABs?
