Blues 2019
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@kirwan Although, in fairness, I think you also have to take into account that the other NZ franchises have become progressively stronger.
Since 2012 all of them have won titles and none of them have fallen off a cliff subsequently.
@chris-b said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@kirwan Although, in fairness, I think you also have to take into account that the other NZ franchises have become progressively stronger.
Since 2012 all of them have won titles and none of them have fallen off a cliff subsequently.
Isn't that just making my point that the other countries teams have gotten weaker? In a weaker competition, NZ teams winning more titles can mean that we stayed the same strength.
There has been fluctuation between which is the stronger NZ team, but that's always happened as well.
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@chris-b said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@kirwan Although, in fairness, I think you also have to take into account that the other NZ franchises have become progressively stronger.
Since 2012 all of them have won titles and none of them have fallen off a cliff subsequently.
Isn't that just making my point that the other countries teams have gotten weaker? In a weaker competition, NZ teams winning more titles can mean that we stayed the same strength.
There has been fluctuation between which is the stronger NZ team, but that's always happened as well.
@kirwan Not really. In the past you could usually rely on at least one of the Highlanders, Chiefs or Canes to be basket cases and an easy victory.
Now all those teams are good and NZ conference games are like test matches. Anyone who is a bit off the pace gets creamed and unfortunately for the Blues that has been them.
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There is going to be a TSF meltdown when Collins is named captain.
Coventry was happy to have Parsons as his NH captain, while he was Umaga's captain too. So MacDonald will need to make the decision as the head coach. Why not Ofa as one of the co-captains?
@bovidae I wouldn't mind having Ofa as captain personally. Pat Tuipulotu has done it for Auckland as well so he might be in the mix. I would like for Gibson to be captain but we know he'll only play 6 games max so no point giving it to him.
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This is gold
Question 3 for those who love to get up in arms over the obvious
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/quizzes/daily-quizzes/22562804/Afternoon-trivia-quiz-November-16
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12/15, fucking aced that shit.
@no-quarter said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
12/15, fucking aced that shit.
So you didn't select Waikato Chiefs or Otago Highlanders? You selected the Auckland Blues?
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@no-quarter said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
12/15, fucking aced that shit.
So you didn't select Waikato Chiefs or Otago Highlanders? You selected the Auckland Blues?
@hooroo said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@no-quarter said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
12/15, fucking aced that shit.
So you didn't select Waikato Chiefs or Otago Highlanders? You selected the Auckland Blues?
Took a wild stab in the dark and managed to get it right. Lucky.
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@hooroo said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@no-quarter said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
12/15, fucking aced that shit.
So you didn't select Waikato Chiefs or Otago Highlanders? You selected the Auckland Blues?
Took a wild stab in the dark and managed to get it right. Lucky.
@no-quarter said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@hooroo said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@no-quarter said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
12/15, fucking aced that shit.
So you didn't select Waikato Chiefs or Otago Highlanders? You selected the Auckland Blues?
Took a wild stab in the dark and managed to get it right. Lucky.
My dig is that they are still labelling these teams with the NPC provincial bias (which is OK with me but others will tanty)
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12/15, fucking aced that shit.
@no-quarter 14/15 here...got the chick in Q14 wrong, guessed 15.
@Hooroo it's stuff, factual correctness is optional.
Would be an interesting dynamic going from #1 to #2 or more like #2= with others, although the right people involved I guess it shouldnt matter.
Wayne SMith managed to deal with it.
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https://www.nzherald.co.nz/rugby/news/article.cfm?c_id=80&objectid=12161241
But it was the new board who have kicked off this process; a victory for common sense at an outfit which has been in need of it for years.
After being appointed in September when New Zealand Rugby bought out the 40 per cent equity of the franchise owned by Murray Bolton, the new board saw the review of the 2018 season (which would have included input from the players and team management) and decided decisive action was needed.
With former assistants Steve Jackson and Al Rogers already out the door, it was the players' comments about Umaga's performance in particular which struck a chord.
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@rotated said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@kirwan said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@rotated said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
Wasn't a massive fan of MacDonald taking over from Tana the last time but I'll give this a chance...
But full credit for the Blues making a move. Tana has been an improvement on SJK and Lam but still ultimately was seemed outmatched and outclassed by other NZ franchise coaches. Still ultimately I would like to see a non-ex-AB coach though after now four on the trot.
In what way was Tana an improvement? He has a worse record than both those coaches, selected terrible squads and presided over some of the worst results in our history. 60fucking points conceded on Eden Park FFS.
To begin with Umaga has a better record than SJK just on pure numbers but it's much of a muchness and both have records between 40-46% as does Lam. They would rank as the three of the four worst coaches of NZ franchises in the 2010s - the argument would just be about order.
Kirwan is the easier one, under his tenure the Blues felt like the Melbourne Rebels. Where to start? The guy fundamentally didn't understand Super Rugby. Genuinely thought Benji Marshall would be able to play 10 at Super level? Personally exiled three future All Blacks and one Welsh international? Mick Byrne as an assistant coach? Captain Ali Williams? This year has proved yet again it must be bloody difficult to have Graham Henry full time on your staff and not be good. SJK achieved this.
Lam is a more debatable one. There were good times with Lam and for a period between 2010-11 I was of the opinion that with a quality 10 the Blues were title contenders. Of course, the solutions Lam came up with were underwhelming and bewildering to say the least. But it is fair to say in 2011 they played at a level that hasn't been reached under Umaga.
Going against him, Lam went 4-12 in 2012 with the best Blues squad since 2003. Allowed things to become so bad at the end that Woodcock felt compelled to leave. Lashing out at anonymous Blues fans for racist comments on talkback that were never located wasn't a high point. His selections were pretty odd at times, he had very little patience for some and blind loyalty to chaps like Brett. Lachie Munro marking up against Ioane on the wing for a semi-final?
Perhaps as a whole Lam was better than Umaga, but the 2012 season immediately preceding Kirwan was the worst of the bunch and the ripple effects from his tenure are still being felt today.
If you look at pure win/loss records in an unsophisticated way sure.
If you take into account that the Saffas and Oz team's form has fallen off a cliff, then the only fair measure is their results against other NZ teams where the standard across the board has been fairly consistent across the three coaches.
Tana's success rate by that measure is 5% over three years. 1 win out of 20 games.
Lam was easily the best out of the three, making the semi finals in his tenure. And with the restrictions of only been able to select from within the region, not getting the additional coaching support that both Kirwan and Tana got, and without the new training facilities to entice new players to the region.
Take away his injury plagued last season, and look at Lam's success since leaving the Blues I think his reputation ends up the best, quite easily.
Kirwan was poor, no doubt about it, almost as bad a selector as Tana although he didn't try to fill the team with second division "talent".
Tana is easily the worst coach the Blues have ever had, and was deservedly sacked. It says everything about the guy that after being sacked he doesn't have the class to leave as well. Pretty unbelievable really.
Must be a sweet paycheck. I wouldn't be surprised in a year if he just quietly moves on to stink up some other joint.
@kirwan said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
Tana is easily the worst coach the Blues have ever had, and was deservedly sacked. It says everything about the guy that after being sacked he doesn't have the class to leave as well. Pretty unbelievable really.
Criticizing someone's abilities is one thing, slagging their integrity is bitter and nasty.
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@kirwan said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
Tana is easily the worst coach the Blues have ever had, and was deservedly sacked. It says everything about the guy that after being sacked he doesn't have the class to leave as well. Pretty unbelievable really.
Criticizing someone's abilities is one thing, slagging their integrity is bitter and nasty.
@crucial said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@kirwan said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
Tana is easily the worst coach the Blues have ever had, and was deservedly sacked. It says everything about the guy that after being sacked he doesn't have the class to leave as well. Pretty unbelievable really.
Criticizing someone's abilities is one thing, slagging their integrity is bitter and nasty.
To be fair Kirwan also did go back and beg the board to stay on in a different role also - but he was summarily rejected.
Lam was all class though, alienating senior players to the point where Woodcock refused to re-sign and then baselessly calling sections of the Blues fanbase as racists.
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Considering that in the interviews with Rangi he is at pains to point out that he wanted Tana to stay as part of the coaching team. To say it is classless to stay around when asked to is the opposite of what has happened. Umaga has the integrity to not walk away from a situation even though he has to take on a lesser role in front of the team.
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12/15, fucking aced that shit.
@no-quarter said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
12/15, fucking aced that shit.
- Hugh married too many times, and fuck astrology.
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May be behind here but bumped into Ted tonight in Dublin. No interest in Blues 2019. In contrast, said coaching Auckland (in NPC) 'easy'.
Irish win good for rugby. -
@pakman said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
May be behind here but bumped into Ted tonight in Dublin.
Hope you bought him a drink for us. Dead set legend.
@nzzp said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
@pakman said in Blues 2019 - (New Head Coach):
May be behind here but bumped into Ted tonight in Dublin.
Hope you bought him a drink for us. Dead set legend.
Would have done, but his wife was demanding he leave.
