Ireland vs All Blacks (2018)
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@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
Yeah I didn't even mention the halfbacks. Both of their kicking games are shit, and no idea about TTT. It's just not a strong point for us right now.
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@no-quarter said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
even mention the halfbacks. Both of their kicking games are shit, and no idea about TTT. It's just not a strong point for us right now.
and yet A Smith had a great kicking game, surely you dont lose the skill just because Byrne isnt there any more? That said, his game has been stagnated and regressing since his toilet escapade...wasnt that just prior to the Chicago loss too?
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@bovidae Problem is that the British teams have improved their fitness a lot over the past couple of years. The ABs are no longer able to pile on points against them in the last ten of an international as once they were.
Scotland last year, England and Ireland this year. All matched or bettered the ABs in the last ten minutes.
@sparky Read was referring to the entire 2nd half not just the last 10 mins. While I agree that there probably isn't that much difference in fitness levels now between the hemispheres having players go down injured allows you to have a breather and reset so you aren't as stressed physically. The SA super rugby teams used to always do this.
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@sparky Read was referring to the entire 2nd half not just the last 10 mins. While I agree that there probably isn't that much difference in fitness levels now between the hemispheres having players go down injured allows you to have a breather and reset so you aren't as stressed physically. The SA super rugby teams used to always do this.
@bovidae said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@sparky Read was referring to the entire 2nd half not just the last 10 mins. While I agree that there probably isn't that much difference in fitness levels now between the hemispheres having players go down injured allows you to have a breather and reset so you aren't as stressed physically. The SA super rugby teams used to always do this.
if our tactics are wait for bad kicks, and for the opposition to not delay the game, then we are more fucked than i thought
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@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
Yeah I didn't even mention the halfbacks. Both of their kicking games are shit, and no idea about TTT. It's just not a strong point for us right now.
@no-quarter Would TKB have been a starting option had he not left NZ? I think against the physical teams like Ireland and SA, we need a big strong halfback who can make darts around the rucks etc to suck some of their big forwards in.
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@no-quarter Would TKB have been a starting option had he not left NZ? I think against the physical teams like Ireland and SA, we need a big strong halfback who can make darts around the rucks etc to suck some of their big forwards in.
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@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
One of those 1014 podcasts mentioned that every team wants to kick in that part of the field. First I'd properly thought of it but looking around it seems on the mark.
Those podcasts/videos really are an eye opener into the complexities of the pro game. Little things like spreading rucks and making defenders run an extra metre or so or where a defender goes after a tackle. Pretty much analysed to the nth degree.
I think the kicking is more about execution than not kicking. Just my take
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Brilliant take on it all from the Irish Times bless them
@nevorian said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Brilliant take on it all from the Irish Times bless them
If this was slightly more dour, less funny and less wordy it could have been written by a Scotsman.
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For me, the "powder dry" stuff is fueled by Hansen's repeated insistence that they're bedding in a new game plan and it's all going to take time.
At the last RWC we looked like rubbish in the early rounds, but things suddenly came good when needed, so maybe we need some trust.
On the other hand, in 1999, all the talk was of John Hart's secret plan that was going to be unveiled to the shock and awe of all. Presumably he was saving it for the final!
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@rotated said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@rocky-rockbottom said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
worst part is if Hansen's ego leads to him digging his heels in re;selections/positions, reducing us to just hoping the failures somehow get better instead of proactively rocketing them up the arse.
Hopefully he remembers that the 2011 team and tactics in large part was a response to the 2008/9 Boks. They finally stopped trying to impose a helter-skelter style and admit they had to be able to negate and withstand the box kick first and foremost and becoming more physical in the forwards.
I would prefer he accepts the Ireland/BIL style of game is giving them fits and perhaps select and play accordingly. Our aerial game on defence needs to improve and our kicking game needs to improve - to achieve either it would take a tough personnel decision.
Do we have anyone that can implement a better kicking game though? Beauden and DMac are erratic, Mo'unga more consistent but still not great (am comparing him to world class players like Carter here). Our midfield can't kick, BFA again not a great kicking game. I don't think we have the personnel - we look much, much better when we keep ball in hand so I think our gameplan really needs to centre around that. Which maybe it will come WC time.
@no-quarter said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@rotated said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@rocky-rockbottom said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
worst part is if Hansen's ego leads to him digging his heels in re;selections/positions, reducing us to just hoping the failures somehow get better instead of proactively rocketing them up the arse.
Hopefully he remembers that the 2011 team and tactics in large part was a response to the 2008/9 Boks. They finally stopped trying to impose a helter-skelter style and admit they had to be able to negate and withstand the box kick first and foremost and becoming more physical in the forwards.
I would prefer he accepts the Ireland/BIL style of game is giving them fits and perhaps select and play accordingly. Our aerial game on defence needs to improve and our kicking game needs to improve - to achieve either it would take a tough personnel decision.
Do we have anyone that can implement a better kicking game though? Beauden and DMac are erratic, Mo'unga more consistent but still not great (am comparing him to world class players like Carter here). Our midfield can't kick, BFA again not a great kicking game. I don't think we have the personnel - we look much, much better when we keep ball in hand so I think our gameplan really needs to centre around that. Which maybe it will come WC time.
Sheesh NQ that’s starting to sound like an Aussie “we don’t have the cattle” post....
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Relying on fitness towards the end to win is so Gordon Tietjens. Great for a while, even a long time. Eventually the opposing squads cotton on and it ends increasingly badly...
@donsteppa said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Relying on fitness towards the end to win is so Gordon Tietjens. Great for a while, even a long time. Eventually the opposing squads cotton on and it ends increasingly badly...
I see what you did there
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@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
One of those 1014 podcasts mentioned that every team wants to kick in that part of the field. First I'd properly thought of it but looking around it seems on the mark.
Those podcasts/videos really are an eye opener into the complexities of the pro game. Little things like spreading rucks and making defenders run an extra metre or so or where a defender goes after a tackle. Pretty much analysed to the nth degree.
I think the kicking is more about execution than not kicking. Just my take
@siam said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
One of those 1014 podcasts mentioned that every team wants to kick in that part of the field. First I'd properly thought of it but looking around it seems on the mark.
Those podcasts/videos really are an eye opener into the complexities of the pro game. Little things like spreading rucks and making defenders run an extra metre or so or where a defender goes after a tackle. Pretty much analysed to the nth degree.
I think the kicking is more about execution than not kicking. Just my take
I agree. I actually don’t mind 90% of the kicking options we’ve take but our execution has been poor. But you can actually see what they are trying to achieve but the lack of accuracy has made us look ordinary.
I like Ben Smith at fullback but it’s plain as day why he plays on the wing because he’s the one guy that actually chases the high ball in attack. We need both our wingers to do that and as Barrett drops back we have sufficient cover for them to do so.
If DMac is persisted with I too wouldn’t mind seeing him on the wing for that reason. He has the pace and the game to be a very good chase down winger. I’ve never rated his kicking game.
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@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
Yeah I didn't even mention the halfbacks. Both of their kicking games are shit, and no idea about TTT. It's just not a strong point for us right now.
@no-quarter said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
Yeah I didn't even mention the halfbacks. Both of their kicking games are shit, and no idea about TTT. It's just not a strong point for us right now.
Thing is their kicking games have only recently been shit...conveniently timed to coincide with the ABs deciding they chase kicks at walking pace. And how fucking long do they take to set up for a standard kick, which they spray anywhere like in Me, Myself and Irene.
There's just got to be more to it.
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@chris-b in 99 we executed the plan perfectly right up until the end of the first half of the test that never happened....
@act-crusader Hart's plan...give the ball to Jonah?
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@siam said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter Also, we did so many stupid box kicks/high kicks in the middle of the park at times when we should have been holding the ball. Its play like this that makes me lean towards the keeping the powder dry theory.
One of those 1014 podcasts mentioned that every team wants to kick in that part of the field. First I'd properly thought of it but looking around it seems on the mark.
Those podcasts/videos really are an eye opener into the complexities of the pro game. Little things like spreading rucks and making defenders run an extra metre or so or where a defender goes after a tackle. Pretty much analysed to the nth degree.
I think the kicking is more about execution than not kicking. Just my take
I agree. I actually don’t mind 90% of the kicking options we’ve take but our execution has been poor. But you can actually see what they are trying to achieve but the lack of accuracy has made us look ordinary.
I like Ben Smith at fullback but it’s plain as day why he plays on the wing because he’s the one guy that actually chases the high ball in attack. We need both our wingers to do that and as Barrett drops back we have sufficient cover for them to do so.
If DMac is persisted with I too wouldn’t mind seeing him on the wing for that reason. He has the pace and the game to be a very good chase down winger. I’ve never rated his kicking game.
@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
I like Ben Smith at fullback but it’s plain as day why he plays on the wing because he’s the one guy that actually chases the high ball in attack. We need both our wingers to do that and as Barrett drops back we have sufficient cover for them to do so.
Yeah - I saw George Bridge chasing a couple of kicks that looked like forlorn hopes in Japan - but, George ran like a man possessed and good things happened.
I wish he was in Italy this week!
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@hooroo said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@majorrage said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mikethesnow said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Keeping your powder dry.
Thought the preferred NZ heritage is Scottish not English.
Get fucked.
Beaten. Deservedly.
Learn or fuck off.
I really don’t get this post at all.
IT's quite easy to interpret.
He doesn't think we are keeping our powder dry and even saying so is a very English thing to do, so please go have some action, because we were well beaten, learn from mistakes or please go away.
Does that make it easier
Less clear, if anything!
@majorrage said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@hooroo said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@majorrage said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mikethesnow said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Keeping your powder dry.
Thought the preferred NZ heritage is Scottish not English.
Get fucked.
Beaten. Deservedly.
Learn or fuck off.
I really don’t get this post at all.
IT's quite easy to interpret.
He doesn't think we are keeping our powder dry and even saying so is a very English thing to do, so please go have some action, because we were well beaten, learn from mistakes or please go away.
Does that make it easier
Less clear, if anything!
Hooroo explained it perfectly.
How about looking at it this way.
Shag et al's masterstroke is to keep their innovative and WC winning strategy under wraps one year out from the tournament in the hope that all the personnel involved in implementing said strategy will be fit & in form come tournament time.
If losses in test matches against NH teams is the result, so be it.
Sounds reasonable. Said no Kiwi ever.
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RS talkback has been pretty reasonable since yesterday, maybe all the loons are still hitting things, or maybe they only call up at night!
( joking
)
