Italy vs All Blacks
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If we rewind 4 years there were similar concerns and issues being raised by fans, commentators and posters on here about performance and selections.
That 2014 EOYT many were concerned that we just scraped past England with basically a first choice squad. Then when some “left field” selections were made against Scotland the cries got louder. Slade on the wing, McCaw at no6, Vito starting, even Fekitoa at centre was hotly disputed (calls of him being a flat track bully). It was a pretty disjointed game from what I remember.
To me there are plenty of similarities this year with 2014.
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If we rewind 4 years there were similar concerns and issues being raised by fans, commentators and posters on here about performance and selections.
That 2014 EOYT many were concerned that we just scraped past England with basically a first choice squad. Then when some “left field” selections were made against Scotland the cries got louder. Slade on the wing, McCaw at no6, Vito starting, even Fekitoa at centre was hotly disputed (calls of him being a flat track bully). It was a pretty disjointed game from what I remember.
To me there are plenty of similarities this year with 2014.
@act-crusader Scotland were considered as weak at the time so we played a pretty weak side and nearly paid for it. Thrush and Bird was our 2nd row haha, even Pulu got on for 2 minutes, threw a horrendous pass and was never seen again in black.
Oh, and James Parsons started at hooker.
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Everyone here (or mostly everyone) was rubbishing the idea of Ardie being a starting 7. Not so many objections anymore. Maybe Hansen and co are onto something?
Fifita certainly has the ability.
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@act-crusader Scotland were considered as weak at the time so we played a pretty weak side and nearly paid for it. Thrush and Bird was our 2nd row haha, even Pulu got on for 2 minutes, threw a horrendous pass and was never seen again in black.
Oh, and James Parsons started at hooker.
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@african-monkey and Italy....
@act-crusader ... are 14th in the world at the moment
I agree, it's a chance to see more of some guys, and push some established guys to up the ante from last week.Also think some perspective is due, the Irish are bloody good at the moment but lack the history of previous wins. I don't like the ABs losing, or being so adventurous in selections and/or strategy that we give away games. But when we lose a close one against the 2nd best team in the world, is it really the world ending?
In saying that I think most posters saw that Ireland played well, we were a bit rough, and that was that.
Hoping we murder Italy but I'd be ok with a lite-romp if we play well across the board and give away far fewer penalties.
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@pukunui said in Italy vs All Blacks:
Precisely what the fuck do they think they are going to learn about Fifita in this game that they don't already know? Huge missed opportunity to see Papalii start at 6. If there were concerns over injuries to loose forwards then have Fafita on the bench.
Vaea or Vaia?
@booboo said in Italy vs All Blacks:
@pukunui said in Italy vs All Blacks:
Precisely what the fuck do they think they are going to learn about Fifita in this game that they don't already know? Huge missed opportunity to see Papalii start at 6. If there were concerns over injuries to loose forwards then have Fafita on the bench.
Vaea or Vaia?
Different guy. Fifita has had his chances. Fafita on the other hand has been given the Akira treatment.
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@booboo said in Italy vs All Blacks:
@pukunui said in Italy vs All Blacks:
Precisely what the fuck do they think they are going to learn about Fifita in this game that they don't already know? Huge missed opportunity to see Papalii start at 6. If there were concerns over injuries to loose forwards then have Fafita on the bench.
Vaea or Vaia?
Different guy. Fifita has had his chances. Fafita on the other hand has been given the Akira treatment.
This post is deleted! -
Italy
15 Jayden HAYWARD (Benetton Rugby, 11 caps)
14 Tommaso BENVENUTI (Benetton Rugby, 54 caps)
13 Michele CAMPAGNARO (Wasps, 37 caps)
12 Tommaso CASTELLO (Zebre Rugby Club, 14 caps)
11 Luca SPERANDIO (Benetton Rugby, 4 caps)
10 Tommaso ALLAN (Benetton Rugby, 42 caps)
9 Tito TEBALDI (Benetton Rugby, 28 caps)
8 Abraham Jurgens STEYN (Benetton Rugby, 24 caps)
7 Jake POLLEDRI (Gloucester Rugby, 5 caps)
6 Sebastian NEGRI (Benetton Rugby, 11 caps)
5 Dean BUDD (Benetton Rugby, 15 caps)
4 Alessandro ZANNI (Benetton Rugby, 108 caps)
3 Simone FERRARI (Benetton Rugby, 16 caps)
2 Leonardo GHIRALDINI (Stade Toulousian, 98 caps) – capitano
1 Andrea LOVOTTI (Zebre Rugby Club, 29 caps)Reserves
16 Luca BIGI (Benetton Rugby, 14 caps)
17 Cherif TRAORE' (Benetton Rugby,4 caps)
18 Tiziano PASQUALI (Benetton Rugby, 12 caps)
19 Marco FUSER (Benetton Rugby, 32 caps)
20 Johan MEYER (Zebre Rugby Club, 3 caps)
21 Guglielmo PALAZZANI (Zebre Rugby Club, 27 caps)
22 Luca MORISI (Benetton Rugby, 19 caps)
23 Edoardo PADOVANI (Zebre Rugby Club, 14 caps) -
@african-monkey and Italy....
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@act-crusader Are a joke.
@african-monkey Why? That's a bit of a shit attitude isn't it?
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@african-monkey Why? That's a bit of a shit attitude isn't it?
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@bones Sorry yeah they'll provide a tough test for the ABs and if the ABs are slightly off their game, we could be seeing a massive upset occuring here.
@african-monkey I've no idea if you're being facetious or not. I just reckon it's pretty stink to call a team a joke just because they're not as good as the best teams.
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I can understand the Barrett/McKenzie thing. If they are struggling to get whatever they are trying to do right at 100% pressure, then try it again in the first half at 85-90% pressure. No use trying it in the second half when the Italians are tired and the game is gone, better to go while they are being physical and still have a twinkle in the eye. Also gives us another look at a TJP/BB combo out of the gate. This is one of the last times to take a look at these combos.
As for Mo'unga I'm not even sure what playing this fixture would prove about him - he will play home derbies next year in Super Rugby at a higher intensity than this. I don't think playing Italy will give him anymore confidence than he already has.
On the other side of the coin though Shag hasn't said anything remotely critical of BB publicly in 3 years and hasn't made any attempt to assess his options. You do get the feeling he is so adamant about doubling down on this that he is willing to make it Beaudy and Clyde at the World Cup.
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If we rewind 4 years there were similar concerns and issues being raised by fans, commentators and posters on here about performance and selections.
That 2014 EOYT many were concerned that we just scraped past England with basically a first choice squad. Then when some “left field” selections were made against Scotland the cries got louder. Slade on the wing, McCaw at no6, Vito starting, even Fekitoa at centre was hotly disputed (calls of him being a flat track bully). It was a pretty disjointed game from what I remember.
To me there are plenty of similarities this year with 2014.
@act-crusader yep, the Irish guy in 1014 mentioned that earlier this year Hansen said that the 3rd year in the world cup cycle is the most difficult year. I'd like to think this is relevant for this tour.
Hansen has been a great coach, I'm not losing confidence in what he's doing -
I can understand the Barrett/McKenzie thing. If they are struggling to get whatever they are trying to do right at 100% pressure, then try it again in the first half at 85-90% pressure. No use trying it in the second half when the Italians are tired and the game is gone, better to go while they are being physical and still have a twinkle in the eye. Also gives us another look at a TJP/BB combo out of the gate. This is one of the last times to take a look at these combos.
As for Mo'unga I'm not even sure what playing this fixture would prove about him - he will play home derbies next year in Super Rugby at a higher intensity than this. I don't think playing Italy will give him anymore confidence than he already has.
On the other side of the coin though Shag hasn't said anything remotely critical of BB publicly in 3 years and hasn't made any attempt to assess his options. You do get the feeling he is so adamant about doubling down on this that he is willing to make it Beaudy and Clyde at the World Cup.
@rotated said in Italy vs All Blacks:
On the other side of the coin though Shag hasn't said anything remotely critical of BB publicly in 3 years and hasn't made any attempt to assess his options. You do get the feeling he is so adamant about doubling down on this that he is willing to make it Beaudy and Clyde at the World Cup.
Thing is - Hansen has repeatedly talked about the value of experience - and it has served him well over the past eight years.
Barring injuries or something extraordinary happening (someone's form dropping off a cliff or someone irresistibly springing onto the scene, I reckon he's probably got his top RWC XV written down and in something more indelible than pencil.
Moody
Taylor or Coles
Franks
Retallick
Whitelock
Squire
Cane
Read
Smith
Barrett
Ioane
Crotty or SBW
Goodhue
Smith
McKenzieSteve's writing his legacy and he's not planning to roll the dice on a rookie first five, when he's got a two-time world player of the year who's played 70 tests and won most of them.
I'd say Jordie on the wing is a bit of a worry for Naholo's chances of making the squad, though.
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I actually thiought the dual playmakers set-up of the last few months was a stealth way to transition to a Mo'ouga 10, Barrett 15 starting lineup without ruffling feathers or denting egos.
Clearly not the case and I am re-assessing.
I'm angry that Sopoaga stole Mo'ouga's development time on the last November tour and I'm astounded that Mo'ouga's not starting this match even if my theory above was wrong.
