RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A)
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Some random shit from Jerome tonight on the forward passes.
Lol Artemyev has better English than Garces thanks to his Irish youth
@NTA said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
Some random shit from Jerome tonight on the forward passes.
Bold (and the words following) is unnecessary
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@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
Smaller countries could do with regular games against top tier countries - like SANZAR did with Argentina. Russia are ranked ahead of Canada but have never played England, Scotland or Wales.
The 6N unions are the nearest and the likes of Romania, Spain, Georgia, Russia, Portugal etc should be competing against 6N teams regularly.
Nth Hemisphere unions are the wealthiest and yet we get stories of Fiji getting £800 or whatever per player for a game at Twickenham - not to mention problems with Nth Hemisphere clubs release of player players from smaller unions.
Not a rant against the Nth, but they are in a great position to grow the game in Europe but simply don't seem that interested.
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This all seems to suggest that the key to beating Ireland is just to shutdown Sexton. I didn't follow the 6N was there the same drop off when he wasn't playing?
@Rembrandt said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
This all seems to suggest that the key to beating Ireland is just to shutdown Sexton. I didn't follow the 6N was there the same drop off when he wasn't playing?
It shows up that unless Sexton and Murray are playing together, Ireland are a shit team.
How their absence makes the scrum a bucket of arse, I don't know. After Ireland fooled the ref into thinking they were dominant, he woke up and started doing them for cheating. Good.
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@Rembrandt said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
This all seems to suggest that the key to beating Ireland is just to shutdown Sexton. I didn't follow the 6N was there the same drop off when he wasn't playing?
It shows up that unless Sexton and Murray are playing together, Ireland are a shit team.
How their absence makes the scrum a bucket of arse, I don't know. After Ireland fooled the ref into thinking they were dominant, he woke up and started doing them for cheating. Good.
@NTA said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Rembrandt said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
This all seems to suggest that the key to beating Ireland is just to shutdown Sexton. I didn't follow the 6N was there the same drop off when he wasn't playing?
It shows up that unless Sexton and Murray are playing together, Ireland are a shit team.
How their absence makes the scrum a bucket of arse, I don't know. After Ireland fooled the ref into thinking they were dominant, he woke up and started doing them for cheating. Good.
Losing to Japan, playing poorly running into the tourney doesn't help. Refs aren't as afraid to penalise them as they were - I don't think the rub of the green goes their way so much any more.Their game plan needs them to play right to the ref and deliver the penalties.
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@Rembrandt said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
This all seems to suggest that the key to beating Ireland is just to shutdown Sexton. I didn't follow the 6N was there the same drop off when he wasn't playing?
It shows up that unless Sexton and Murray are playing together, Ireland are a shit team.
How their absence makes the scrum a bucket of arse, I don't know. After Ireland fooled the ref into thinking they were dominant, he woke up and started doing them for cheating. Good.
@NTA said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
It shows up that unless Sexton and Murray are playing together, Ireland are a shit team.
Other thing I noticed against Japan was Ireland weren't or weren't able to commit as many players to the breakdown as they normally do and dominate that area.
Wonder if the reffing of high tackles has disrupted their choke-tackle tactics and allowed other teams to off-load more.
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@NTA said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
It shows up that unless Sexton and Murray are playing together, Ireland are a shit team.
Other thing I noticed against Japan was Ireland weren't or weren't able to commit as many players to the breakdown as they normally do and dominate that area.
Wonder if the reffing of high tackles has disrupted their choke-tackle tactics and allowed other teams to off-load more.
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@NTA said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
It shows up that unless Sexton and Murray are playing together, Ireland are a shit team.
Other thing I noticed against Japan was Ireland weren't or weren't able to commit as many players to the breakdown as they normally do and dominate that area.
Wonder if the reffing of high tackles has disrupted their choke-tackle tactics and allowed other teams to off-load more.
Nah was the humidity
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@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
Smaller countries could do with regular games against top tier countries - like SANZAR did with Argentina. Russia are ranked ahead of Canada but have never played England, Scotland or Wales.
The 6N unions are the nearest and the likes of Romania, Spain, Georgia, Russia, Portugal etc should be competing against 6N teams regularly.
Nth Hemisphere unions are the wealthiest and yet we get stories of Fiji getting £800 or whatever per player for a game at Twickenham - not to mention problems with Nth Hemisphere clubs release of player players from smaller unions.
Not a rant against the Nth, but they are in a great position to grow the game in Europe but simply don't seem that interested.
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
Smaller countries could do with regular games against top tier countries - like SANZAR did with Argentina. Russia are ranked ahead of Canada but have never played England, Scotland or Wales.
And like the 5N did with Italy?
The 6N unions are the nearest and the likes of Romania, Spain, Georgia, Russia, Portugal etc should be competing against 6N teams regularly.
Agreed with a caveat. It is no good tonking Russia or Portugal by 80 odd points in a nothing game. More use should, IMO, be made of the Saxons, Wolfhounds etc in giving exposure to the lower tier nations. Plus there is not a window for the senior sides to be able to do anything meaningful
Nth Hemisphere unions are the wealthiest and yet we get stories of Fiji getting £800 or whatever per player for a game at Twickenham - not to mention problems with Nth Hemisphere clubs release of player players from smaller unions.
That is what their Union pay them. The Fiji Union get an agreed appearance sum from the RFU and then it is up to them what they do with it. Or should the RFU, WRU etc start dictating other Unions how to run their show?
Not a rant against the Nth, but they are in a great position to grow the game in Europe but simply don't seem that interested.
Sadly I have to agree with this.
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@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
Smaller countries could do with regular games against top tier countries - like SANZAR did with Argentina. Russia are ranked ahead of Canada but have never played England, Scotland or Wales.
The 6N unions are the nearest and the likes of Romania, Spain, Georgia, Russia, Portugal etc should be competing against 6N teams regularly.
Nth Hemisphere unions are the wealthiest and yet we get stories of Fiji getting £800 or whatever per player for a game at Twickenham - not to mention problems with Nth Hemisphere clubs release of player players from smaller unions.
Not a rant against the Nth, but they are in a great position to grow the game in Europe but simply don't seem that interested.
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
Smaller countries could do with regular games against top tier countries - like SANZAR did with Argentina. Russia are ranked ahead of Canada but have never played England, Scotland or Wales.
The 6N unions are the nearest and the likes of Romania, Spain, Georgia, Russia, Portugal etc should be competing against 6N teams regularly.
Nth Hemisphere unions are the wealthiest and yet we get stories of Fiji getting £800 or whatever per player for a game at Twickenham - not to mention problems with Nth Hemisphere clubs release of player players from smaller unions.
Not a rant against the Nth, but they are in a great position to grow the game in Europe but simply don't seem that interested.
Cato beat me to it but please explain Italy.
Had millions of pounds thrown at them, eaten at the top table for decades, and still very average.
Georgia are about the only European country who could make the leap up as they've declared rugby as their national team sport.
All the other European countries lose most of their better athletes to a myriad of other individual and team sports.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
Smaller countries could do with regular games against top tier countries - like SANZAR did with Argentina. Russia are ranked ahead of Canada but have never played England, Scotland or Wales.
And like the 5N did with Italy?
The 6N unions are the nearest and the likes of Romania, Spain, Georgia, Russia, Portugal etc should be competing against 6N teams regularly.
Agreed with a caveat. It is no good tonking Russia or Portugal by 80 odd points in a nothing game. More use should, IMO, be made of the Saxons, Wolfhounds etc in giving exposure to the lower tier nations. Plus there is not a window for the senior sides to be able to do anything meaningful
Nth Hemisphere unions are the wealthiest and yet we get stories of Fiji getting £800 or whatever per player for a game at Twickenham - not to mention problems with Nth Hemisphere clubs release of player players from smaller unions.
That is what their Union pay them. The Fiji Union get an agreed appearance sum from the RFU and then it is up to them what they do with it. Or should the RFU, WRU etc start dictating other Unions how to run their show?
Not a rant against the Nth, but they are in a great position to grow the game in Europe but simply don't seem that interested.
Sadly I have to agree with this.
@Catogrande said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
That is what their Union pay them. The Fiji Union get an agreed appearance sum from the RFU and then it is up to them what they do with it. Or should the RFU, WRU etc start dictating other Unions how to run their show?
There was no appearance money - the RFU refused to give any (IIRC Host unions are under no obligation to pay appearance money)
England made £7-8m from the last, 2016 game, the Fiji Rugby Union got £75k as a "goodwill gesture". after some severe media criticism. The Fiji players got £400 each.
IMO, be made of the Saxons, Wolfhounds etc in giving exposure to the lower tier nations. Plus there is not a window for the senior sides to be able to do anything meaningful.
Definitely. Regular 2nd tier competitions with the winner & runner-up hosting top tier teams. Make a window and ensure it's part of the global calendar
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@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Billy-Webb said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@akan004 said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@antipodean It's their B team though. Wouldn't read too much into this performance.
It's still a crap performance though. Almost matched Scotland against Samoa
I think that's being very harsh on Russia.
I have thoroughly enjoyed their commitment - even if they are lacking a bit in skill and polish.Don't get me wrong. Russia played really well and I think countries like Russia, Canada, Japan etc get a rough deal from the top tier nations - particularly the 6N unions.
Please elucidate
Smaller countries could do with regular games against top tier countries - like SANZAR did with Argentina. Russia are ranked ahead of Canada but have never played England, Scotland or Wales.
The 6N unions are the nearest and the likes of Romania, Spain, Georgia, Russia, Portugal etc should be competing against 6N teams regularly.
Nth Hemisphere unions are the wealthiest and yet we get stories of Fiji getting £800 or whatever per player for a game at Twickenham - not to mention problems with Nth Hemisphere clubs release of player players from smaller unions.
Not a rant against the Nth, but they are in a great position to grow the game in Europe but simply don't seem that interested.
Cato beat me to it but please explain Italy.
Had millions of pounds thrown at them, eaten at the top table for decades, and still very average.
Georgia are about the only European country who could make the leap up as they've declared rugby as their national team sport.
All the other European countries lose most of their better athletes to a myriad of other individual and team sports.
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
Cato beat me to it but please explain Italy.
Had millions of pounds thrown at them, eaten at the top table for decades, and still very average.Not really a reason for not increasing efforts to grow the game. (Nth & Sth)
Italy's 6N record is comparable to Argentina in the RC. No-one would regard the latter as "very average" nowadays. Perhaps the impact of European clubs needs looking at?
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@Catogrande said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
That is what their Union pay them. The Fiji Union get an agreed appearance sum from the RFU and then it is up to them what they do with it. Or should the RFU, WRU etc start dictating other Unions how to run their show?
There was no appearance money - the RFU refused to give any (IIRC Host unions are under no obligation to pay appearance money)
England made £7-8m from the last, 2016 game, the Fiji Rugby Union got £75k as a "goodwill gesture". after some severe media criticism. The Fiji players got £400 each.
IMO, be made of the Saxons, Wolfhounds etc in giving exposure to the lower tier nations. Plus there is not a window for the senior sides to be able to do anything meaningful.
Definitely. Regular 2nd tier competitions with the winner & runner-up hosting top tier teams. Make a window and ensure it's part of the global calendar
@Victor-Meldrew Turnover of £7-8M not profit. A lot of costs running the stadium for an event. Don't get me wrong though, I think the miserly amount paid to Fiji was embarassing for us, as a payment of £400 each for the players should be for Fiji.
But to be honest this is a subject that gets done to death every now and then on the Fern and whilst we all have our on views on where the villainy is - greedy Tier 1unions, corrupt Tier 2 unions, NH V SH, we all end up agreeing that not enough is being done by ANY of the Tier 1 nations to really grow the game internationally. Having said that I do see the club situation in England and France as being a significant speed bump.
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@Victor-Meldrew Turnover of £7-8M not profit. A lot of costs running the stadium for an event. Don't get me wrong though, I think the miserly amount paid to Fiji was embarassing for us, as a payment of £400 each for the players should be for Fiji.
But to be honest this is a subject that gets done to death every now and then on the Fern and whilst we all have our on views on where the villainy is - greedy Tier 1unions, corrupt Tier 2 unions, NH V SH, we all end up agreeing that not enough is being done by ANY of the Tier 1 nations to really grow the game internationally. Having said that I do see the club situation in England and France as being a significant speed bump.
No apportioning blame. Just saying there's now a very big opportunity being missed with Japan & Georgia currently growing in stature. They'll atrophy otherwise.
Think SANZAR have thought it thru better than 6N - don't think it's conincidence Japan and Argentina have improved since Sunwolves and Jaguares in S15
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No apportioning blame. Just saying there's now a very big opportunity being missed with Japan & Georgia currently growing in stature. They'll atrophy otherwise.
Think SANZAR have thought it thru better than 6N - don't think it's conincidence Japan and Argentina have improved since Sunwolves and Jaguares in S15
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
No apportioning blame. Just saying there's now a very big opportunity being missed with Japan & Georgia currently growing in stature. They'll atrophy otherwise.
Think SANZAR have thought it thru better than 6N - don't think it's conincidence Japan and Argentina have improved since Sunwolves and Jaguares in S15
SANZAR is not a charity.
It was a commercial decision to introduce Japan and Argentina.
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No apportioning blame. Just saying there's now a very big opportunity being missed with Japan & Georgia currently growing in stature. They'll atrophy otherwise.
Think SANZAR have thought it thru better than 6N - don't think it's conincidence Japan and Argentina have improved since Sunwolves and Jaguares in S15
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@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
No apportioning blame. Just saying there's now a very big opportunity being missed with Japan & Georgia currently growing in stature. They'll atrophy otherwise.
Think SANZAR have thought it thru better than 6N - don't think it's conincidence Japan and Argentina have improved since Sunwolves and Jaguares in S15
SANZAR is not a charity.
It was a commercial decision to introduce Japan and Argentina.
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
It was a commercial decision to introduce Japan and Argentina.
Yep. Maybe proves it makes good commercial sense to expand the game.
Grow the game, grow the money.
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@Victor-Meldrew pretty bold statement on Argentina. Have you seen the world rankings prior to 2012?
@Bones said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew pretty bold statement on Argentina. Have you seen the world rankings prior to 2012?
They made the RWC QF's in '99 & '11 and 3rd place in '07. They've always been around 6 to 8 in the IRB rankings, I think.
IIRC they had regular games against Sth Africa, NZ, Oz and other Tier 1 teams from around the early '90's. Poss. a coincidence that coincided with their growth?
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@Bones said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew pretty bold statement on Argentina. Have you seen the world rankings prior to 2012?
They made the RWC QF's in '99 & '11 and 3rd place in '07. They've always been around 6 to 8 in the IRB rankings, I think.
IIRC they had regular games against Sth Africa, NZ, Oz and other Tier 1 teams from around the early '90's. Poss. a coincidence that coincided with their growth?
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Bones said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@Victor-Meldrew pretty bold statement on Argentina. Have you seen the world rankings prior to 2012?
They made the RWC QF's in '99 & '11 and 3rd place in '07. They've always been around 6 to 8 in the IRB rankings, I think.
IIRC they had regular games against Sth Africa, NZ, Oz and other Tier 1 teams from around the early '90's. Poss. a coincidence that coincided with their growth?
Quite possibly - but that doesn't line up with you pointing out their improvement since 2015 (Jags joined Soup). If you meant RC that was 2012. If anything their world rankings seem to have suffered...
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@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
It was a commercial decision to introduce Japan and Argentina.
Yep. Maybe proves it makes good commercial sense to expand the game.
Grow the game, grow the money.
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: Ireland v Russia (Pool A):
It was a commercial decision to introduce Japan and Argentina.
Yep. Maybe proves it makes good commercial sense to expand the game.
Grow the game, grow the money.
Possibly for the SH
Going from 3 teams to 4 (Championship) is quite easy. And logistically makes sense.
Would love to see Georgia, Russia, Romania in the 8/9N
But the clubs pay most of everyone's wages and they can't afford for the players to be away for so long.
