RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1)
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@Nepia I think the selectors in the end got caught out with an ageing forward pack The Franks change was late in the piece but so necessary. BBBR was off his best and Scott Barrett should have started at lock. Add to that Taylor looked to have peaked a season ago. I thought Read played quite well but no one looked good tonight. We looked flat this week and if it’s because the Irish game took too much out of them then that is an issue.
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England peaking at the right time, thought their backrow and Itoje were huge performance wise.
Defensively they were totally on point.
Quite worrying to see them play that well, don't think I've ever seen NZ nullified like that.
No point watching a news bulletin or buying a newspaper in the UK anytime soon.
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Well that was pretty bloody disappointing. England were great and were far the better team.
I'm not sure it would have mattered too much who was picked for this game. The ABs just looked flat and extremely rattled by the intensity. Somebody mentioned shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic and I reckon that fits pretty well here.
Wasn't just the players being outplayed either Hansen got done big time by Eddie Jones.
@Toddy said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
omebody mentioned shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic and I reckon that fits pretty well here.
the TWM have been shuffling players around right, left and centre for 3 seasons.
Hansen settles on a good Read/Ardie/Cane combination and picks a lock to play at 6 for a pivotal RWC game.
Go figure
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I don't know how to process this loss. We got out coached. The issues I had with the coaching changes this year and especially this week played out.
Agree with much of what @No-Quarter writes below.
J Barrett was always a potential liability.
S Barrett didn't have a bad game but we needed offensive defence around the ruck and loose forward trio playing the style they'd been playing all year. Cane was never going to be able to add impact as a replacement that compared with what he offered at the start.
I was always on the Rieko train, while still being a Bridge fan, but it's telling that Bridge was replaced by Jordie in this match. Rieko was never as out of form as his detractors on here made out. Not saying he would have won the game but it was these sorts of little coaching decisions above that all contributed to this teams performance. I think a bloody good coach got too tricky in his last hurrah.
@ACT-Crusader WTF are you going on about with Patty T? He was barely on the field. FFS.
@Nepia said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
I don't know how to process this loss. We got out coached. The issues I had with the coaching changes this year and especially this week played out.
Agree with much of what @No-Quarter writes below.
J Barrett was always a potential liability.
S Barrett didn't have a bad game but we needed offensive defence around the ruck and loose forward trio playing the style they'd been playing all year. Cane was never going to be able to add impact as a replacement that compared with what he offered at the start.
I was always on the Rieko train, while still being a Bridge fan, but it's telling that Bridge was replaced by Jordie in this match. Rieko was never as out of form as his detractors on here made out. Not saying he would have won the game but it was these sorts of little coaching decisions above that all contributed to this teams performance. I think a bloody good coach got too tricky in his last hurrah.
@ACT-Crusader WTF are you going on about with Patty T? He was barely on the field. FFS.
Settle down.
Can’t you see that the Auckland/Blues v Canterbury/Saders posting is making its Fern comeback.
It’s been far too civil in here for a long time. I’m triggered when I hear the very name Ioane
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Eddie is a sly operator. Think Brumbies 2002/2003 etc. Finegan Gregan etc. He strategizes like a chess player. Starting with telling Marler to go over halfway during Haka. At that point my 10 point prediction in ABs favour changed to 30. I was upset at lack of respect. But it started what Eddie is good at. Niggle.Psychological edge. He is very good at that and I expect Etzebeth to be targeted for his temper in final if we get past Wales. Sad for Sam Cane and maybe Brodie wasn’t at his best. Sublime player but today Itoje jumped from “ meh” to wow ok....TJ didn’t really do much wrong but Hansen has to take flak for not changing Eddies plan I reckon. I’m bleak for you all as AB fans and hope Bokke can keep cup in the Southern Hemisphere. Can’t even begin to think how many decades the crowing will go on if Eng win after getting the cricket a few months back....aaaaargh
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Dear England fans,
I wish my team played as good as yours.
I wish my coach didn't get outdone by his opponent.
Eddie and England were remarkable today. From the haka to the first 2 minutes, Eddie got your boys fired up just right.
A sincere doff of the cap, England, you won the rugby fair and square and if the boot was on the other foot, I'd watch that replay hundreds of times over.
Congrats England, good luck in the final
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@Higgins said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Kirwan said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Where’s Stargazer to explain how great Bridge is and how Richie wasn’t a defensive liability?
Don't think he was around for the Championship final last night either. Not sure which was worst, losing last night or losing tonight. Either way it has not been an enjoyable sporting weekend results wise.
The may go down as my worst sporting supporters weekend ever, first the Magpies, then the Kiwis, and now the ABs.
@Nepia The Breakers also got tipped over with the Phoenix likely to follow suit tomorrow. Then there is also the Constellation Cup coming up soon for the Silver Ferns as well. And to cap things off I watched the local cricket team get rolled by about 140 runs in a 50 over match this afternoon. At least my Napier Tech guys had about a 150 run win up in Hastings on Friday!
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Like you guys have been a rabid ABs fan all of my life and have never ever missed a game
I can not recall a match where our forwards have been so dominated for the entire game
Just come back from the pub in the UK - shell shocked ! -
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Nepia said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
S Barrett didn't have a bad game but we needed offensive defence around the ruck and loose forward trio playing the style they'd been playing all year. Cane was never going to be able to add impact as a replacement that compared with what he offered at the start.
If the idea of SB was to start the line-out, it didn't work. If the idea of SB was to add some grunt, it didn't work. Not blaming SB as he wasn't the worst out there by any measure.
We needed some mongrel and didn't show any. Pat T had been Kaino-like this year - surprised he wasn't on earlier.
Yep. We don't know what he was there for once you remove all those things he was supposedly there for.
@Toddy I don't think the players were flat, we just got out coached and out played. We kicked away ball in the first half when we needed to retain, then we couldn't kick it far enough out of our half in the second.
@Nepia I have never been convinced by the strategy we have had to negate the rush defencesby kicking the ball away ( with chip kicks and cross kicks ) rather than holding. It doesn’t matter whether it has been Beauden or Richie we have persisted. Tonight against a team that kicked long our game looked really naive.
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@Nepia I have never been convinced by the strategy we have had to negate the rush defencesby kicking the ball away ( with chip kicks and cross kicks ) rather than holding. It doesn’t matter whether it has been Beauden or Richie we have persisted. Tonight against a team that kicked long our game looked really naive.
@kev agreed
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What about that box kick by Smith when we finally got attacking ball on their 22. What in the god damn fuck.
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@ACT-Crusader said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
No concerns with that loss. We were outplayed and Eddie Jones did his thing.
Never got the criticism of Itoje because he’s played like this before. Well done that man.
Look forward to seeing the ABs one more time against the Boks.
The criticism of Itoje is NZ rugby fan arrogance at its best.
@SammyC said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
The criticism of Itoje is NZ rugby fan arrogance at its best.
Not from me. It is because he was a dickhead with all the shouting and arm waving at lineouts not because he wasn't a good player.
It also wouldn't be arrogance to think another player isn't very good. Ignorant maybe, and certainly opinion. -
@Toddy said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
omebody mentioned shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic and I reckon that fits pretty well here.
the TWM have been shuffling players around right, left and centre for 3 seasons.
Hansen settles on a good Read/Ardie/Cane combination and picks a lock to play at 6 for a pivotal RWC game.
Go figure
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Toddy said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
omebody mentioned shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic and I reckon that fits pretty well here.
the TWM have been shuffling players around right, left and centre for 3 seasons.
Hansen settles on a good Read/Ardie/Cane combination and picks a lock to play at 6 for a pivotal RWC game.
Go figure
Yeah, I've been a Foster apologist but everything I've seen from the TWM since Perth has been reactionary, disguised as dry powder.
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@Nepia I think the selectors in the end got caught out with an ageing forward pack The Franks change was late in the piece but so necessary. BBBR was off his best and Scott Barrett should have started at lock. Add to that Taylor looked to have peaked a season ago. I thought Read played quite well but no one looked good tonight. We looked flat this week and if it’s because the Irish game took too much out of them then that is an issue.
@kev said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Nepia I think the selectors in the end got caught out with an ageing forward pack The Franks change was late in the piece but so necessary. BBBR was off his best and Scott Barrett should have started at lock. Add to that Taylor looked to have peaked a season ago. I thought Read played quite well but no one looked good tonight. We looked flat this week and if it’s because the Irish game took too much out of them then that is an issue.
I'm not sure it was so much an aging forward pack as, what they planned for and expected to happen - didn't. The lineout was a complete reversal on what i expected to happen - need to go back and look at how we lined up in that, because somehow we let Itoje just fucking kill us - seemed to be winning uncontested ball on their throw and getting up in front of our jumpers on ours -despite that we supposedly had four jumpers and they had two.
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@Toddy said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
omebody mentioned shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic and I reckon that fits pretty well here.
the TWM have been shuffling players around right, left and centre for 3 seasons.
Hansen settles on a good Read/Ardie/Cane combination and picks a lock to play at 6 for a pivotal RWC game.
Go figure
@Victor-Meldrew I was really busy this week so didn't post about it, but I was wondering what the hell had gone wrong that they didn't pick Cane. Really weird.
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Wind back 24 hours, start Cane instead of SB; Coles starting instead of Taylor; Bender on the bench instead of Jordie. Would it have made a difference?
@MrDenmore said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Wind back 24 hours, start Cane instead of SB; Coles starting instead of Taylor; Bender on the bench instead of Jordie. Would it have made a difference?
No
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Eddie is a sly operator. Think Brumbies 2002/2003 etc. Finegan Gregan etc. He strategizes like a chess player. Starting with telling Marler to go over halfway during Haka. At that point my 10 point prediction in ABs favour changed to 30. I was upset at lack of respect. But it started what Eddie is good at. Niggle.Psychological edge. He is very good at that and I expect Etzebeth to be targeted for his temper in final if we get past Wales. Sad for Sam Cane and maybe Brodie wasn’t at his best. Sublime player but today Itoje jumped from “ meh” to wow ok....TJ didn’t really do much wrong but Hansen has to take flak for not changing Eddies plan I reckon. I’m bleak for you all as AB fans and hope Bokke can keep cup in the Southern Hemisphere. Can’t even begin to think how many decades the crowing will go on if Eng win after getting the cricket a few months back....aaaaargh
@mantissanet he’s a quality coach for sure. The Brumbies had quality players during his tenure 98-01 and got to the big dance and even won the choccies. He’s a true tactician. Remember he left the Brumbies after 2001 because he got the Wallabies job. Nucifora then got the Brumbies job and made some changes and got to the finals before the player revolt....
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@kev said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Nepia I think the selectors in the end got caught out with an ageing forward pack The Franks change was late in the piece but so necessary. BBBR was off his best and Scott Barrett should have started at lock. Add to that Taylor looked to have peaked a season ago. I thought Read played quite well but no one looked good tonight. We looked flat this week and if it’s because the Irish game took too much out of them then that is an issue.
I'm not sure it was so much an aging forward pack as, what they planned for and expected to happen - didn't. The lineout was a complete reversal on what i expected to happen - need to go back and look at how we lined up in that, because somehow we let Itoje just fucking kill us - seemed to be winning uncontested ball on their throw and getting up in front of our jumpers on ours -despite that we supposedly had four jumpers and they had two.
@Chris-B said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
we let Itoje just fucking kill us - seemed to be winning uncontested ball on their throw and getting up in front of our jumpers on ours -despite that we supposedly had four jumpers and they had two.
And we let that happen time and time again. Did we ever throw it to the front?
Sort of thing indicated lack of leadership.
