Hurricanes 2020
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I think it probably is a case of your bubble, positivity, stubborn - never give up. All attitudes which can help. You practise, and work with these guys all the time. See things going well in training, like and have good relationships with them. And pro game is a game of inches, so that ‘we were almost there’ ‘just that little bit more luck/composure’ etc. That is rolled out all the time by unsucessful teams, cos they can really see there team/plan working. Just it’s never quite there, sooooo close, let’s just persevere, etc.
So it becomes self fulfilling. Until things go so bad stuff really really has to change, like the Blues have, but even that takes time.
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I think it probably is a case of your bubble, positivity, stubborn - never give up. All attitudes which can help. You practise, and work with these guys all the time. See things going well in training, like and have good relationships with them. And pro game is a game of inches, so that ‘we were almost there’ ‘just that little bit more luck/composure’ etc. That is rolled out all the time by unsucessful teams, cos they can really see there team/plan working. Just it’s never quite there, sooooo close, let’s just persevere, etc.
So it becomes self fulfilling. Until things go so bad stuff really really has to change, like the Blues have, but even that takes time.
@Machpants things are clearly not working though, for example, how many times has Blackwell gone up for the ball in a line-out this year and missed because of his height? I've seriously lost count. Try all he likes, he's always going to be outplayed by his taller opponents. It's things like this along with the selection of guys like Prinsep, Armstrong etc that are holding us back from going to that next level.
The Canes pre Covid were heading in the right direction, you had Walker-Leawere & Flanders starting with the likes of Aumua and Fidow causing havoc off the bench. Now after lockdown, we have reverted back to the likes of Blackwell, Prinsep etc and we just look very ordinary. Yes those guys are leaders in the team but that doesn't mean squat when they don't perform their roles effectively and lead by example.
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@Machpants is Holland sabotaging the Canes on purpose or is he just really bad at his job?
@Canes4life said in Hurricanes 2020:
@Machpants is Holland sabotaging the Canes on purpose or is he just really bad at his job?
Good question.
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@Machpants things are clearly not working though, for example, how many times has Blackwell gone up for the ball in a line-out this year and missed because of his height? I've seriously lost count. Try all he likes, he's always going to be outplayed by his taller opponents. It's things like this along with the selection of guys like Prinsep, Armstrong etc that are holding us back from going to that next level.
The Canes pre Covid were heading in the right direction, you had Walker-Leawere & Flanders starting with the likes of Aumua and Fidow causing havoc off the bench. Now after lockdown, we have reverted back to the likes of Blackwell, Prinsep etc and we just look very ordinary. Yes those guys are leaders in the team but that doesn't mean squat when they don't perform their roles effectively and lead by example.
@Canes4life said in Hurricanes 2020:
The Canes pre Covid were heading in the right direction,
Agree but as soon as Blackwell recovered from his injury he was back in the side (vs Chief) and is keep on for the full 80 mins. But fortunately Prinsep was still injured and Tiatia wasn't in the side (as he only plays when Barrett is out). Re Armstrong. He was playing well enough before the break but he looks unfit now
The biggest issue with the poor players you listed is when defending. For example Blackwell can likely run all day but he's slow and unable to change direction quickly
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Where will Julian Savea wind up?
This is from an article behind the nzh paywall
However, Savea, who will turn 30 next month, has turned down an offer to play for Auckland in the Mitre 10 Cup and is understood to be highly unlikely to play club rugby despite training with Ponsonby recently.
"I'm open to anything," Savea told Ardie in an Instagram post after announcing his departure from Toulon. "Ideally, I'd like to be back with the Canes. "If that doesn't happen, it could be another franchise, it could be Japan, it could be the NZ Warriors." -
Hurricanes playing club rugby this weekend:
Wellington
Asafo Aumua (Avalon)
Salesi Rayasi (Hutt OBM)
Jonathan Taumateine (Marist StP)
Murphy Taramai (Upper Hutt Rams)
Simon Hickey (Poneke)Couldn't find any Canes in the Manawatu team lists and Hawke's Bay doesn't publish them.
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Hurricanes playing club rugby this weekend:
Wellington
Asafo Aumua (Avalon)
Salesi Rayasi (Hutt OBM)
Jonathan Taumateine (Marist StP)
Murphy Taramai (Upper Hutt Rams)
Simon Hickey (Poneke)Couldn't find any Canes in the Manawatu team lists and Hawke's Bay doesn't publish them.
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From the media write-up of the club rugby games in Hawke's Bay:
Isaia Walker-Leawere played for Clive. At no. 8. And scored a try.
Pouri Rakete-Stones played for Napier PirateDon't know whether Toala and Lowe played club rugby, today.
Edited to add that it appears from another article that Jonah Lowe played for Clive and played well.
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@Stargazer you seem to let Hawkes not publishing team sheets go a lot easier than the canes not publishing injured players. Go figure
@Bones said in Hurricanes 2020:
@Stargazer you seem to let Hawkes not publishing team sheets go a lot easier than the canes not publishing injured players. Go figure
Cut him a bit of slack. It is even difficult finding HBRFU press releases confirming the declartion of the Magpies come NPC time so no surprise the lack of Club lineups.
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From the media write-up of the club rugby games in Hawke's Bay:
Isaia Walker-Leawere played for Clive. At no. 8. And scored a try.
Pouri Rakete-Stones played for Napier PirateDon't know whether Toala and Lowe played club rugby, today.
Edited to add that it appears from another article that Jonah Lowe played for Clive and played well.
@Stargazer said in Hurricanes 2020:
From the media write-up of the club rugby games in Hawke's Bay:
Isaia Walker-Leawere played for Clive. At no. 8. And scored a try.
Pouri Rakete-Stones played for Napier PirateDon't know whether Toala and Lowe played club rugby, today.
Its hard to work out the reason for IWL being deemed not good enough to make the team. Its really weird. And useless Blackwell is.
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@Stargazer said in Hurricanes 2020:
From the media write-up of the club rugby games in Hawke's Bay:
Isaia Walker-Leawere played for Clive. At no. 8. And scored a try.
Pouri Rakete-Stones played for Napier PirateDon't know whether Toala and Lowe played club rugby, today.
Its hard to work out the reason for IWL being deemed not good enough to make the team. Its really weird. And useless Blackwell is.
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@Winger Are you guys starting to believe the bias we claim that goes against HB players now?
@Higgins said in Hurricanes 2020:
@Winger Are you guys starting to believe the bias we claim that goes against HB players now?
Maybe that's the reason. As Gibbes coached Wellington. But how do you explain useless Prinsep (Canterbury) with Fifita in the reserves. Or Numia missing out (to May and Armstrong). Or Aumea vs RR. My view is the coaches are picking on factors that have little to do with all round playing ability (like a good solid attitude rather than playing ability).
I would like a better mix of coaches in Wellington. esp someone with a PI background. Like Alama Ieremia or Filo Tiatia. At present coaches from other team must be looking at this overlooked players from Wellington. For example the Blues and Aumea. Fifita is a quality player but hes just being handled poorly at the Canes
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@Higgins said in Hurricanes 2020:
@Winger Are you guys starting to believe the bias we claim that goes against HB players now?
Maybe that's the reason. As Gibbes coached Wellington. But how do you explain useless Prinsep (Canterbury) with Fifita in the reserves. Or Numia missing out (to May and Armstrong). Or Aumea vs RR. My view is the coaches are picking on factors that have little to do with all round playing ability (like a good solid attitude rather than playing ability).
I would like a better mix of coaches in Wellington. esp someone with a PI background. Like Alama Ieremia or Filo Tiatia. At present coaches from other team must be looking at this overlooked players from Wellington. For example the Blues and Aumea. Fifita is a quality player but hes just being handled poorly at the Canes
@Winger said in Hurricanes 2020:
@Higgins said in Hurricanes 2020:
@Winger Are you guys starting to believe the bias we claim that goes against HB players now?
Maybe that's the reason. As Gibbes coached Wellington. But how do you explain useless Prinsep (Canterbury) with Fifita in the reserves. Or Numia missing out (to May and Armstrong). Or Aumea vs RR. My view is the coaches are picking on factors that have little to do with all round playing ability (like a good solid attitude rather than playing ability).
I would like a better mix of coaches in Wellington. esp someone with a PI background. Like Alama Ieremia or Filo Tiatia. At present coaches from other team must be looking at this overlooked players from Wellington. For example the Blues and Aumea. Fifita is a quality player but hes just being handled poorly at the Canes
As far as I know he has not signed any extension to his current contract with the Hurricanes which ends at the end of this season so that could have something to do with it. Perhaps we should alert Jauzy19 to see if he can ferret out if anything might be happening up his way with regards to Fifita?
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Some Hurricanes contract info in this article
Barrett’s contract allows him to explore other New Zealand franchises in 2021 but, after a powerhouse return from a shoulder injury, Lee was confident he’d be in the yellow jersey again next year.I suspect he'll have an offer from the Blues to consider
Loose forwards Vaea Fifita and Gareth Evans, and first five-eighth Jackson Garden-Bachop are among those off contract at season’s endFafita is worth keeping
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Some Hurricanes contract info in this article
Barrett’s contract allows him to explore other New Zealand franchises in 2021 but, after a powerhouse return from a shoulder injury, Lee was confident he’d be in the yellow jersey again next year.I suspect he'll have an offer from the Blues to consider
Loose forwards Vaea Fifita and Gareth Evans, and first five-eighth Jackson Garden-Bachop are among those off contract at season’s endFafita is worth keeping
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Some Hurricanes contract info in this article
Barrett’s contract allows him to explore other New Zealand franchises in 2021 but, after a powerhouse return from a shoulder injury, Lee was confident he’d be in the yellow jersey again next year.I suspect he'll have an offer from the Blues to consider
Loose forwards Vaea Fifita and Gareth Evans, and first five-eighth Jackson Garden-Bachop are among those off contract at season’s endFafita is worth keeping
@Duluth said in Hurricanes 2020:
Fafita is worth keeping
Agree. But maybe for Fifita's benefit he may be best off to move elsewhere. As these coaches don't seem to be able to get the best from him. Or rate him. Hes in for eg. a different league to say Blackwell at lock but isn't rated highly enough.
I hope they can also keep JGB too. He does the basics well. And Hickey doesn't full me with excitement. The key for the Canes is to keep Barrett. Without him (and esp with a limited player like Tiatia at FB) the Canes backline is a bit limited. For me he should be the AB fullback. He's better in this position than his brother
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Some Hurricanes contract info in this article
Barrett’s contract allows him to explore other New Zealand franchises in 2021 but, after a powerhouse return from a shoulder injury, Lee was confident he’d be in the yellow jersey again next year.I suspect he'll have an offer from the Blues to consider
Loose forwards Vaea Fifita and Gareth Evans, and first five-eighth Jackson Garden-Bachop are among those off contract at season’s endFafita is worth keeping
There's clearly something going on with Spencer apart from Covid 19. Maybe he wanted to he considered for the head role but wasn't. Or maybe there's a clash between Holland and Spencer. Because if all was sweet he would have stayed for another 6 games and then stepped down. So rugby fans can see through all the bullshit
It reminds me a bit of Watt being let go. Forget the bullshit and be up front. Canes need to do a lot more on this front. They need to improve their website (some players are not even listed). provide more info on players status (for eg whats happened to Numia). In general start HONESTLY communcating with the fans more. For eg explaining some of these weird selections. CoacheS should do a weekly report say to justify their selections and why some players are overlooked etc.
Overall the current CE isn't doing a great job (not even close). And NZR need to have a system where poor performing CE are helped. In an attempt to raise the bar esp for the slackers.
Plumtree said it was a difficult decision to let such a loyal member of the franchise go, but it was time for a change.
"Absolutely it was difficult, but we had to make that call. Watty has been involved with Wellington and the Hurricanes for a long period and done a fantastic job. -
There's clearly something going on with Spencer apart from Covid 19. Maybe he wanted to he considered for the head role but wasn't. Or maybe there's a clash between Holland and Spencer. Because if all was sweet he would have stayed for another 6 games and then stepped down. So rugby fans can see through all the bullshit
It reminds me a bit of Watt being let go. Forget the bullshit and be up front. Canes need to do a lot more on this front. They need to improve their website (some players are not even listed). provide more info on players status (for eg whats happened to Numia). In general start HONESTLY communcating with the fans more. For eg explaining some of these weird selections. CoacheS should do a weekly report say to justify their selections and why some players are overlooked etc.
Overall the current CE isn't doing a great job (not even close). And NZR need to have a system where poor performing CE are helped. In an attempt to raise the bar esp for the slackers.
Plumtree said it was a difficult decision to let such a loyal member of the franchise go, but it was time for a change.
"Absolutely it was difficult, but we had to make that call. Watty has been involved with Wellington and the Hurricanes for a long period and done a fantastic job.@Winger said in Hurricanes 2020:
There's clearly something going on with Spencer apart from Covid 19. Maybe he wanted to he considered for the head role but wasn't. Or maybe there's a clash between Holland and Spencer. Because if all was sweet he would have stayed for another 6 games and then stepped down. So rugby fans can see through all the bullshit
It reminds me a bit of Watt being let go. Forget the bullshit and be up front. Canes need to do a lot more on this front. They need to improve their website (some players are not even listed). provide more info on players status (for eg whats happened to Numia). In general start HONESTLY communcating with the fans more. For eg explaining some of these weird selections. CoacheS should do a weekly report say to justify their selections and why some players are overlooked etc.
Overall the current CE isn't doing a great job (not even close). And NZR need to have a system where poor performing CE are helped. In an attempt to raise the bar esp for the slackers.
Plumtree said it was a difficult decision to let such a loyal member of the franchise go, but it was time for a change.
"Absolutely it was difficult, but we had to make that call. Watty has been involved with Wellington and the Hurricanes for a long period and done a fantastic job.
And it would eb ebtter to say nothing or to be up front about it
Good to see you keep your conspiracy mindset sharp for rugby matters as well
I see the explanation from Los as being perfectly understandable. He was a dead man walking. No one likes working out a long notice.
Saw a chance to spend time with the family and put some efforts into re-planning his career.
Maybe there were some underlying things that helped that decision be easier to make but 'something going on', 'bullshit' and demands to 'be upfront' are plain stupid unless you have evidence to the contrary.
Maybe he didn't see himself as having a future there anyway and stepped early to give CJ a chance? Nah, that wouldn't be salacious enough. -
Some Hurricanes contract info in this article
Barrett’s contract allows him to explore other New Zealand franchises in 2021 but, after a powerhouse return from a shoulder injury, Lee was confident he’d be in the yellow jersey again next year.I suspect he'll have an offer from the Blues to consider
Loose forwards Vaea Fifita and Gareth Evans, and first five-eighth Jackson Garden-Bachop are among those off contract at season’s endFafita is worth keeping
@Duluth I take anything Avan Lee says with a grain of salt. He was also confident Beauden was staying until he didn't, and the promise he made around the signing of a quality first five for next hasn't yet eventuated.
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@Duluth said in Hurricanes 2020:
Fafita is worth keeping
Agree. But maybe for Fifita's benefit he may be best off to move elsewhere. As these coaches don't seem to be able to get the best from him. Or rate him. Hes in for eg. a different league to say Blackwell at lock but isn't rated highly enough.
I hope they can also keep JGB too. He does the basics well. And Hickey doesn't full me with excitement. The key for the Canes is to keep Barrett. Without him (and esp with a limited player like Tiatia at FB) the Canes backline is a bit limited. For me he should be the AB fullback. He's better in this position than his brother
@Winger said in Hurricanes 2020:
@Duluth said in Hurricanes 2020:
Fafita is worth keeping
Agree. But maybe for Fifita's benefit he may be best off to move elsewhere. As these coaches don't seem to be able to get the best from him. Or rate him. Hes in for eg. a different league to say Blackwell at lock but isn't rated highly enough.
I hope they can also keep JGB too. He does the basics well. And Hickey doesn't full me with excitement. The key for the Canes is to keep Barrett. Without him (and esp with a limited player like Tiatia at FB) the Canes backline is a bit limited. For me he should be the AB fullback. He's better in this position than his brother
Digging deeply into the memorybanks I seem to recall Fifita and Michael Fatialofa were the two locks that closed out the season the year the Hurricanes won the Title. He is now not even rated the number three blindside nor in the best two locks so something is obviously going on behind the scenes. His slump in form seems to have co-insided with the Plumtree's tenure of head coach commencing. At that time Plumtree announced to the world that Fifita was a lock whilst Steve Hansen was equally adamant that he was a blindside. Being placed behind Reid Princep must be a telling indicator that "we don't rate you or want you here any more" message to the kid.
