Americas Cup
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random late thought for the day as it's been bothering me since the weekend (obviously doing some procrastination here..).. only saw a little bit of racing on the weekend but I noticed this - can anyone explain why on the downwind legs the italians go straight down the course - as you'd expect - while the poms sail out to the sideline on an almost 45 degree angle. they were losing so much ground every time they did this
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random late thought for the day as it's been bothering me since the weekend (obviously doing some procrastination here..).. only saw a little bit of racing on the weekend but I noticed this - can anyone explain why on the downwind legs the italians go straight down the course - as you'd expect - while the poms sail out to the sideline on an almost 45 degree angle. they were losing so much ground every time they did this
@WillieTheWaiter I don't think they are, if you look at the lines, they are diverging from the "535m" line
these boats don't have spinnakers or the like like the old ones so theyre always going to have to go side to side to some extent to catch the wind
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@WillieTheWaiter I don't think they are, if you look at the lines, they are diverging from the "535m" line
these boats don't have spinnakers or the like like the old ones so theyre always going to have to go side to side to some extent to catch the wind
@Kiwiwomble said in Americas Cup:
@WillieTheWaiter I don't think they are, if you look at the lines, they are diverging from the "535m" line
these boats don't have spinnakers or the like like the old ones so theyre always going to have to go side to side to some extent to catch the wind
But the Italians seem to be able to "point higher" as Lester puts it. The ability to take a more direct course to the mark while maintaining speed is an obvious advantage
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@Kiwiwomble said in Americas Cup:
@WillieTheWaiter I don't think they are, if you look at the lines, they are diverging from the "535m" line
these boats don't have spinnakers or the like like the old ones so theyre always going to have to go side to side to some extent to catch the wind
But the Italians seem to be able to "point higher" as Lester puts it. The ability to take a more direct course to the mark while maintaining speed is an obvious advantage
@canefan yeah, they do have a better VMG, ours was normally a bit better too so the AC could be interesting if LR get through
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although with Ineos being the trailing boat doesnt that affect alot of thier tactics?
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although with Ineos being the trailing boat doesnt that affect alot of thier tactics?
@taniwharugby said in Americas Cup:
although with Ineos being the trailing boat doesnt that affect alot of thier tactics?
Spittle was very good at covering INEOS all the way. Their stodgy boat can't win a start, and Ainslie isn't helping. If they lose the start they are done. We will wait and see if Prada has the gas to overtake when trailing
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with the team getting more settled and making less big/noticeable mistakes.....win the start and tack on top = win the race
some interesting commentary the other day about these courses being quite small for boats going this fast, no room to really split too much to find different air
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with the team getting more settled and making less big/noticeable mistakes.....win the start and tack on top = win the race
some interesting commentary the other day about these courses being quite small for boats going this fast, no room to really split too much to find different air
@Kiwiwomble said in Americas Cup:
with the team getting more settled and making less big/noticeable mistakes.....win the start and tack on top = win the race
some interesting commentary the other day about these courses being quite small for boats going this fast, no room to really split too much to find different air
That is true. It doesn't take them long to travel the course. I suppose that's part of the idea, quick races. But it's been a bit processional so far
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@Kiwiwomble said in Americas Cup:
with the team getting more settled and making less big/noticeable mistakes.....win the start and tack on top = win the race
some interesting commentary the other day about these courses being quite small for boats going this fast, no room to really split too much to find different air
That is true. It doesn't take them long to travel the course. I suppose that's part of the idea, quick races. But it's been a bit processional so far
@canefan my memories of the 2000/2003 editions had them in close to each other doing proper tacking duels, dummy tacks to try and get clear etc....or proper splits as the courses were big enough that you could have good/different wind on both sides. someone spots something on the water in the distance and flys off away from the other boat
also boats sitting pretty much dead in the water so glad that part is gone
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The real America's Cup has finally arrived...
The organiser of the America's Cup and the Italian challenger of record are at loggerheads over whether the Prada Cup can continue under Covid-19 restrictions. Auckland will be at alert level 2 on Thursday. The Team New Zealand company America's Cup Event (ACE) wants to push the whole racing programme out by a week, including shifting the dates of the America's Cup match itself and Team UK supports this. However, the Challenger of Record (COR36), linked to the Luna Rossa team, wants to resume the challenger final on Friday and says if there is no racing before next Wednesday (February 24) the Prada Cup will be awarded to the team leading on that date. Luna Rossa currently leads Team UK 4-0, needing three more wins to win the series. Stuff understands COR-36 is more hopeful of there being racing this weekend under level 2 rules, than if Auckland was still in level 3. -
The real America's Cup has finally arrived...
The organiser of the America's Cup and the Italian challenger of record are at loggerheads over whether the Prada Cup can continue under Covid-19 restrictions. Auckland will be at alert level 2 on Thursday. The Team New Zealand company America's Cup Event (ACE) wants to push the whole racing programme out by a week, including shifting the dates of the America's Cup match itself and Team UK supports this. However, the Challenger of Record (COR36), linked to the Luna Rossa team, wants to resume the challenger final on Friday and says if there is no racing before next Wednesday (February 24) the Prada Cup will be awarded to the team leading on that date. Luna Rossa currently leads Team UK 4-0, needing three more wins to win the series. Stuff understands COR-36 is more hopeful of there being racing this weekend under level 2 rules, than if Auckland was still in level 3. -
@Machpants said in Americas Cup:
Luna Rosa are a bunch of legal loophole fluffybunnies
In the finest traditions of the AC
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@Machpants said in Americas Cup:
Luna Rosa are a bunch of legal loophole fluffybunnies
In the finest traditions of the AC
@canefan said in Americas Cup:
@Machpants said in Americas Cup:
Luna Rosa are a bunch of legal loophole fluffybunnies
In the finest traditions of the AC
True, but they're still all fluffybunnies!
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@canefan said in Americas Cup:
@Machpants said in Americas Cup:
Luna Rosa are a bunch of legal loophole fluffybunnies
In the finest traditions of the AC
True, but they're still all fluffybunnies!
@Machpants said in Americas Cup:
@canefan said in Americas Cup:
@Machpants said in Americas Cup:
Luna Rosa are a bunch of legal loophole fluffybunnies
In the finest traditions of the AC
True, but they're still all fluffybunnies!
Entitled little rich kid fluffybunnies
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Ineos just aren’t nimble enough in the start box to force the issue. Funny because I thought that would be the biggest worry for anyone sailing against them as Ainslie is a very good starting tactician.
It’s like the boat can’t manoeuvre without a lot of speed on.@Crucial said in Americas Cup:
Funny because I thought that would be the biggest worry for anyone sailing against them as Ainslie is a very good starting tactician.
I'm not convinced that he is. Sure you are correct that he has a pig of a boat to deal with during start maneuvers, and he is a superb sailor, one of the best ever, but pretty much everything he has won has been fleet racing. So, very little dial up or pre race tactical experience. He has one world match racing championship (2010) and not much else in one on one stuff. His inexperience showed the other day with the attempted hook.
Burling is a bit the same but he did win junior titles in match racing and has adapted well.Spithill has much more experience. Junior match titles, a 2nd and a 1st in world match race championships and then AC since Young Australia in 2000.
In the WMRC since 2011, Phil Robertson (a Kiwi) has 8th, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 7th, then won all of the last 3.
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I'm watching the live press conference. Looks like racing could start again on Sat.
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@Crucial said in Americas Cup:
Funny because I thought that would be the biggest worry for anyone sailing against them as Ainslie is a very good starting tactician.
I'm not convinced that he is. Sure you are correct that he has a pig of a boat to deal with during start maneuvers, and he is a superb sailor, one of the best ever, but pretty much everything he has won has been fleet racing. So, very little dial up or pre race tactical experience. He has one world match racing championship (2010) and not much else in one on one stuff. His inexperience showed the other day with the attempted hook.
Burling is a bit the same but he did win junior titles in match racing and has adapted well.Spithill has much more experience. Junior match titles, a 2nd and a 1st in world match race championships and then AC since Young Australia in 2000.
In the WMRC since 2011, Phil Robertson (a Kiwi) has 8th, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 7th, then won all of the last 3.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Americas Cup:
@WillieTheWaiter I don't think they are, if you look at the lines, they are diverging from the "535m" line
these boats don't have spinnakers or the like like the old ones so theyre always going to have to go side to side to some extent to catch the wind
But the Italians seem to be able to "point higher" as Lester puts it. The ability to take a more direct course to the mark while maintaining speed is an obvious advantage
@canefan said in Americas Cup:
@Kiwiwomble said in Americas Cup:
@WillieTheWaiter I don't think they are, if you look at the lines, they are diverging from the "535m" line
these boats don't have spinnakers or the like like the old ones so theyre always going to have to go side to side to some extent to catch the wind
But the Italians seem to be able to "point higher" as Lester puts it. The ability to take a more direct course to the mark while maintaining speed is an obvious advantage
Both of those are true although not really doing it to catch the wind as such - semantics. Nobody will sail directly downwind as the fastest that they can go is the wind speed. They are effectively broad reaching (even though they look close hauled) to generate boatspeed and therefor apparent wind which moves the wind direction forward, hence looking close hauled - if that makes sense.
I'm guessing, but Luna Rosa are probably achieving better VMG (pointing higher with boat speed) with rigging, sail design and trimming than anything in the water (foils / rudder).
