T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus
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Righto, late to the thread. Saw up to the last few overs last night, when it was apparent we wouldn't win.
I'm not as disappointed as others. This is a classy lineup from Aus, and it was one of those nights with luck just not going our way. Boult stands one pace differently, Finch gets an (apparently not plumb) LBW, and that game is a different beast. Once they got away, 210 looked a very very tough chase.
I still think Aus is weak in the batting, they are playing a lot of allrounders. Maybe not critical in T20, but pure batters should be better.
So overall, I wouldn't be calling for changes. Also, I've piled into Southee on many an occasion for his batting, but last night with 90 off 30 needed isn't the time to worry about him. We lost that game in the field, and to an outstanding spell from their young extra fast bowler.
So overlal, it's a loss, that's T20, get up and play again soon. Friday night the next one I think? I'm more worried about the Women - they played terribly (again) and fell apart (again)
@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
I'm more worried about the Women - they played terribly (again) and fell apart (again)
Over the last few years they seem to easily bully the teams ranked below them, but then they get badly bullied by the teams ranked above them...
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@mn5 said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@kiwimurph said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@westcoastie said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
When Southee is in at 8 - you know we're ducked.
Just like that hes gone. For someone who's been a captain, christ he's irresponsible
You can't be seriously having a go at Southee there. 90 needed off of 30. What's he supposed to do?
Ah yes, much like an unwanted season you can always rely on the fern to have a go at Southees batting.....
On related note, Santner is ruled out of the game through illness, and the Black Caps go from winning well to badly thrashed.... but not a mention of Santner...
@donsteppa said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@mn5 said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@kiwimurph said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@westcoastie said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
When Southee is in at 8 - you know we're ducked.
Just like that hes gone. For someone who's been a captain, christ he's irresponsible
You can't be seriously having a go at Southee there. 90 needed off of 30. What's he supposed to do?
Ah yes, much like an unwanted season you can always rely on the fern to have a go at Southees batting.....
On related note, Santner is ruled out of the game through illness, and the Black Caps go from winning well to badly thrashed.... but not a mention of Santner...
Hey come on now, I was quite magnanimous in my praise of his last test performance
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Maxwell is awesome to watch in full flight, a unique and entertaining player.
Finch will be feeling good today. She's a funny game cricket, sometimes all you need is a decent piece of luck and suddenly the ball magically starts finding the middle.
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To be fair the Aussies have come prepared for him. They know he gets steep bounce and that bowled and lbw are out of play for most balls. They have decided that ramp shots and using the pace to go behind the wicket is a great option especially when the restrictions are in place.
It’s up to our coaches to counter couch the tactics.@crucial said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
To be fair the Aussies have come prepared for him. They know he gets steep bounce and that bowled and lbw are out of play for most balls.
Jamieson.
I haven't yet read all of the thread after last nights match but the comms said that he has very high % for those dismissals. Where did you get that from?It seems logical but it doesn't appear to be true. With his stock ball it might be (as you said - most balls) but his dismissal balls are the opposite - that is why it works.
He has a long way to go in white ball cricket it seems, but he seems to have the work ethic to achieve.
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@crucial said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
To be fair the Aussies have come prepared for him. They know he gets steep bounce and that bowled and lbw are out of play for most balls.
Jamieson.
I haven't yet read all of the thread after last nights match but the comms said that he has very high % for those dismissals. Where did you get that from?It seems logical but it doesn't appear to be true. With his stock ball it might be (as you said - most balls) but his dismissal balls are the opposite - that is why it works.
He has a long way to go in white ball cricket it seems, but he seems to have the work ethic to achieve.
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@crucial said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
To be fair the Aussies have come prepared for him. They know he gets steep bounce and that bowled and lbw are out of play for most balls.
Jamieson.
I haven't yet read all of the thread after last nights match but the comms said that he has very high % for those dismissals. Where did you get that from?It seems logical but it doesn't appear to be true. With his stock ball it might be (as you said - most balls) but his dismissal balls are the opposite - that is why it works.
He has a long way to go in white ball cricket it seems, but he seems to have the work ethic to achieve.
He did well in ODIs. I agree, he'll get it
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@crucial said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
To be fair the Aussies have come prepared for him. They know he gets steep bounce and that bowled and lbw are out of play for most balls.
Jamieson.
I haven't yet read all of the thread after last nights match but the comms said that he has very high % for those dismissals. Where did you get that from?It seems logical but it doesn't appear to be true. With his stock ball it might be (as you said - most balls) but his dismissal balls are the opposite - that is why it works.
He has a long way to go in white ball cricket it seems, but he seems to have the work ethic to achieve.
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@snowy on another night last night he could have had 3-4 wickets. Bowled much better than the first two I reckon, despite getting some tap.
@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy on another night last night he could have had 3-4 wickets. Bowled much better than the first two I reckon, despite getting some tap.
For sure. He was seriously unlucky, the extra bounce did cause some issues and the top edges did come, they just went frustratingly into the space between fielders.
I was getting at the assertion that bowled and LBW aren't a mode of dismissal for him. The stats disagree according to the TB guys and gals. He will be good at all forms I think, just needs a bit of time.
Someone mentioned Lockie earlier, any ideas when he might be back? Meredith did some damage last night and I want to see us match that - variation and all.
How about news on CDG? He would have given us a bowling option rather than the shit that Jimmy is (as a bowler, I'd still have him in the team, he is a part timer, not 4 overs).
Lockie, CDG, Santner (despite the shit he gets on here is a seriously good white ball cricketer). Add Milne in and we have some depth.
The coaches in the early days of T20 were correct it seems - specialist players.
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@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy on another night last night he could have had 3-4 wickets. Bowled much better than the first two I reckon, despite getting some tap.
For sure. He was seriously unlucky, the extra bounce did cause some issues and the top edges did come, they just went frustratingly into the space between fielders.
I was getting at the assertion that bowled and LBW aren't a mode of dismissal for him. The stats disagree according to the TB guys and gals. He will be good at all forms I think, just needs a bit of time.
Someone mentioned Lockie earlier, any ideas when he might be back? Meredith did some damage last night and I want to see us match that - variation and all.
How about news on CDG? He would have given us a bowling option rather than the shit that Jimmy is (as a bowler, I'd still have him in the team, he is a part timer, not 4 overs).
Lockie, CDG, Santner (despite the shit he gets on here is a seriously good white ball cricketer). Add Milne in and we have some depth.
The coaches in the early days of T20 were correct it seems - specialist players.
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@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy on another night last night he could have had 3-4 wickets. Bowled much better than the first two I reckon, despite getting some tap.
For sure. He was seriously unlucky, the extra bounce did cause some issues and the top edges did come, they just went frustratingly into the space between fielders.
I was getting at the assertion that bowled and LBW aren't a mode of dismissal for him. The stats disagree according to the TB guys and gals. He will be good at all forms I think, just needs a bit of time.
Someone mentioned Lockie earlier, any ideas when he might be back? Meredith did some damage last night and I want to see us match that - variation and all.
How about news on CDG? He would have given us a bowling option rather than the shit that Jimmy is (as a bowler, I'd still have him in the team, he is a part timer, not 4 overs).
Lockie, CDG, Santner (despite the shit he gets on here is a seriously good white ball cricketer). Add Milne in and we have some depth.
The coaches in the early days of T20 were correct it seems - specialist players.
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
How about news on CDG? He would have given us a bowling option rather than the shit that Jimmy is (as a bowler, I'd still have him in the team, he is a part timer, not 4 overs).
Back playing for ND, but only as a batsmen. He was out first ball yesterday.
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@canefan said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy Milne is in the squad, might be an opportunity to get him in there
Yeah, I saw that, but he's not much of a batsman is he (not bad from memory, but Chapman is a batsman), so who does he replace?
@Bovidae That's not much help on any front from him. Doesn't bowl and gets a golden duck. Bugger. He would have given Kane some options and we needed them.
I actually don't think we need to change too much personnel wise, it was just chasing a huge total that did us.
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
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@canefan said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy Milne is in the squad, might be an opportunity to get him in there
Yeah, I saw that, but he's not much of a batsman is he (not bad from memory, but Chapman is a batsman), so who does he replace?
@Bovidae That's not much help on any front from him. Doesn't bowl and gets a golden duck. Bugger. He would have given Kane some options and we needed them.
I actually don't think we need to change too much personnel wise, it was just chasing a huge total that did us.
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
In fairness to Southee, he's been bowling brilliantly in the white ball version recently. Everyone gets stick at teh end of at T20 - but BOult has pulled a few exceptional overs out this series. Swings and roundabouts
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@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
In fairness to Southee, he's been bowling brilliantly in the white ball version recently. Everyone gets stick at teh end of at T20 - but BOult has pulled a few exceptional overs out this series. Swings and roundabouts
@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
In fairness to Southee, he's been bowling brilliantly in the white ball version recently. Everyone gets stick at teh end of at T20 - but BOult has pulled a few exceptional overs out this series. Swings and roundabouts
Yes he has been OK (brilliant is a stretch), and yes obviously everybody gets hit at the end, but the question was do we have better options to protect the final overs? It has been a problem for a while and Tim has been the go to guy - that hasn't managed it to an acceptable level. IMO of course.
We should be looking to be better, not just accept what we have. If we don't question who we have then we just roll out the same team every time?
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@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
In fairness to Southee, he's been bowling brilliantly in the white ball version recently. Everyone gets stick at teh end of at T20 - but BOult has pulled a few exceptional overs out this series. Swings and roundabouts
Yes he has been OK (brilliant is a stretch), and yes obviously everybody gets hit at the end, but the question was do we have better options to protect the final overs? It has been a problem for a while and Tim has been the go to guy - that hasn't managed it to an acceptable level. IMO of course.
We should be looking to be better, not just accept what we have. If we don't question who we have then we just roll out the same team every time?
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
In fairness to Southee, he's been bowling brilliantly in the white ball version recently. Everyone gets stick at teh end of at T20 - but BOult has pulled a few exceptional overs out this series. Swings and roundabouts
Yes he has been OK (brilliant is a stretch), and yes obviously everybody gets hit at the end, but the question was do we have better options to protect the final overs? It has been a problem for a while and Tim has been the go to guy - that hasn't managed it to an acceptable level. IMO of course.
We should be looking to be better, not just accept what we have. If we don't question who we have then we just roll out the same team every time?
First spells of Timmy below:
Chc:
3-0-10-2Dun: Tim Southee
2-0-7-1Wlg
Tim Southee
2-0-9-0 -
Never in the history of the game will the Aussies come out meekly when 2 nil down in a best of 5. That said, I thought our bowlers were all over the place. Especially noticeable when you saw the efficient line and length of the black/ green (?) team in the second dig.
Our fielding and throwing was shit too - slight worry. Chasing 200 odd with no crowd? yeah nah.
Oh well, t20 ain't never a game to dwell on results or navel gaze too deeply. Next game is massive but I'm ready for Oz to win the next 2, it's just what the fluffybunnies seem to do to us!
Ps. I had a depressing thought for the future in one moment - 5 years on someone opines "did we ruin Jamieson by playing him in too many t20s too early?"
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@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
In fairness to Southee, he's been bowling brilliantly in the white ball version recently. Everyone gets stick at teh end of at T20 - but BOult has pulled a few exceptional overs out this series. Swings and roundabouts
Yes he has been OK (brilliant is a stretch), and yes obviously everybody gets hit at the end, but the question was do we have better options to protect the final overs? It has been a problem for a while and Tim has been the go to guy - that hasn't managed it to an acceptable level. IMO of course.
We should be looking to be better, not just accept what we have. If we don't question who we have then we just roll out the same team every time?
First spells of Timmy below:
Chc:
3-0-10-2Dun: Tim Southee
2-0-7-1Wlg
Tim Southee
2-0-9-0@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@nzzp said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
In fairness to Southee, he's been bowling brilliantly in the white ball version recently. Everyone gets stick at teh end of at T20 - but BOult has pulled a few exceptional overs out this series. Swings and roundabouts
Yes he has been OK (brilliant is a stretch), and yes obviously everybody gets hit at the end, but the question was do we have better options to protect the final overs? It has been a problem for a while and Tim has been the go to guy - that hasn't managed it to an acceptable level. IMO of course.
We should be looking to be better, not just accept what we have. If we don't question who we have then we just roll out the same team every time?
First spells of Timmy below:
Chc:
3-0-10-2Dun: Tim Southee
2-0-7-1Wlg
Tim Southee
2-0-9-0What have you got for the end of his spells was the point?
We know that he is good at the start. I said that.
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@canefan said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
@snowy Milne is in the squad, might be an opportunity to get him in there
Yeah, I saw that, but he's not much of a batsman is he (not bad from memory, but Chapman is a batsman), so who does he replace?
@Bovidae That's not much help on any front from him. Doesn't bowl and gets a golden duck. Bugger. He would have given Kane some options and we needed them.
I actually don't think we need to change too much personnel wise, it was just chasing a huge total that did us.
The tweaks that we could make (if everybody is healthy) could make us much better though. I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
I'm no Southee hater but he does seem to be better suited to the longer forms, particularly red ball, and should never be given the ball at the end of a white ball match. Lockie might be better, or Milne.
Sorry - I was responding to this bit of your post, and we've had posts cross in electron land.
Arguing he gets smacked at the end (he did) doesn't mean he shouldn't bowl. He's been very very good in white ball cricket for a while. Honestly, his pace is up as well - mid 130s is better than he used to manage!
But yeah, gets smacked at the end. Some of that is the match situation too ... but I wouldn't be dropping southee on his current form
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We also need to go back a bit further than this series and see who else is worth a go. Just a comparison of whom might be better at each format. All good players.
@snowy said in T20 Internationals. Nz v Aus:
We also need to go back a bit further than this series and see who else is worth a go. Just a comparison of whom might be better at each format. All good players.
Southee's shit
