Black Caps vs Proteas 2022
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@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
The team looks weak as anything without KW, Rossco and Boult there.
SA to take the series 2-0
I'm thinking 1 - 1, or even 1 - 0 to us, depending on how SA adjust to the conditions. Partly that Boult could be back for the second test, and partly that de Grandhomme might dry up the scoring at one end for Wags to put even more pressure on. Plus our top three with the bat.
(Though my brain is doing its best to block out the Bay Oval memories...)
@donsteppa said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
The team looks weak as anything without KW, Rossco and Boult there.
SA to take the series 2-0
I'm thinking 1 - 1, or even 1 - 0 to us, depending on how SA adjust to the conditions. Partly that Boult could be back for the second test, and partly that de Grandhomme might dry up the scoring at one end for Wags to put even more pressure on. Plus our top three with the bat.
(Though my brain is doing its best to block out the Bay Oval memories...)
It was a slightly over dramatic post…..it should be a pretty damn close series.
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
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@donsteppa said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
The team looks weak as anything without KW, Rossco and Boult there.
SA to take the series 2-0
I'm thinking 1 - 1, or even 1 - 0 to us, depending on how SA adjust to the conditions. Partly that Boult could be back for the second test, and partly that de Grandhomme might dry up the scoring at one end for Wags to put even more pressure on. Plus our top three with the bat.
(Though my brain is doing its best to block out the Bay Oval memories...)
It was a slightly over dramatic post…..it should be a pretty damn close series.
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
It's at least theoretically possible that in a couple of years time in a T20 or ODI v an Associate Member Nation there could be a Black Caps side including sons of Latham, Rutherford, B Bracewell, Cumming, Kuggeleijn, and Pringle.
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The selection of Mitchell for over Ravindra for the second test v Bangladesh at Hagley Oval was a poor one IMO. Short sighted.
Now, I'm a big fan of Mitchell, and think he is currently a better test player than Ravindra. I also have very little nerves about him having to come into the team as a short term replacement - as he shows he has confidence in his game at the age and the stage of his career that he is. So if Mitchell had missed Bangles second test and was being drafted in this week I would be no less confident in him.
I didn't kick up a fuss at the time and write a scathing anonymous post on the silverfern !!! ..... as it wasn't that unexpected. They don't pick a spinner at Hagley. Last year Santner played at Mt Maunganui and was replaced the next week at Hagley by Mitchell. So it was par for the course and I wasn't surprised. Just a bit disappointed at the short sightedness.
Ravindra playing at 6 or 7 and as the part time spinner is really just the cheats code for trying to get him into the test 11 slightly quicker, where he is expected to eventually open. We are further away form that scenario than we needed to be, and now 2 openings have come up in the top 4, and we have a makeshift 3/4 opening and an opener down at 7 (maybe). If, in this alternative universe, Ravindra had scored even a 40 or something in the 2nd Bangladesh test, then taking a punt and just getting on with it and elevating him to open could be on.... it's not even a possibility next week. If he hadn't grabbed a chance in 2nd Bangles test and had failed again, then could put him back to Plunket for a year with no qualms.
Shark mentioned in an earlier post about whether we have missed opportunities to blood players. IMO we haven't except for this very one minor occasion. This team will age together, and that's just something I can accept.
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@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
It's at least theoretically possible that in a couple of years time in a T20 or ODI v an Associate Member Nation there could be a Black Caps side including sons of Latham, Rutherford, B Bracewell, Cumming, Kuggeleijn, and Pringle.
@donsteppa said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
It's at least theoretically possible that in a couple of years time in a T20 or ODI v an Associate Member Nation there could be a Black Caps side including sons of Latham, Rutherford, B Bracewell, Cumming, Kuggeleijn, and Pringle.
I think they’ll all want to have considerably better careers than their old men, harsh but fair.
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@donsteppa said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
The team looks weak as anything without KW, Rossco and Boult there.
SA to take the series 2-0
I'm thinking 1 - 1, or even 1 - 0 to us, depending on how SA adjust to the conditions. Partly that Boult could be back for the second test, and partly that de Grandhomme might dry up the scoring at one end for Wags to put even more pressure on. Plus our top three with the bat.
(Though my brain is doing its best to block out the Bay Oval memories...)
It was a slightly over dramatic post…..it should be a pretty damn close series.
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
I had a look a couple of days ago at Plunket Shield performances and based purely on stats it's a pretty small field to pick from.
I thought Fletcher, Bruce, Cleaver and Rutherford - and now just maybe Chapman, because he's got international experience.
Greg Hay seems a bit unlucky never to have got a shot at internationals somewhere along the line, but he's a bit long in the tooth now.
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Not quite the squad I was expecting, but an interesting one. Perhaps:
- Young
- Latham (c)
- Conway
- Nicholls
- Mitchell
- Blundell
- Ravindra
- de Grandhomme
- Jamieson
- Southee
- Wagner
... with 5, 6, 7, & 8 probably in any random order, depending on the state of the game?
On paper that is a short tail, and has six bowling options, but is also a 5 - 8 that could vanish quickly with the bat, depending on their collective day.
@donsteppa said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Not quite the squad I was expecting, but an interesting one. Perhaps:
- Young
- Latham (c)
- Conway
- Nicholls
- Mitchell
- Blundell
- Ravindra
- de Grandhomme
- Jamieson
- Southee
- Wagner
... with 5, 6, 7, & 8 probably in any random order, depending on the state of the game?
On paper that is a short tail, and has six bowling options, but is also a 5 - 8 that could vanish quickly with the bat, depending on their collective day.
I don't mind that except Colin doesn't have much form.
What happened to Glenn Phillips?
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@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
I had a look a couple of days ago at Plunket Shield performances and based purely on stats it's a pretty small field to pick from.
I thought Fletcher, Bruce, Cleaver and Rutherford - and now just maybe Chapman, because he's got international experience.
Greg Hay seems a bit unlucky never to have got a shot at internationals somewhere along the line, but he's a bit long in the tooth now.
@chris-b said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
I had a look a couple of days ago at Plunket Shield performances and based purely on stats it's a pretty small field to pick from.
PS has been in a 2 month hiatus as usual. And when it was out of its hiatus the Auckland lockdown affected Auckland (0 games) and ND (1 game). Although ND and Auckland just had a catch up game over the weekend.
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@chris-b said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Interesting to see Kens son come back from the wilderness !
I had a look a couple of days ago at Plunket Shield performances and based purely on stats it's a pretty small field to pick from.
PS has been in a 2 month hiatus as usual. And when it was out of its hiatus the Auckland lockdown affected Auckland (0 games) and ND (1 game). Although ND and Auckland just had a catch up game over the weekend.
@rapido Yeah - I was looking at who was around as contenders and who of them had shown some form.
e.g. I didn't pick Nick Kelly based on one score.
If people aren't averaging more than 40 I didn't consider them - and remarkably there are only a handful averaging between 30 and 40 - Raval and Santner among them are known quantities - as is Wheeler.
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@rapido Yeah - I was looking at who was around as contenders and who of them had shown some form.
e.g. I didn't pick Nick Kelly based on one score.
If people aren't averaging more than 40 I didn't consider them - and remarkably there are only a handful averaging between 30 and 40 - Raval and Santner among them are known quantities - as is Wheeler.
@chris-b said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido Yeah - I was looking at who was around as contenders and who of them had shown some form.
e.g. I didn't pick Nick Kelly based on one score.
If people aren't averaging more than 40 I didn't consider them - and remarkably there are only a handful averaging between 30 and 40 - Raval and Santner among them are known quantities - as is Wheeler.
Lockdowns, plus scheduling. A lot of the fringe players missed some or all Oct/Nov Plunket shield window.
Of the fringe younger batters:
Phillips missed everything. IPL and then blackcaps T20 stuff.
Chapman missed everththing until this weekend - Auckland lockdown plus would have missed some anyway as on Bangladesh tour.
Mitchell - backcaps T20 tours.
Seiffert - same as Phillips.
Ravindra - got in 2 rounds, then on Bangladesh tour.Plunket Shield was left to the older batsmen and the wicket keepers to dominate. Although, ball dominates bat last few season at that time of year.
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Either Henry straight swap for Boult as bew ball bowler. Or CdG in as 3rd seamer and elevate Jamieson to opening.
I dont mind, both have their merits.
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
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@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
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@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
it offends my traditional sensibilities to have our 3rd seamer a dibbly dobbly medium pacer. It also gives me Gavin Larsen flashbacks.
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Good to see Cam Fletcher get a crack I did mention him a while back when we were discussing other WK options.
@chris said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Good to see Cam Fletcher get a crack I did mention him a while back when we were discussing other WK options.
Dane Cleaver can be considered unlucky if you compare their FC stats.
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@chris said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Good to see Cam Fletcher get a crack I did mention him a while back when we were discussing other WK options.
Dane Cleaver can be considered unlucky if you compare their FC stats.
@bovidae said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@chris said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Good to see Cam Fletcher get a crack I did mention him a while back when we were discussing other WK options.
Dane Cleaver can be considered unlucky if you compare their FC stats.
I think Cam Fletcher is a better gloveman so that got him the squad pick.And Cam is 28 Dane 30 maybe that had a bearing on selection.
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@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
The longer he waits the angrier he gets. It’s a good system.
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@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
The longer he waits the angrier he gets. It’s a good system.
@mn5 said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
The longer he waits the angrier he gets. It’s a good system.
With a fully fit squad we would have been a great chance to correct the zero test series win ever stat, I now have little hope of this changing this year. With the accuracy of Southee and Jamieson of late and the addition of CDG...Wags is going to have to put on his superman suit
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@chris said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Good to see Cam Fletcher get a crack I did mention him a while back when we were discussing other WK options.
Dane Cleaver can be considered unlucky if you compare their FC stats.
@bovidae said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@chris said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
Good to see Cam Fletcher get a crack I did mention him a while back when we were discussing other WK options.
Dane Cleaver can be considered unlucky if you compare their FC stats.
It's hard to pick from those 2. Cleaver has just had their first child and missed some recent games, so that may be a factor. I assume they are forming a 3 week bubble down in Chch. So I wouldn't be surprised if he was probably out of contention anyway.
I'll leave judgements of glovework to those more in the know.
All things being equal, personally, I'd have had Cleaver to be pushing Blundell in red ball.
I'd be giving Fletcher opportunity to be first pick in white ball (well, T20 definitely) to replace Seiffert. Latham in ODIs is a different story.Fletcher bats more like a keeper. Cleaver more like a batsman.
I like that Fletcher has specialised as a finisher in white ball. That is where the gap is at NZ level.I like that Cleaver has moved to batting top 4 for CD in PS. Taking on a harder role against newer red ball and fresher bowlers. He would be a better like-for-like fit for that batsman//keeper in the top 6 like Watling/Blundell. However, in theory Ravindra/Mitchell should be more reliable bats than the Watling era number 7s Santner/CdG so maybe this isn't a problem.
Only 14 months between them in age. But as this team is ageing in one big looming talent cliff. Maybe Fletcher's slight extra youth is worth it.
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@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
it offends my traditional sensibilities to have our 3rd seamer a dibbly dobbly medium pacer. It also gives me Gavin Larsen flashbacks.
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@mariner4life said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
@rapido said in Black Caps vs Proteas 2022:
CdG in as 3rd seamer
i hate you for triggering me like this
It's not a big deal when we have Wagner who has basically invented a new position, the specialist 4th seamer.
it offends my traditional sensibilities to have our 3rd seamer a dibbly dobbly medium pacer. It also gives me Gavin Larsen flashbacks.
And SCG opening bowling flashbacks.
