NZ Cricket
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@Chris said in NZ Cricket:
To be honest I would expect everyone to score big v Nepal for NZ not exactly a power force in Cricket
They had no idea V Afghanistan or Pakistan..The are good enough us apparently:
That team has five players who have played for the Black Caps and four other who have had reasonable domestic careers (two not so much).
@LABCAT said in NZ Cricket:
@Chris said in NZ Cricket:
To be honest I would expect everyone to score big v Nepal for NZ not exactly a power force in Cricket
They had no idea V Afghanistan or Pakistan..The are good enough us apparently:
That team has five players who have played for the Black Caps and four other who have had reasonable domestic careers (two not so much).
Says more about the quality of the NZ u/19 teams
Nepal do not play in any tier 1 competions not a good look for NZ under age teams.
And if that is the criteria NZ under age teams are judged by we are doing well as we are as good as Nepal at u/19 level it is worse than I thought.If Australia lost to Nepal at that level there would a major shake up of the system as there has been before.
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There are plenty of development issues to work on in NZ Cricket. It’d take me ages to list them on the phone. And not that I can do much to help.
That said, an Australian opener has just carried his bat, yet the other 10 couldn’t stay with him against a team that hasn’t beaten them at home since 1997. The joys of cricket
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We also lost to Nepal in the 2005/06 tournament.
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There are plenty of development issues to work on in NZ Cricket. It’d take me ages to list them on the phone. And not that I can do much to help.
That said, an Australian opener has just carried his bat, yet the other 10 couldn’t stay with him against a team that hasn’t beaten them at home since 1997. The joys of cricket
@Donsteppa said in NZ Cricket:
There are plenty of development issues to work on in NZ Cricket. It’d take me ages to list them on the phone. And not that I can do much to help.
That said, an Australian opener has just carried his bat, yet the other 10 couldn’t stay with him against a team that hasn’t beaten them at home since 1997. The joys of cricket
I am sure their is a bounce back due soon.
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@Chris said in NZ Cricket:
This NZ u/19 side is one of the worst batting units I have seen.
The bowling is ok Rowe and Clarke look promising but the batting is very weak and some very average batting technique.We have never been famous for our U19 sides... I think Reddy and the skipper Jackson look handy prospects.
The commentators pointed out last night that only a couple of players from each side generally have international careers, and only half domestic careers.
@frugby said in NZ Cricket:
@Chris said in NZ Cricket:
This NZ u/19 side is one of the worst batting units I have seen.
The bowling is ok Rowe and Clarke look promising but the batting is very weak and some very average batting technique.We have never been famous for our U19 sides... I think Reddy and the skipper Jackson look handy prospects.
The commentators pointed out last night that only a couple of players from each side generally have international careers, and only half domestic careers.
Depends what is meant by 'careers', but ...
Looking back at previous squads.
It would be 6 to 7 end up playing senior international cricket (in a good 2-year-cycle crop).
2 to 4 when you have a bad cycle.
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Just watching the U/19s bat against India
Jones has his off stump cleaned up first ball.
Reddy gets hit on the pad first ball doesn’t read the inswinger
Then plays all over a straight one LBW 2nd ball.
NZ 2 down for 0
Terrible to watch not a decent batting technique to be seen. -
Squad announced for the T20 WC in the Windies
Kane Williamson (c)
Finn Allen
Trent Boult
Michael Bracewell
Mark Chapman
Devon Conway
Lockie Ferguson
Matt Henry
Daryl Mitchell
Jimmy Neesham
Glenn Phillips
Rachin Ravindra
Mitchell Santner
Ish Sodhi
Tim Southee
Ben Sears (travelling reserve)https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/sport/515469/cricket-tim-southee-chosen-for-his-seventh-t20-world-cup
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We are going to be chasing some big scores looking at that bowling attack or we are going to need to set very big targets.
@Chris said in NZ Cricket:
We are going to be chasing some big scores looking at that bowling attack or we are going to need to set very big targets.
I'd play Sears over Southee. And hopefully he makes me eat my words, but I can see a whole lotta leather retrieval in our future.
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@Chris said in NZ Cricket:
We are going to be chasing some big scores looking at that bowling attack or we are going to need to set very big targets.
I'd play Sears over Southee. And hopefully he makes me eat my words, but I can see a whole lotta leather retrieval in our future.
@nzzp said in NZ Cricket:
@Chris said in NZ Cricket:
We are going to be chasing some big scores looking at that bowling attack or we are going to need to set very big targets.
I'd play Sears over Southee. And hopefully he makes me eat my words, but I can see a whole lotta leather retrieval in our future.
Yeah Sears over Southee would be my pick but he only is a travelling reserve.
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Squad announced for the T20 WC in the Windies
Kane Williamson (c)
Finn Allen
Trent Boult
Michael Bracewell
Mark Chapman
Devon Conway
Lockie Ferguson
Matt Henry
Daryl Mitchell
Jimmy Neesham
Glenn Phillips
Rachin Ravindra
Mitchell Santner
Ish Sodhi
Tim Southee
Ben Sears (travelling reserve)https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/sport/515469/cricket-tim-southee-chosen-for-his-seventh-t20-world-cup
@nzzp said in NZ Cricket:
Squad announced for the T20 WC in the Windies
Kane Williamson (c)
Finn Allen
Trent Boult
Michael Bracewell
Mark Chapman
Devon Conway
Lockie Ferguson
Matt Henry
Daryl Mitchell
Jimmy Neesham
Glenn Phillips
Rachin Ravindra
Mitchell Santner
Ish Sodhi
Tim Southee
Ben Sears (travelling reserve)https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/sport/515469/cricket-tim-southee-chosen-for-his-seventh-t20-world-cup
A pretty handy bunch of players in this form of the game. They could go far…..or they could crap out spectacularly. Exciting stuff either way !
I’m shocked Southee has been picked.
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Time to cut short Gary Stead’s reign as Black Caps head coach
Ian AndersonOPINION: Scott Weenink’s first major personnel decision should be to acknowledge his predecessor made a mistake.
The chief executive of New Zealand Cricket now needs to rule that Gary Stead won’t see out his term as Black Caps coach following the side’s exit from the T20 World Cup.
Weenink should cut short Stead’s contract - which has him in the job until the middle of next year - after New Zealand’s preparation and performances were sadly lacking at the tournament.
In doing so, he’d be admitting David White and fellow decision-makers erred when re-appointing the measured Cantabrian for another two years in July 2023.
Since then, the test side has drawn a series in Bangladesh, battled at home past a third-rate South African side, and been swept in two tests here by Australia.
The Black Caps made the semifinals of the 2023 ODI World Cup in India with a 5-4 winning record before being knocked out by the hosts.
But the ignominious T20 World Cup exit will weigh heavily as to whether an immediate change of the man in charge is required.
In isolation, defeats to an Afghanistan side - which showed at the ODI World Cup they belong among the echelon of playoff contenders - and the Cup co-hosts and two-times champs the Windies on woeful wickets wouldn’t be cause for a major upheaval.
Yet there was a startling lack of conviction in both games and an inability to respond with answers when under pressure.
Combined with the three changes made to the XI after one outing, and the shambles surrounding a lack of build-up games, it feels like there is now a compelling need for a significant rebuilding process to take place over the next few years.
That would start with a new head coach, who would oversee the twilight of the careers of the likes of long-time superstar new-ball bowlers Trent Boult and Tim Southee as part of an ageing side slipping in standards, and how much he can continue to get out of a large bunch of players in their early thirties while leaning on the likes of Rachin Ravindra and Will O’Rourke to become the new standard-bearers.
Stead has been an unqualified success for much of his reign, even allowing for the talent at his disposal in a rare period of riches for the national side.
He and his charges were incredibly unfortunate not to win the 2019 ODI World Cup, and if that had been a victory which was followed by the World Test Championship title triumph over India, Stead’s achievements would have been rightly regarded as phenomenal.
But there was a nagging feeling that last year would have been the ideal time to look to the future.
Should the game’s governing body here decide to end Stead’s six-year stint in charge, it also needs to have clarity over who might take over, and whether the side could have more than one head coach.
The three big names that are always mentioned when Stead’s successor is pondered are Stephen Fleming, Daniel Vettori and Brendon McCullum.
But the trio of former Black Caps captains are already employed - and being remunerated well beyond the means of NZ Cricket. It’s tough to imagine Fleming (head coach of IPL franchise Chennai Super Kings), Vettori (Australian assistant coach and head coach of the Sunrisers Hyderabad in the IPL) or McCullum (England test coach) wanting to relinquish their current jobs at a time when the New Zealand men’s side has failed to make it out of a World Cup initial group stage.
Domestically, there’s been a string of departures and new appointments over the past couple of seasons. It feels too early for former wicketkeeper/batter BJ Watling (Northern Districts) to assume such a big task without a compelling initial CV, while ex-bowling coach Shane Jurgensen (Wellington) is only recently removed from the international scene.
Central Districts coach Glenn Pocknall - currently at the World Cup as part of Scotland’s set-up - has spent time with the national side and NZ A and is highly regarded, as is former test opener Peter Fulton at Canterbury, and it’s likely that duo are already being evaluated for when Stead’s contract is set to end.
An offshore appointment is an option - there’s plenty of coaching smarts in Australia and England who would be dead keen to make the leap to internationals - but we haven’t had an overseas coach in charge since the failed Andy Moles experiment in 2008/09. Moles was already coaching a domestic team here, making Steve Rixon arguably NZ Cricket’s sole ‘foreign’ appointment in the top job.
A split-coaching model was considered for the role and rejected when Stead was reappointed last year .
“One of the things that goes up against the split coaching model in New Zealand is we’re not a big country. It’s not like we have 17 counties that you’re really scouting a lot of people,” Stead said at the time.
“Our pool of players is a little bit smaller perhaps than other countries around the world, so there’s not a lot of people that get through the net in our system which is a positive and makes the split coaching model not quite as relevant as what it does in other countries.”
But separate red-ball and white-ball jobs would possibly allow the aforementioned trio of past Black Caps skippers - and other quality coaches - to at least ponder a more attractive proposition. -
Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
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Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
@Godder said in NZ Cricket:
Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
Yep, I remember Matty Hayden couldn’t get a game for Australia and NZ were selecting the two Blairs.
I think the drop off will be more dramatic now as the collection of greats is more than in the late 80s
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Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
@Godder said in NZ Cricket:
Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
It depends on if we have a high performance system in place to foster youth stars of the future.....
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@Godder said in NZ Cricket:
Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
Yep, I remember Matty Hayden couldn’t get a game for Australia and NZ were selecting the two Blairs.
I think the drop off will be more dramatic now as the collection of greats is more than in the late 80s
@MN5 said in NZ Cricket:
@Godder said in NZ Cricket:
Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
Yep, I remember Matty Hayden couldn’t get a game for Australia and NZ were selecting the two Blairs.
I think the drop off will be more dramatic now as the collection of greats is more than in the late 80s
A long harsh Winter is definitely coming
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Agree that it's probably time for Stead to move on but that article also raises the good point that it's not as if NZ is stacked with available coaching talent either (much like player stocks).
This feels like the slide after 1990 as the NZ greats from the 1980s started retiring - the newcomers held up for a bit while some of those 1980s greats kept going, but as each great retired, it got a bit harder and a bit worse, and the replacements just weren't of that level (especially early on in their careers).
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
@Godder said in NZ Cricket:
Then one day everyone was gone and Blair Hartland was opening and we were selecting Adam Parore as a batsman. Hopefully we can avoid slipping that far...
Don't worry, Blundell would never be selected as a batsman...
