Springboks vs All Blacks I
-
@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@DaGrubster that hurts almost as much as if you’d made a reasonable counter argument.
Not the thread to discuss it in length.
But that was over his whole career not just the week or two he was considered the best in the world.
It also includes some games against teams such as Italy and some minnows.
It’s a curious stat. You could say that his slow style just never suited NZ’s play or you could say he had an unconscious or conscious bias against Nz given the history…? His book seemed to point to the latter.
Personally, I thought he developed into a very good ref, very calm communicator but I always winced when I saw his name pop up for our next game.
@DaGrubster just so we don’t bore everyone else on this tangent, this guy on Reddit did the homework, going through each of the ABs losses with Barnes reffing:
https://www.reddit.com/r/allblacks/s/UOSP5CCV7yHeadlines are that you won four of the last five he reffed.
Seven of the other eight losses were away:
3 to the wallabies (all away, 2 dead rubber games with the Bledsoe secure and then 2015 before the RWC when Oz won the RC going unbeaten),
2 losses to the french (2007 and 2021 when you got spanked 40-25)
2 losses to the irish (1 away and the series decider at home where they blew you off the park early) and
1 to the boks (away at Ellis Park). -
@DaGrubster just so we don’t bore everyone else on this tangent, this guy on Reddit did the homework, going through each of the ABs losses with Barnes reffing:
https://www.reddit.com/r/allblacks/s/UOSP5CCV7yHeadlines are that you won four of the last five he reffed.
Seven of the other eight losses were away:
3 to the wallabies (all away, 2 dead rubber games with the Bledsoe secure and then 2015 before the RWC when Oz won the RC going unbeaten),
2 losses to the french (2007 and 2021 when you got spanked 40-25)
2 losses to the irish (1 away and the series decider at home where they blew you off the park early) and
1 to the boks (away at Ellis Park).@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@DaGrubster just so we don’t bore everyone else on this tangent, this guy on Reddit did the homework, going through each of the ABs losses with Barnes reffing:
https://www.reddit.com/r/allblacks/s/UOSP5CCV7yHeadlines are that you won four of the last five he reffed.
Seven of the other eight losses were away:
3 to the wallabies (all away, 2 dead rubber games with the Bledsoe secure and then 2015 before the RWC when Oz won the RC going unbeaten),
2 losses to the french (2007 and 2021 when you got spanked 40-25)
2 losses to the irish (1 away and the series decider at home where they blew you off the park early) and
1 to the boks (away at Ellis Park).no need to spoil a good conspiracy theory , wheres the fun in that ?
-
@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@DaGrubster just so we don’t bore everyone else on this tangent, this guy on Reddit did the homework, going through each of the ABs losses with Barnes reffing:
https://www.reddit.com/r/allblacks/s/UOSP5CCV7yHeadlines are that you won four of the last five he reffed.
Seven of the other eight losses were away:
3 to the wallabies (all away, 2 dead rubber games with the Bledsoe secure and then 2015 before the RWC when Oz won the RC going unbeaten),
2 losses to the french (2007 and 2021 when you got spanked 40-25)
2 losses to the irish (1 away and the series decider at home where they blew you off the park early) and
1 to the boks (away at Ellis Park).no need to spoil a good conspiracy theory , wheres the fun in that ?
@kiwiinmelb you’re right. Not in the spirit of the Fern.
I’ve given myself an uppercut and said 10 Hail Suzys
-
An opportunity for some redemption beckons. JB just has to channel his inner Lids!
-
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
where's your memory, Jordie made his debut for the Hurricanes in 2017 aged 19 - and he and his brother spent that season terrorizing Saffa and Australian sides
2017?...I remember the Hurricanes getting smoked by the Lions in the semi final....at...you guessed it.... Ellis Park.
@KiwiMurph said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
where's your memory, Jordie made his debut for the Hurricanes in 2017 aged 19 - and he and his brother spent that season terrorizing Saffa and Australian sides
2017?...I remember the Hurricanes getting smoked by the Lions in the semi final....at...you guessed it.... Ellis Park.
they were leading when Jordie went off injured, which is who I was talking about, they also didn't play NZ sides due to the conference system and were undeservedly gifted a home playoff run, Canes were a better team in 2017 than Lions, they beat NZ teams home and away and Lions didn't have to play the NZ teams.
also wasn't that other Saffa ref Rasta Rivinge reffing that Semi, he was overwhelmingly voted the worst ref in SR in the NZ players survey, he gifted SA sides many wins over the years.
-
@KiwiMurph said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
where's your memory, Jordie made his debut for the Hurricanes in 2017 aged 19 - and he and his brother spent that season terrorizing Saffa and Australian sides
2017?...I remember the Hurricanes getting smoked by the Lions in the semi final....at...you guessed it.... Ellis Park.
they were leading when Jordie went off injured, which is who I was talking about, they also didn't play NZ sides due to the conference system and were undeservedly gifted a home playoff run, Canes were a better team in 2017 than Lions, they beat NZ teams home and away and Lions didn't have to play the NZ teams.
also wasn't that other Saffa ref Rasta Rivinge reffing that Semi, he was overwhelmingly voted the worst ref in SR in the NZ players survey, he gifted SA sides many wins over the years.
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@KiwiMurph said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
where's your memory, Jordie made his debut for the Hurricanes in 2017 aged 19 - and he and his brother spent that season terrorizing Saffa and Australian sides
2017?...I remember the Hurricanes getting smoked by the Lions in the semi final....at...you guessed it.... Ellis Park.
they were leading when Jordie went off injured, which is who I was talking about, they also didn't play NZ sides due to the conference system and were undeservedly gifted a home playoff run, Canes were a better team in 2017 than Lions, they beat NZ teams home and away and Lions didn't have to play the NZ teams.
also wasn't that other Saffa ref Rasta Rivinge reffing that Semi, he was overwhelmingly voted the worst ref in SR in the NZ players survey, he gifted SA sides many wins over the years.
I remember the game well, the Canes went out to a big lead fast and then completely ran out of puff and the Lions came back with a wet sail and rolled us at the end.
-
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@KiwiMurph said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
where's your memory, Jordie made his debut for the Hurricanes in 2017 aged 19 - and he and his brother spent that season terrorizing Saffa and Australian sides
2017?...I remember the Hurricanes getting smoked by the Lions in the semi final....at...you guessed it.... Ellis Park.
they were leading when Jordie went off injured, which is who I was talking about, they also didn't play NZ sides due to the conference system and were undeservedly gifted a home playoff run, Canes were a better team in 2017 than Lions, they beat NZ teams home and away and Lions didn't have to play the NZ teams.
also wasn't that other Saffa ref Rasta Rivinge reffing that Semi, he was overwhelmingly voted the worst ref in SR in the NZ players survey, he gifted SA sides many wins over the years.
I remember the game well, the Canes went out to a big lead fast and then completely ran out of puff and the Lions came back with a wet sail and rolled us at the end.
@Canes4life said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@KiwiMurph said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
where's your memory, Jordie made his debut for the Hurricanes in 2017 aged 19 - and he and his brother spent that season terrorizing Saffa and Australian sides
2017?...I remember the Hurricanes getting smoked by the Lions in the semi final....at...you guessed it.... Ellis Park.
they were leading when Jordie went off injured, which is who I was talking about, they also didn't play NZ sides due to the conference system and were undeservedly gifted a home playoff run, Canes were a better team in 2017 than Lions, they beat NZ teams home and away and Lions didn't have to play the NZ teams.
also wasn't that other Saffa ref Rasta Rivinge reffing that Semi, he was overwhelmingly voted the worst ref in SR in the NZ players survey, he gifted SA sides many wins over the years.
I remember the game well, the Canes went out to a big lead fast and then completely ran out of puff and the Lions came back with a wet sail and rolled us at the end.
Probably worth mentioning that Jordie was at FB and, from memory, it was Laumape who did most of the damage in that game and against the Cheetahs and Stormers (the only other two SA sides they played that season.)
-
@BerniesCorner said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
I really hope the second half structure doesn't turn to custard.
What with Saffa time wasting tactics of drink and injury breaks; along with a recent AB trend of subs and second half lack of structure this game could end up another dour spectacle.How their skullduggery hasn’t been reined in yet is beyond me. I’d be on to the refs week in week out. Ramping it up in the media etc.
@Jet said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@BerniesCorner said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
I really hope the second half structure doesn't turn to custard.
What with Saffa time wasting tactics of drink and injury breaks; along with a recent AB trend of subs and second half lack of structure this game could end up another dour spectacle.How their skullduggery hasn’t been reined in yet is beyond me. I’d be on to the refs week in week out. Ramping it up in the media etc.
That's the problem. Rassie would be all over it, and a decent Captain in the refs ear. Gotta game the game, we don't, boks do and it helps
-
@junior I don't think anyone here has been looking at the Boks and going "wow, what a backline! Imagine if they had Aaron Mauger too!". So it's a bit odd to stamp a mark in the ground about them being overrated.
They're no mugs, but.
@Bones said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@junior I don't think anyone here has been looking at the Boks and going "wow, what a backline! Imagine if they had Aaron Mauger too!". So it's a bit odd to stamp a mark in the ground about them being overrated.
They're no mugs, but.
Not sure why Mauger is getting mentioned. Weird.
But speaking of 2003 I wouldn’t pick a single All Black in a combined 15…..there, that should do it
-
@mariner4life said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
You're talking shit Daryl
I'll watch that final again (no I won't) and watch jordie stink the joint out.
DdE is the player Jordie fluffers think Jordie is. I would take him in a heartbeat.
Kreil is hugely underrated here, he is strong on the carry and free his outsides. If he was a kiwi people would cream over him.If Saffa backs like DdE and Kriel still came up against our guys in Super Rugby we'd see their attacking limitations a lot more compared to our guys, when not playing in Rassie's slick cohesive setup and sum of their parts approach, just playing for the regular old Bulls and Stormers against Blues/Hurricanes, they'd be AJ Lam/Tupaea/Poihipi level.
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
-
@Bones said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@junior I don't think anyone here has been looking at the Boks and going "wow, what a backline! Imagine if they had Aaron Mauger too!". So it's a bit odd to stamp a mark in the ground about them being overrated.
They're no mugs, but.
Not sure why Mauger is getting mentioned. Weird.
But speaking of 2003 I wouldn’t pick a single All Black in a combined 15…..there, that should do it
@MN5 said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@Bones said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@junior I don't think anyone here has been looking at the Boks and going "wow, what a backline! Imagine if they had Aaron Mauger too!". So it's a bit odd to stamp a mark in the ground about them being overrated.
They're no mugs, but.
Not sure why Mauger is getting mentioned. Weird.
But speaking of 2003 I wouldn’t pick a single All Black in a combined 15…..there, that should do it
Mauger, sensational player.
-
@kiwiinmelb you’re right. Not in the spirit of the Fern.
I’ve given myself an uppercut and said 10 Hail Suzys
@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@kiwiinmelb you’re right. Not in the spirit of the Fern.
I’ve given myself an uppercut and said 10 Hail Suzys
The guy on Reddit lost all credibility when he said 64% win rate was ok. Probably Wayne’s mum
-
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
……and he’s not even that really, much of his weight is cos he’s 25 feet tall. Tuilagi, De Allende, Aki, Henshaw etc would all weigh about the same
-
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
It really isn't.
Were you saying that after dismantling the Boks 6 tries to 1 at Mt Smart last year? after Argentina 42-11, 42-10, 44-6 in the Semi, 42-14 against Aus in 2022 after almost losing in Melbourne the week before the change?
Of all the All Blacks problems midfield talent & depth isn't a serious one, other nations would love to be in our position, Jordie, Reiko, ALB, Proctor, Tupaea, Poihipi, Rona, AJ Lam, Higgins, Grindley, Sullivan, TUJ, Leicester coming back iin 2026, Toby Bell coming through, etc.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
It really isn't.
Were you saying that after dismantling the Boks 6 tries to 1 at Mt Smart last year? after Argentina 42-11, 42-10, 44-6 in the Semi, 42-14 against Aus in 2022 after almost losing in Melbourne the week before the change?
Of all the All Blacks problems midfield talent & depth isn't a serious one, other nations would love to be in our position, Jordie, Reiko, ALB, Proctor, Tupaea, Poihipi, Rona, AJ Lam, Higgins, Grindley, Sullivan, TUJ, Leicester coming back iin 2026, Toby Bell coming through, etc.
@darylmitchell lol I think you watch a lot of SR and not much premiership, URC or top 14
-
@darylmitchell lol I think you watch a lot of SR and not much premiership, URC or top 14
@Machpants said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell lol I think you watch a lot of SR and not much premiership, URC or top 14
I do, the quality of the Prem is poor atm, URC has a few elite teams & lots of cannon fodder much like SR, the Top 14 though... now that's a proper rugby comp, that and European Cup are closest to int. rugby.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
It really isn't.
Were you saying that after dismantling the Boks 6 tries to 1 at Mt Smart last year? after Argentina 42-11, 42-10, 44-6 in the Semi, 42-14 against Aus in 2022 after almost losing in Melbourne the week before the change?
Of all the All Blacks problems midfield talent & depth isn't a serious one, other nations would love to be in our position, Jordie, Reiko, ALB, Proctor, Tupaea, Poihipi, Rona, AJ Lam, Higgins, Grindley, Sullivan, TUJ, Leicester coming back iin 2026, Toby Bell coming through, etc.
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
It really isn't.
Were you saying that after dismantling the Boks 6 tries to 1 at Mt Smart last year? after Argentina 42-11, 42-10, 44-6 in the Semi, 42-14 against Aus in 2022 after almost losing in Melbourne the week before the change?
Of all the All Blacks problems midfield talent & depth isn't a serious one, other nations would love to be in our position, Jordie, Reiko, ALB, Proctor, Tupaea, Poihipi, Rona, AJ Lam, Higgins, Grindley, Sullivan, TUJ, Leicester coming back iin 2026, Toby Bell coming through, etc.
Our depth is SO deep you couldn’t even find room for David Havilli.
https://tenor.com/en-NZ/view/wow-surprised-cardi-b-oh-damn-thats-deep-gif-16616660
-
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@darylmitchell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
NZ's point of difference has always been our explosive dynamic backs. Only France come anywhere close of the current int. player pools.
Our midfield is incredibly average. Reiko really hasn't kicked on at 13 as we hoped and while Jordie is a big lump at 12, he's hardly world-class.
It really isn't.
Were you saying that after dismantling the Boks 6 tries to 1 at Mt Smart last year? after Argentina 42-11, 42-10, 44-6 in the Semi, 42-14 against Aus in 2022 after almost losing in Melbourne the week before the change?
Of all the All Blacks problems midfield talent & depth isn't a serious one, other nations would love to be in our position, Jordie, Reiko, ALB, Proctor, Tupaea, Poihipi, Rona, AJ Lam, Higgins, Grindley, Sullivan, TUJ, Leicester coming back iin 2026, Toby Bell coming through, etc.
Our depth is SO deep you couldn’t even find room for David Havilli.
https://tenor.com/en-NZ/view/wow-surprised-cardi-b-oh-damn-thats-deep-gif-16616660
-
@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@kiwiinmelb you’re right. Not in the spirit of the Fern.
I’ve given myself an uppercut and said 10 Hail Suzys
The guy on Reddit lost all credibility when he said 64% win rate was ok. Probably Wayne’s mum
@DaGrubster said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@kiwiinmelb you’re right. Not in the spirit of the Fern.
I’ve given myself an uppercut and said 10 Hail Suzys
The guy on Reddit lost all credibility when he said 64% win rate was ok.
A clear sign he's not an All Black supporter.
