All Blacks vs Wallabies I
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@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
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@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
If Razor had picked more form players from SR, I don't think he would have seen the level of discourse he's seeing now
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@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
I can kinda understand why he did go with what he did, mostly what he knew and then deferred to Ryan as well.
Maybe the EOYT is when we will see something a bit different (c 2002 ABs)
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
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@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
It was quite a seamless transition; the decline continued at a steady pace.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
isn't that kind of the point....we didn;t want someone on the inside picking the same people theyd become mates with....the lead time Razor was given gave him plenty of time to go out and see all or at least most of the top players first hand. And thats ignoring the fact that a top level coach would already have a good idea about all the top players in the country just from oppo research
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@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
It was quite a seamless transition; the decline continued at a steady pace.
@Snowy said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
It was quite a seamless transition; the decline continued at a steady pace.
I posit that it was always likely.
Besides losing a bucketload of talent over the last decade, NZ is starting to look a bit like Australia, in that the systems haven't really evolved.
NZ still has enough bouyancy to sustain success, but the erosion of the club game, warehousing at schools, and changing demographics mean a refresh is needed.
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@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
isn't that kind of the point....we didn;t want someone on the inside picking the same people theyd become mates with....the lead time Razor was given gave him plenty of time to go out and see all or at least most of the top players first hand. And thats ignoring the fact that a top level coach would already have a good idea about all the top players in the country just from oppo research
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
isn't that kind of the point....we didn;t want someone on the inside picking the same people theyd become mates with....the lead time Razor was given gave him plenty of time to go out and see all or at least most of the top players first hand. And thats ignoring the fact that a top level coach would already have a good idea about all the top players in the country just from oppo research
So what you're saying is Foster was not a shit selector as he picked the best available? ...
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@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@NTA said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
It has to be said that 2024 is a very demanding itinerary for a young rebuilding AB team
Agreed. You can't keep looking at everything through the lens of the McCaw era.
It's not the losses that are annoying me.
It's the missed opportunity to turn the page on a number of these experienced players.
Razor needs to shape his own team not pick a team from the last RWC cycle.
Maybe AB coaches feel such pressure from fans and history they select far more conservatively than we might expect? Or maybe this is a result of consensus amongst the coaching team.
Either of those would seriously disappointing when you consider Razor and his coaching staff were named 12 months or so prior to his first test.
They knew what they were getting into.
It's an unheard of amount of lead in time.
Unheard of? Lol utter bullshit. Hansen was supposed to stand down 2016, so foster had over two fucking years.
I'm talking about from being officially named coach.
He knew he was going to be coach from then, even if not officially named. And he was in the camp with all the inside info that Razor wouldn't of had
isn't that kind of the point....we didn;t want someone on the inside picking the same people theyd become mates with....the lead time Razor was given gave him plenty of time to go out and see all or at least most of the top players first hand. And thats ignoring the fact that a top level coach would already have a good idea about all the top players in the country just from oppo research
So what you're saying is Foster was not a shit selector as he picked the best available? ...
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@booboo no...im saying fozzie didn;t seem to know what options were outside the established camp...and razor is making some of the same mistakes....just without the excuse of being an inside man
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@booboo no...im saying fozzie didn;t seem to know what options were outside the established camp...and razor is making some of the same mistakes....just without the excuse of being an inside man
Perhaps Super doesn't make it easy or obvious for coaches' AB selection?
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@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@booboo no...im saying fozzie didn;t seem to know what options were outside the established camp...and razor is making some of the same mistakes....just without the excuse of being an inside man
Perhaps Super doesn't make it easy or obvious for coaches' AB selection?
@nostrildamus thats a worry isn't it? at most five games a week to watch and sometimes only 2, when you compare to managers/coaches of other national teams/sports where players could be spread across multiple teams in multiple competitions
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@nostrildamus thats a worry isn't it? at most five games a week to watch and sometimes only 2, when you compare to managers/coaches of other national teams/sports where players could be spread across multiple teams in multiple competitions
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks vs Wallabies I:
@nostrildamus thats a worry isn't it? at most five games a week to watch and sometimes only 2, when you compare to managers/coaches of other national teams/sports where players could be spread across multiple teams in multiple competitions
Yes plus coaches are human and go for their familiar players who in 2024 seem to be returning from injury and insufficient match practice...
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If we learnt anything from the SA games I suspect its that our experienced players we still have aren't the leaders they should be. Good players but not leaders. A Sam Whitelock plays and we win the first test because he has the mana and experience of how to lead to win difficult games.
The move to experience on the bench for the second test showed that our experienced guys werent able to bring the calmness required to win the game.
I think super is a much bigger step down after the demise of the aussies and not playing the saffas.
Super form isnt much of a yardstick for test ability now. Not enough pressure on players.
If you think Fozzie and Razor have a similar capabilty of players to pick from we are all in a dreamland. -
Having said that we really should stuff the aussies, they're even worse off than us!
