All Blacks XV 2024
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@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@African-Monkey Riccitelli should be with the ABs, and Bell should be playing these games. One is ready to play if injury strikes, and one is developing. Why they keep getting this backwards I don't know.
I don't think the selectors think Riccitelli is up to the next level. Is his core game more rounded? Sure, but if RR played for the Crusaders and got picked, I can imagine people calling him another ordinary Crusader, one of Razor's boys etc.
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
I don't think the selectors think Riccitelli is up to the next level.
I'm not sure Taylor is either. Sure he is young but is just another under-sized hooker coming through the grades. Although I've never been a huge fan Slater does have some size to him, and is mobile.
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@Landers92 said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby is this a wish list or inside information?
It's a guess...
You’ve just said you have heard and now you’re saying it’s a guess. I’m slightly confused. You’re full squad is a guess or those Highlander names you’re saying you’ve heard are actually a guess?
Overall squad has heard is a guess. However, as I mention in the post, have heard that the Highlanders are expected Taylor, Haig and Withy to be named (not an exclusive list so doesn't exclude Ma'u etc.)
I don't know whether they know they are in, or quite what. Withy surprised me a little bit, because he is beating Segner effectively though then again we've seen this movie before where someone turned down Jason Ryan and got the cold shoulder (being cynical, though I do rate Withy, and think there is little between the two)
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Landers92 said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby is this a wish list or inside information?
It's a guess...
You’ve just said you have heard and now you’re saying it’s a guess. I’m slightly confused. You’re full squad is a guess or those Highlander names you’re saying you’ve heard are actually a guess?
Overall squad has heard is a guess. However, as I mention in the post, have heard that the Highlanders are expected Taylor, Haig and Withy to be named (not an exclusive list so doesn't exclude Ma'u etc.)
I don't know whether they know they are in, or quite what. Withy surprised me a little bit, because he is beating Segner effectively though then again we've seen this movie before where someone turned down Jason Ryan and got the cold shoulder (being cynical, though I do rate Withy, and think there is little between the two)
Ok, I will bite. Who is rumoured to have turned down Ryan now?
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@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Landers92 said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby is this a wish list or inside information?
It's a guess...
You’ve just said you have heard and now you’re saying it’s a guess. I’m slightly confused. You’re full squad is a guess or those Highlander names you’re saying you’ve heard are actually a guess?
Overall squad has heard is a guess. However, as I mention in the post, have heard that the Highlanders are expected Taylor, Haig and Withy to be named (not an exclusive list so doesn't exclude Ma'u etc.)
I don't know whether they know they are in, or quite what. Withy surprised me a little bit, because he is beating Segner effectively though then again we've seen this movie before where someone turned down Jason Ryan and got the cold shoulder (being cynical, though I do rate Withy, and think there is little between the two)
Ok, I will bite. Who is rumoured to have turned down Ryan now?
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Landers92 said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby is this a wish list or inside information?
It's a guess...
You’ve just said you have heard and now you’re saying it’s a guess. I’m slightly confused. You’re full squad is a guess or those Highlander names you’re saying you’ve heard are actually a guess?
Overall squad has heard is a guess. However, as I mention in the post, have heard that the Highlanders are expected Taylor, Haig and Withy to be named (not an exclusive list so doesn't exclude Ma'u etc.)
I don't know whether they know they are in, or quite what. Withy surprised me a little bit, because he is beating Segner effectively though then again we've seen this movie before where someone turned down Jason Ryan and got the cold shoulder (being cynical, though I do rate Withy, and think there is little between the two)
Ok, I will bite. Who is rumoured to have turned down Ryan now?
I've explained this before, but look at the initial reticence to Darry. Look at Sotutu. He's very much a trust-based guy. Let's be fair, Segner probably turned the Crusaders down to join the Blues just as Darry did.
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@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
I don't think the selectors think Riccitelli is up to the next level.
I'm not sure Taylor is either. Sure he is young but is just another under-sized hooker coming through the grades. Although I've never been a huge fan Slater does have some size to him, and is mobile.
@Bovidae said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
I don't think the selectors think Riccitelli is up to the next level.
I'm not sure Taylor is either. Sure he is young but is just another under-sized hooker coming through the grades. Although I've never been a huge fan Slater does have some size to him, and is mobile.
I'm not sure Taylor is either, but they probably liken them to Dane Coles. Slater is someone who could have kicked on, but to do so really needed to be a nailed on starter. FWIW I think he could offer more than Riccitelli.
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Goes back a long way, Toeava for example. I find it really frustrating because it's such an obvious solution to just change the budget so you can bring young players in to train with the squad without naming them as ABs.
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
It means if there is an injury in the squad you aren't forced to play someone who isn't ready.
You are still able to assess the young guys coming through.@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
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@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
The issue with Aki was Hansen selecting Francis Saili over him in 2013.
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@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
The issue with Aki was Hansen selecting Francis Saili over him in 2013.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
The issue with Aki was Hansen selecting Francis Saili over him in 2013.
That's appears to just be your personal preference, Aki didn't even start for the Chiefs in the finals games in 2013.
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@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing? -
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing?@reprobate Obviously Andrew Horrell.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
The issue with Aki was Hansen selecting Francis Saili over him in 2013.
That's appears to just be your personal preference, Aki didn't even start for the Chiefs in the finals games in 2013.
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
The issue with Aki was Hansen selecting Francis Saili over him in 2013.
That's appears to just be your personal preference, Aki didn't even start for the Chiefs in the finals games in 2013.
And Saili wasn't even starting for the Blues in 2013 when he got picked for the mid Super AB squad....
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Lol, flying all that distance for just 2 games is such a waste of staff and resources... why would they not play more games? some players will be flying halfway around the world for grand total 20 mins of rugby off the bench, how is limited opportunities like this supposed to keep players in the country? Oh gee I'm not taking that overseas contract cause I get to play half a game for the All Blacks XV. Should probably be 4 games really.
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Lol, flying all that distance for just 2 games is such a waste of staff and resources... why would they not play more games? some players will be flying halfway around the world for grand total 20 mins of rugby off the bench, how is limited opportunities like this supposed to keep players in the country? Oh gee I'm not taking that overseas contract cause I get to play half a game for the All Blacks XV. Should probably be 4 games really.
@darylmitchell said in All Blacks XV 2024:
Lol, flying all that distance for just 2 games is such a waste of staff and resources... why would they not play more games? some players will be flying halfway around the world for grand total 20 mins of rugby off the bench, how is limited opportunities like this supposed to keep players in the country? Oh gee I'm not taking that overseas contract cause I get to play half a game for the All Blacks XV. Should probably be 4 games really.
Suppose part of it comes down to being able to find competitive games. Portugal could have been fun, but that said reckon we'd still smoke em.
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@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing?@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing?Aki left because he wanted to, not because he wasn't apprenticing in the ABs, he was a second year Super player and he went solely for money. He didn't leave for international rugby because he could have immediately played for Samoa.
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@darylmitchell said in All Blacks XV 2024:
Lol, flying all that distance for just 2 games is such a waste of staff and resources... why would they not play more games? some players will be flying halfway around the world for grand total 20 mins of rugby off the bench, how is limited opportunities like this supposed to keep players in the country? Oh gee I'm not taking that overseas contract cause I get to play half a game for the All Blacks XV. Should probably be 4 games really.
Suppose part of it comes down to being able to find competitive games. Portugal could have been fun, but that said reckon we'd still smoke em.
@frugby How can it be profitable to travel all that way for a 2-game tour?
They are taking a 10 person management team and 30 players, like at least play more games and make it a worthwhile trip for everyone involved?
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@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing?Aki left because he wanted to, not because he wasn't apprenticing in the ABs, he was a second year Super player and he went solely for money. He didn't leave for international rugby because he could have immediately played for Samoa.
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing?Aki left because he wanted to, not because he wasn't apprenticing in the ABs, he was a second year Super player and he went solely for money. He didn't leave for international rugby because he could have immediately played for Samoa.
he left for international, he was a project player, specifically signed with the intention of representing Ireland in the future. So money and internationally rugby
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@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
The issue with Aki was Hansen selecting Francis Saili over him in 2013.
That's appears to just be your personal preference, Aki didn't even start for the Chiefs in the finals games in 2013.
And Saili wasn't even starting for the Blues in 2013 when he got picked for the mid Super AB squad....
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
The issue with Aki was Hansen selecting Francis Saili over him in 2013.
That's appears to just be your personal preference, Aki didn't even start for the Chiefs in the finals games in 2013.
And Saili wasn't even starting for the Blues in 2013 when he got picked for the mid Super AB squad....
Which doesn't make it the issue with Aki. It's just two players who weren't ready for the ABs only the one you don't like was selected.
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@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing?Aki left because he wanted to, not because he wasn't apprenticing in the ABs, he was a second year Super player and he went solely for money. He didn't leave for international rugby because he could have immediately played for Samoa.
he left for international, he was a project player, specifically signed with the intention of representing Ireland in the future. So money and internationally rugby
@Machpants said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@Nepia said in All Blacks XV 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks XV 2024:
It helps keep the third choice guys happy and in the country which helps our depth and the quality of super rugby - we might have kept e.g. Bundee Aki.
Aki left when he was well down the depth chart. He's a poor example to use of a player we might have kept.
Just a general point really: if you keep more guys in the AB frame, they are less likely to leave. Kids who are barely even deserving of a super starting spot yet are not likely to leave, and are not really of benefit to the AB squad. It's better to keep those guys, because you never know when the guys ahead of them are going to have a bad injury, form fall off a cliff, or go overseas themselves.
I don't think he was that far down though - who was ahead of him: Nonu, Francis, Malakai at most - and the latter 2 not very convincing?Aki left because he wanted to, not because he wasn't apprenticing in the ABs, he was a second year Super player and he went solely for money. He didn't leave for international rugby because he could have immediately played for Samoa.
he left for international, he was a project player, specifically signed with the intention of representing Ireland in the future. So money and internationally rugby
Regardless, it wasn't not being brought into train with the ABs in 2013 that "made" him go. He's a bad example of the point being made.
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@darylmitchell said in All Blacks XV 2024:
Lol, flying all that distance for just 2 games is such a waste of staff and resources... why would they not play more games? some players will be flying halfway around the world for grand total 20 mins of rugby off the bench, how is limited opportunities like this supposed to keep players in the country? Oh gee I'm not taking that overseas contract cause I get to play half a game for the All Blacks XV. Should probably be 4 games really.
Suppose part of it comes down to being able to find competitive games. Portugal could have been fun, but that said reckon we'd still smoke em.
@frugby said in All Blacks XV 2024:
Suppose part of it comes down to being able to find competitive games. Portugal could have been fun, but that said reckon we'd still smoke em.
The fact that the Georgia game will be played in France (where a lot of their players play club rugby) suggests this is the situation. RugbyPass says that England A is playing Australia A on Nov 18 so maybe they could have played some A teams. Hard to organise at late notice though with the NH club situation.
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In the hypothetical world where Aki stayed in NZ, he doesn't crack the ABs until at least 2016, because he would have remained behind Smith, Nonu, SBW (who returned from league) and Fekitoa (who had just guided the Highlanders to the SR title).
In this hypothetical world, I reckon he possibly goes to the Blues because SBW was coming back, and Nonu had just left to the Hurricanes... or Tamanivalu didn't end up at the Chiefs (who bolted into the ABs).
All things considered, Aki possibly makes the ABs that year, considering ALB and Tamanivalu bolted in, but they were centres. I doubt he gets in ahead of Crotty or SBW, so in short, he probably still ends up leaving anyway.
