All Blacks v Ireland II
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I've enjoyed this thread as a small place of sanity where rational rugby fans gather to discuss the game. Please stop any references to wars and cowardice etc as we really don't need it here.
So far I haven't seen any complaints by Joe Schmidt about the game - that is good for Ireland. He's a canny chap, he'll be learning the lessons and planning for the next time.
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@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
I would hate to have fought alongside an Irishman in one of the world wars, "harden up" is just not an Irish characteristic.
I'll probably be labeled another Irish whinger for this but that's a fairly unnecessary comment to throw about when discussing a rugby match and a few clowns on the internet.
Tens of thousands of Irishmen and women gave their lives to those wars and just as those from England, France, New Zealand or anywhere else, they deserve better than having their "hardness" questioned by some fella sitting on a sofa behind a laptop.
It's just a game man. Ye won this one fair and square so just try to enjoy that for a while if you can.
@munstergreen said in Ireland II:
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
I would hate to have fought alongside an Irishman in one of the world wars, "harden up" is just not an Irish characteristic.
I'll probably be labeled another Irish whinger for this but that's a fairly unnecessary comment to throw about when discussing a rugby match and a few clowns on the internet.
Tens of thousands of Irishmen and women gave their lives to those wars and just as those from England, France, New Zealand or anywhere else, they deserve better than having their "hardness" questioned by some fella sitting on a sofa behind a laptop.
It's just a game man. Ye won this one fair and square so just try to enjoy that for a while if you can.
Yeah that's totally fair, especially given I was born in the 70s! Pent up frustration got the better of me. I don't think NZ could have been more magnanimous after Chicago but the "favour" has not been remotely returned. I've seen hysterical levels of Irish angst about Sam Cane, that the citing process has shown to be a crock of pooh.
Look, I have a number of Irish mates, who have all been much more reasonable, and I apologise for the World War reference which wasn't really on.
I just think it's a crying shame the aftermath of what I thought was a magnificent test match, and I think a few of us are quite jealous of that performance by the Irish backrow, which was magnificent, and should have been match-winning.
I'll settle down no doubt, and I do look forward to the Ire-Aussie game. I would love to see Carbery start and Joe do something different with his back 3, although the loss of Henshaw probably means changes will be minimised.
I don't think I've seen a more exciting emerging NH backrow talent than VDF, he is a keeper.
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@Virgil Unfortunately all this whinging from the opposition is having an impact on how the refs are perceiving the ABs. The fact that they are the most penalised team in world rugby is largely due to this.
@akan004 said in Ireland II:
@Virgil Unfortunately all this whinging from the opposition is having an impact on how the refs are perceiving the ABs. The fact that they are the most penalised team in world rugby is largely due to this.
Mind reader in your time off are you?
I don't think what fans or media say has any major influence on what a ref does in the heat of the moment during a test match.
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@akan004 said in Ireland II:
@Virgil Unfortunately all this whinging from the opposition is having an impact on how the refs are perceiving the ABs. The fact that they are the most penalised team in world rugby is largely due to this.
Mind reader in your time off are you?
I don't think what fans or media say has any major influence on what a ref does in the heat of the moment during a test match.
@ACT-Crusader said in Ireland II:
@akan004 said in Ireland II:
@Virgil Unfortunately all this whinging from the opposition is having an impact on how the refs are perceiving the ABs. The fact that they are the most penalised team in world rugby is largely due to this.
Mind reader in your time off are you?
I don't think what fans or media say has any major influence on what a ref does in the heat of the moment during a test match.
Am pretty sure refs read newspapers too and subconsciously absorb some of what is being said. Much like how the wallaby scrum used to be penalsied unfairly on a number of occasions due to the reputation they had of being a weak scrum. It happens.
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@ACT-Crusader said in Ireland II:
@akan004 said in Ireland II:
@Virgil Unfortunately all this whinging from the opposition is having an impact on how the refs are perceiving the ABs. The fact that they are the most penalised team in world rugby is largely due to this.
Mind reader in your time off are you?
I don't think what fans or media say has any major influence on what a ref does in the heat of the moment during a test match.
Am pretty sure refs read newspapers too and subconsciously absorb some of what is being said. Much like how the wallaby scrum used to be penalsied unfairly on a number of occasions due to the reputation they had of being a weak scrum. It happens.
@akan004 said in Ireland II:
@ACT-Crusader said in Ireland II:
@akan004 said in Ireland II:
@Virgil Unfortunately all this whinging from the opposition is having an impact on how the refs are perceiving the ABs. The fact that they are the most penalised team in world rugby is largely due to this.
Mind reader in your time off are you?
I don't think what fans or media say has any major influence on what a ref does in the heat of the moment during a test match.
Am pretty sure refs read newspapers too and subconsciously absorb some of what is being said. Much like how the wallaby scrum used to be penalsied unfairly on a number of occasions due to the reputation they had of being a weak scrum. It happens.
Awesome, so if we plant some stuff in social medea to certain refs we can control the game through the refs subconscious!! Brilliant!!
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@munstergreen said in Ireland II:
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
I would hate to have fought alongside an Irishman in one of the world wars, "harden up" is just not an Irish characteristic.
I'll probably be labeled another Irish whinger for this but that's a fairly unnecessary comment to throw about when discussing a rugby match and a few clowns on the internet.
Tens of thousands of Irishmen and women gave their lives to those wars and just as those from England, France, New Zealand or anywhere else, they deserve better than having their "hardness" questioned by some fella sitting on a sofa behind a laptop.
It's just a game man. Ye won this one fair and square so just try to enjoy that for a while if you can.
Yeah that's totally fair, especially given I was born in the 70s! Pent up frustration got the better of me. I don't think NZ could have been more magnanimous after Chicago but the "favour" has not been remotely returned. I've seen hysterical levels of Irish angst about Sam Cane, that the citing process has shown to be a crock of pooh.
Look, I have a number of Irish mates, who have all been much more reasonable, and I apologise for the World War reference which wasn't really on.
I just think it's a crying shame the aftermath of what I thought was a magnificent test match, and I think a few of us are quite jealous of that performance by the Irish backrow, which was magnificent, and should have been match-winning.
I'll settle down no doubt, and I do look forward to the Ire-Aussie game. I would love to see Carbery start and Joe do something different with his back 3, although the loss of Henshaw probably means changes will be minimised.
I don't think I've seen a more exciting emerging NH backrow talent than VDF, he is a keeper.
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
@munstergreen said in Ireland II:
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
I would hate to have fought alongside an Irishman in one of the world wars, "harden up" is just not an Irish characteristic.
I'll probably be labeled another Irish whinger for this but that's a fairly unnecessary comment to throw about when discussing a rugby match and a few clowns on the internet.
Tens of thousands of Irishmen and women gave their lives to those wars and just as those from England, France, New Zealand or anywhere else, they deserve better than having their "hardness" questioned by some fella sitting on a sofa behind a laptop.
It's just a game man. Ye won this one fair and square so just try to enjoy that for a while if you can.
Yeah that's totally fair, especially given I was born in the 70s! Pent up frustration got the better of me. I don't think NZ could have been more magnanimous after Chicago but the "favour" has not been remotely returned. I've seen hysterical levels of Irish angst about Sam Cane, that the citing process has shown to be a crock of pooh.
Look, I have a number of Irish mates, who have all been much more reasonable, and I apologise for the World War reference which wasn't really on.
I just think it's a crying shame the aftermath of what I thought was a magnificent test match, and I think a few of us are quite jealous of that performance by the Irish backrow, which was magnificent, and should have been match-winning.
I'll settle down no doubt, and I do look forward to the Ire-Aussie game. I would love to see Carbery start and Joe do something different with his back 3, although the loss of Henshaw probably means changes will be minimised.
I don't think I've seen a more exciting emerging NH backrow talent than VDF, he is a keeper.
That's a fair and magnanimous response, BT. I didn't want to comment too specifically on your war comment earlier, but munstergreen and yourself have dealt with it fairly. I totally agree with you and others about the fuckwit responses from commenters online about the Dublin test but as we all know electronic paper never refused ink. I compare them to some of the Kiwi twonks that continue to write that Chicago test was just an exhibition match and it was a second string NZ team, with lots of players out of position, and a narrow field, and the first try shouldn't have been given, etc, etc.
It's why I like this forum and a couple of others, where sanity prevails - most of the time - with the odd uppercut thrown out every now and then just to keep people on their toes, myself included.
I'll repeat, it was a great test match, and the better team won on the day - no doubts. Here's a few quotes from the only people that actually matter - the players and coach.
"A tough one to take, it probably proves why they're the best team in the world at the minute. Two weeks ago, we put a lot of pressure on them, and we didn't put as much pressure on them this week. When they got those breaks and the passes stuck, they got in with a few tries' - Devin Toner
'All credit to New Zealand, they're a quality outfit. You could tell there was an extra pep in their step. That first five minutes, we kinda sat back off them and gave them too much respect, waiting to see what was going to happen. We'll learn from it and come back better' - Simon Zebo
It would've been nice to have another one, a decider I suppose. Just proud of the way we performed tonight. I thought our defence was pretty good, our discipline probably let us down but it was pretty satisfying to turn the result (from Chicago) around' - Dane Coles
"All credit to New Zealand. With a side losing players (to yellow cards) like that we hope to take advantage. We tried our best and we were very close to cracking them. We tried really hard to come back into the game. We tried to fight our way back but credit to them for holding us out. It was a tough Test match." Conor Murray
""We will learn from this, and to be able to put the All Blacks under as much pressure as we did...you know a lot of people were suggesting that they'd come back with a backlash that would put us out of the game early on, and I thought we fought our way back into the game and it was a true competition, and a true Test match." Joe Schmidt.
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Tin foil hat time..
Intimidation tactics make referees lenient on All Blacks to protect their own careers, top coach says.
@Virgil said in Ireland II:
Tin foil hat time..
Intimidation tactics make referees lenient on All Blacks to protect their own careers, top coach says.
That's awesome. I just masturbated to that. It's the fantasy of every rugby fan, to have their team above the law, and be able to do what ever they want without fear of sanction. Cheers for the wank material Matt you sook. Your bitter tears are natures sweetest lubricant.
Is this the same bloke who did the tearful "analysis" of the 2011 World Cup final where he said "I'm sorry, I'm sorry, but France were robbed"? and pointed out a couple of instances he thought we should have been penalised (all the while saying he hates talking about refs). Because if so, he might be my favourite porn star ever.
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@Pot-Hale said in Ireland II:
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
@Pot-Hale said in Ireland II:
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
@Crucial said in Ireland II:
@JayCee said in Ireland II:
Cane, not guilty. Thank fuck for that.
I just heard the cries of anguish drift over the Irish sea toward me.
Another eternal chip on the shoulder they can carry.
The whole thing was a joke and I'm delighted for cane.
I suppose now we get the "judiciary is run by NZ" malarchy
BT - you're evidently carrying a spear for Ireland and the Irish. That's fine, that's your bag. Generalisms about whinging, hardening up, etc, etc are just so much hot air. Much like the media articles that seem to be upsetting you so much. I'd question if you ever would want the opportunity to fight alongside someone Irish in any kind of war - sounds to me like you'd want to be on the other side.
As an aside why do you spend so much time on this forum, the roar, posting comments on stuff etc and not on those of your compatriots?
It's a free world and you do want you want, your views are enjoyed but do you not pine for the comforts of home at times?
There aren't any discussion fora in Ireland like the Fern or the Roar. I enjoy discussions with fans from further afield than Ireland. I enjoy writing articles from time to time on different aspects of rugby which these fora allow me to do.
I do participate in a discussion forum from U.K., mainly to do with club rugby and sometimes the Six Nations.
You get a pass for using the plural fora. A learned man of good breeding. Although I think forums is also correct, but less romantic.
Let me lose the run of myself from time to time.
Where is poth ale made by the way?
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
Where is poth ale made by the way?
Created by Frederick A Poth in Philadelphia from late 1800s. No longer brewed since 1936.
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I originally watched the test on my phone in a hotel in Malaysia so missed a bunch of what was happening at ruck time.
I watched about 20 minutes of a replay on BeIn last night and I actually couldn't believe what the Irish were getting away with at ruck time. I'd been reading this thread and wondering whether the penalty count and ruck kerfuffle was actually fair.
In one set of three defensive rucks in a row the Irish team flopped, held on to the ball on the ground, and didn't roll away with no sanction whatsoever. In one of them Read was on the ground with his hands up dejected looking right at Peyper. Now, we may have been doing the same the rest of the match and were rightly penalised for it, but, it seemed to be a bit on the nose in this short period of time.
I'll watch the match in it's entirety later as I managed to record a full replay overnight.
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*Williams suggested there was evidence to back up his theory, though he was a bit sketchy on his numbers and some of his evidence was old.
"I haven't got the exact stats but I know, I said on this programme a few years ago: for every 11 penalties, South Africa got a yellow card; for every 12 penalties, Australia got a yellow card.
"For New Zealand, this was around two years ago, three years ago between the [World] Cups. For every 43 penalties against New Zealand, there was a yellow card.*
Well, Scott, from Chimaus' statistics, this year, for every 16.25 penalties the ABs get a yellow card.
In the same games, for every 50.5 penalties the opposition have been yellow-carded.
We're being ripped off!
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*Williams suggested there was evidence to back up his theory, though he was a bit sketchy on his numbers and some of his evidence was old.
"I haven't got the exact stats but I know, I said on this programme a few years ago: for every 11 penalties, South Africa got a yellow card; for every 12 penalties, Australia got a yellow card.
"For New Zealand, this was around two years ago, three years ago between the [World] Cups. For every 43 penalties against New Zealand, there was a yellow card.*
Well, Scott, from Chimaus' statistics, this year, for every 16.25 penalties the ABs get a yellow card.
In the same games, for every 50.5 penalties the opposition have been yellow-carded.
We're being ripped off!
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@munstergreen said in Ireland II:
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
I would hate to have fought alongside an Irishman in one of the world wars, "harden up" is just not an Irish characteristic.
I'll probably be labeled another Irish whinger for this but that's a fairly unnecessary comment to throw about when discussing a rugby match and a few clowns on the internet.
Tens of thousands of Irishmen and women gave their lives to those wars and just as those from England, France, New Zealand or anywhere else, they deserve better than having their "hardness" questioned by some fella sitting on a sofa behind a laptop.
It's just a game man. Ye won this one fair and square so just try to enjoy that for a while if you can.
Yeah that's totally fair, especially given I was born in the 70s! Pent up frustration got the better of me. I don't think NZ could have been more magnanimous after Chicago but the "favour" has not been remotely returned. I've seen hysterical levels of Irish angst about Sam Cane, that the citing process has shown to be a crock of pooh.
Look, I have a number of Irish mates, who have all been much more reasonable, and I apologise for the World War reference which wasn't really on.
I just think it's a crying shame the aftermath of what I thought was a magnificent test match, and I think a few of us are quite jealous of that performance by the Irish backrow, which was magnificent, and should have been match-winning.
I'll settle down no doubt, and I do look forward to the Ire-Aussie game. I would love to see Carbery start and Joe do something different with his back 3, although the loss of Henshaw probably means changes will be minimised.
I don't think I've seen a more exciting emerging NH backrow talent than VDF, he is a keeper.
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
Yeah that's totally fair, especially given I was born in the 70s! Pent up frustration got the better of me. I don't think NZ could have been more magnanimous after Chicago but the "favour" has not been remotely returned. I've seen hysterical levels of Irish angst about Sam Cane, that the citing process has shown to be a crock of pooh.
Look, I have a number of Irish mates, who have all been much more reasonable, and I apologise for the World War reference which wasn't really on.
I just think it's a crying shame the aftermath of what I thought was a magnificent test match, and I think a few of us are quite jealous of that performance by the Irish backrow, which was magnificent, and should have been match-winning.
I'll settle down no doubt, and I do look forward to the Ire-Aussie game. I would love to see Carbery start and Joe do something different with his back 3, although the loss of Henshaw probably means changes will be minimised.
I don't think I've seen a more exciting emerging NH backrow talent than VDF, he is a keeper.
Fair play and no worries!
I agree with you on the hysteria that's taken over so many of our journalists and internet warriors. It's been embarrassing and has detracted from the excellent effort of our squad and coaches over the 2 games.
I wasn't at this game but I was there for the match in 2013 and I think we were magnanimous in defeat then - most of us left frustrated about kicking poorly to your back 3 at such a crucial time and I don't remember anyone having complaints about the ref.
The Oz game and our selection will be interesting. I often get frustrated at some of Joe's selections, particularly when it comes to our backline, but it's hard to argue with the improvements he's made. Hopefully the more we progress, the less conservative he will become in regard to our attack. I guess the onus is also on our more gifted attackers to work on those less glamorous aspects of their game which Joe values most.
Van der Flier is a cracking player and Leavy behind him looks a great prospect too. With O'Donoghue coming through at 8 we really are blessed in the back row. Peter O'Mahony not making the squad last weekend was a crazy show of strength for us.
I don't think we're too far behind anywhere in the pack or at halfback to be honest. Well as long as Murray stays fit! Where we fall behind is producing backs who can both attack and defend as well as your lads do.
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Did Israel Dagg manage to decapitate any Irish player last weekend?
Rumour has it that he may "be headed" to Leinster next season. Chortle, chortle.
@Pot-Hale said in Ireland II:
Did Israel Dagg manage to decapitate any Irish player last weekend?
Rumour has it that he may "be headed" to Leinster next season. Chortle, chortle.
FFS
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@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
I would hate to have fought alongside an Irishman in one of the world wars, "harden up" is just not an Irish characteristic.
I'll probably be labeled another Irish whinger for this but that's a fairly unnecessary comment to throw about when discussing a rugby match and a few clowns on the internet.
Tens of thousands of Irishmen and women gave their lives to those wars and just as those from England, France, New Zealand or anywhere else, they deserve better than having their "hardness" questioned by some fella sitting on a sofa behind a laptop.
It's just a game man. Ye won this one fair and square so just try to enjoy that for a while if you can.
@munstergreen welcome to the fern.
I don't think Billys comment was in the right forum but historically not far from the mark where ww2 is concerned .
Anyway you might have noticed that we seem to be a tad sick of the articles from the northern hemisphere about our team This isn't a recent thing , in the 80s and 90s we were accused of being professional .....expect our players tended to head north in the off season to get paid for playing rugby which made the whole thing a bit odd, then there was a dozen or so years of bullshit about poaching from the pacific islands which has died off a fair bit lately , then its the referees are afraid to penalize us, we didn't actually win the 2011 rwc the ref gifted it to us which overlooks the debacle in 2007. This years whinge seems to be about thuggery , you'll understand if we're a bit over it already especially in light of the bullshit flowing from the usual suspects about the eye gouge that didn't stop even after the supposed victim said didn't happen.
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@mariner4life as a parent when my son rides his bike I worry he might fall off or get hit by a vehicle, similarly if he gets on a bus it might crash, or cross the road a speeding car might hit him....
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@mariner4life as a parent when my son rides his bike I worry he might fall off or get hit by a vehicle, similarly if he gets on a bus it might crash, or cross the road a speeding car might hit him....
@taniwharugby right now my only worry is that he grows up to be as whiney, and as sore a loser as an Irishman
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Checked Foxsports 500 (foxsports news) at lunchtime and pushed the red button for "active" and there is a report on the citings headline "Fekitoa cops ban" or similarly innocuous.
Ok. So I open even though I already knew the deal.
They must have reprinted the story directly from some Irish tinfoil hat wearer's facebook feed.
Apparently "World rugby bosses have admitted that Fekitoa should not have been on the field to score the winning try". This "admission" is embarrassing, All Black thuggery, 11 citings against ABs , Sam Cane, headshots ...
Freaking a grade trolling and whinging wrapped into one.
Also, re Matt Williams (distinctly unsuccessful as a coach IIRC): was the guy who tried to illustrate that NZ did not get penalised in the 2007 RWC final by showing an incident we got penalised for.
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@mariner4life said in Ireland II:
What the fuck? even England in the Woodward era wasn't as embarrassing as this . Thats positively BODesque.
[Rory Best pictured]
