AB's v Wales

Luke Whitelock starting at 8 shows our lack of depth in that position. The coaches have to bear some responsibility there, they haven't developed anyone at all in that position. They seemed to try Ardie for a while but then canned that and haven't done anything since.

I hope Luke goes well, as others have noted he's not the player he was when he first made the team, so I'm confident he will make a good go of it.

antipodean

@no-quarter said in AB's v Wales:

Luke Whitelock starting at 8 shows our lack of depth in that position. The coaches have to bear some responsibility there, they haven't developed anyone at all in that position. They seemed to try Ardie for a while but then canned that and haven't done anything since.

They can only select from what players look like they can make the step up at Super level. Then the "spare" can only develop his craft against second tier teams. Same issue we had when McCaw was fit - just a different position.

No Quarter

@antipodean said in AB's v Wales:

@no-quarter said in AB's v Wales:

Luke Whitelock starting at 8 shows our lack of depth in that position. The coaches have to bear some responsibility there, they haven't developed anyone at all in that position. They seemed to try Ardie for a while but then canned that and haven't done anything since.

They can only select from what players look like they can make the step up at Super level. Then the "spare" can only develop his craft against second tier teams. Same issue we had when McCaw was fit - just a different position.

That's a fair point, though with McCaw we at least had Cane replacing him who had been in the squad for some time and had test experience. As it is we're throwing Luke in the deep end after leaving him in the wilderness for years.

taniwharugby

@no-quarter is tough really, people were critical of the lack of depth at 10 for both 2007 & 2011, but really, for 2011 in particular, could ANY team plan for that situation, and still win?

You don't want to give a guy time just cos, you play to win, and if keeping the captain on for 80 is the best way to achieve that, then that's how we do it?

This coaching group have shown they like to have their captain out there for 80 pretty much week in week out.

pakman

@no-quarter said in AB's v Wales:

Luke Whitelock starting at 8 shows our lack of depth in that position. The coaches have to bear some responsibility there, they haven't developed anyone at all in that position. They seemed to try Ardie for a while but then canned that and haven't done anything since.

I hope Luke goes well, as others have noted he's not the player he was when he first made the team, so I'm confident he will make a good go of it.

Steve Luatua.

Stockcar86

Victor Vito

Chris B.

@no-quarter said in AB's v Wales:

Luke Whitelock starting at 8 shows our lack of depth in that position. The coaches have to bear some responsibility there, they haven't developed anyone at all in that position. They seemed to try Ardie for a while but then canned that and haven't done anything since.

I hope Luke goes well, as others have noted he's not the player he was when he first made the team, so I'm confident he will make a good go of it.

I don't for a minute think our coaches are beyond reproach in terms of the way they've handled the succession of various positions. At hooker, for instance, they persisted on and on with just Mealamu and Hore, and eventually got lucky that Coles came along - with no discernible Plan B.

Similarly, No. 8. The real plan B. is Squire, but he hasn't actually played there yet - and now they need him at 6 this weekend, so Luke's thrown in at 8.

Actually, I think he'll be fine - I wrote a month or so back that there's a good prospect that he's the second best No. 8 in the country.

But, to the critique of the coaches, I'd add the selection of TKB for a farewell tour. What's been the point and why the contrast against the (non) selection of Luatua?

Kruse

@crucial said in AB's v Wales:

@kruse said in AB's v Wales:

Our forward pack containing only 2 first-choice players...
Luckily everybody's all about the wide/expansive/"playing with intent" game nowadays, and all that forwards-nonsense doesn't matter anymore.

The backline is only really one player short of full strength (or two depending on wing selection)

Yeah - I was conveniently ignoring that, in the name of "expectation management".
Claim the underdog spot.
Etc, etc.
In any case - if we do go by stereotypes/generalisations - I guess we'd be hoping for a closed roof... with WalesOnline predicting a snap weather change - "hail and rain are expected in Cardiff".

Crucial

Re: my post about DMac clocking up the miles. Had a chance for a quick look and added to playing every minute of every game for the Chiefs in Super Rugby he has played every minute bar two substitutions in 9 AB tests plus whatever time he played in the Maori vs Lions game.
He may not be taking as much impact per game as a loose forward but he is sure a resilient little bugger the way he bounces back after getting smashed.

Crash

@crucial Yep and that's what we need more of....attitude and commitment.

booboo

@kruse said in AB's v Wales:

@crucial said in AB's v Wales:

@kruse said in AB's v Wales:

Our forward pack containing only 2 first-choice players...
Luckily everybody's all about the wide/expansive/"playing with intent" game nowadays, and all that forwards-nonsense doesn't matter anymore.

The backline is only really one player short of full strength (or two depending on wing selection)

Yeah - I was conveniently ignoring that, in the name of "expectation management".
Claim the underdog spot.
Etc, etc.
In any case - if we do go by stereotypes/generalisations - I guess we'd be hoping for a closed roof... with WalesOnline predicting a snap weather change - "hail and rain are expected in Cardiff".

Haven't they got a roof?

Kruse

@booboo Yeah - exactly, hence "we'd be hoping for a closed roof"..
although, now I think about it - is it the visiting team which gets the choice anyway?
And - with a forecast including hail... I guess everybody involved would be pretty happy with it closed.

MiketheSnow

@kruse said in AB's v Wales:

@booboo Yeah - exactly, hence "we'd be hoping for a closed roof"..
although, now I think about it - is it the visiting team which gets the choice anyway?
And - with a forecast including hail... I guess everybody involved would be pretty happy with it closed.

Yes, yes and thrice yes

The Silver Fern

AB's v Wales