Ireland vs All Blacks (2018)
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@mn5 I’m not sure how all this ranking palava works and usually take very little notice of it, but given Australia’s recent record, an(y) away win is sure to bolster their points.
@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mn5 I’m not sure how all this ranking palava works and usually take very little notice of it, but given Australia’s recent record, an(y) away win is sure to bolster their points.
I woulda thought hammering Fiji and losing a close one to S.A. woulda sufficed. Ah well, here's hoping they put the greasy Argies to the sword this weekend.....
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@mn5 I’m not sure how all this ranking palava works and usually take very little notice of it, but given Australia’s recent record, an(y) away win is sure to bolster their points.
@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mn5 I’m not sure how all this ranking palava works and usually take very little notice of it, but given Australia’s recent record, an(y) away win is sure to bolster their points.
I find it a bit strange you could actually get points beating up on Italy.
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@siam said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ireland played and executed better.
I think we played enough rugby to win, but our execution sucked balls; from our aimless kick and hope to dropping balls that would be caught the other 9 times out of 10, and a few players had thier 1/10 handling skills on show.
I guess they werent hugely far off in this game, and we keep hearing there is so little between the top teams that one has an off day and thats you done.
The odd thing was, how they didnt change things up, or around when what we were doing wasnt working, whereas last week v England, we adapted and adjusted - deliberate or just Ireland wouldnt let us change? Bit of both IMO.
@taniwharugby said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@siam said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ireland played and executed better.
I think we played enough rugby to win, but our execution sucked balls; from our aimless kick and hope to dropping balls that would be caught the other 9 times out of 10, and a few players had thier 1/10 handling skills on show.
I guess they werent hugely far off in this game, and we keep hearing there is so little between the top teams that one has an off day and thats you done.
The odd thing was, how they didnt change things up, or around when what we were doing wasnt working, whereas last week v England, we adapted and adjusted - deliberate or just Ireland wouldnt let us change? Bit of both IMO.
Pressure, their defensive pressure was huge. It doesn't matter how good you are, trying to catch a ball with a guy already in your face about to whack you is hard. England didn't bring that pressure last week, and our RC competitors haven't brought it in years. Last time i saw it was the Lions, and how did that go? We don't have a plan to beat it, because it appears the plan is to do what we always do, because it always works.
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@taniwharugby said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@siam said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ireland played and executed better.
I think we played enough rugby to win, but our execution sucked balls; from our aimless kick and hope to dropping balls that would be caught the other 9 times out of 10, and a few players had thier 1/10 handling skills on show.
I guess they werent hugely far off in this game, and we keep hearing there is so little between the top teams that one has an off day and thats you done.
The odd thing was, how they didnt change things up, or around when what we were doing wasnt working, whereas last week v England, we adapted and adjusted - deliberate or just Ireland wouldnt let us change? Bit of both IMO.
Pressure, their defensive pressure was huge. It doesn't matter how good you are, trying to catch a ball with a guy already in your face about to whack you is hard. England didn't bring that pressure last week, and our RC competitors haven't brought it in years. Last time i saw it was the Lions, and how did that go? We don't have a plan to beat it, because it appears the plan is to do what we always do, because it always works.
@mariner4life an accurate kicking game would help, our kicking (and chase) was so far from accurate though, so we werent able to create gaps in thier line by making them drop players back to cover clever well placed kicks with pressure from chasers.
I think we were looking good at times against the Lions rush d, but personell changes made it tougher to deal with.
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@mariner4life an accurate kicking game would help, our kicking (and chase) was so far from accurate though, so we werent able to create gaps in thier line by making them drop players back to cover clever well placed kicks with pressure from chasers.
I think we were looking good at times against the Lions rush d, but personell changes made it tougher to deal with.
@taniwharugby said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mariner4life an accurate kicking game would help, our kicking (and chase) was so far from accurate though, so we werent able to create gaps in thier line by making them drop players back to cover clever well placed kicks with pressure from chasers.
I think we were looking good at times against the Lions rush d, but personell changes made it tougher to deal with.
Not just you mate, but i am hearing an awful lot of excuses in the last couple of days.
Our kicking has been shit since A Smith went completely off the boil. BB is a poor kicker from hand. B Smith isn't great. It's a massive work on for the whole squad.
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@taniwharugby said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mariner4life an accurate kicking game would help, our kicking (and chase) was so far from accurate though, so we werent able to create gaps in thier line by making them drop players back to cover clever well placed kicks with pressure from chasers.
I think we were looking good at times against the Lions rush d, but personell changes made it tougher to deal with.
Not just you mate, but i am hearing an awful lot of excuses in the last couple of days.
Our kicking has been shit since A Smith went completely off the boil. BB is a poor kicker from hand. B Smith isn't great. It's a massive work on for the whole squad.
@mariner4life said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Not just you mate, but i am hearing an awful lot of excuses in the last couple of days.
Our kicking has been shit since A Smith went completely off the boil. BB is a poor kicker from hand. B Smith isn't great. It's a massive work on for the whole squad.excuses? Pointing out areas we were not good enough? One in the same, matter of perspective.
So if A Smith does suddenly regain his kicking game, how much better would we look within that type of play they seem to be employing?
Oh, and are you new around here? We lost a big game, excuses/angsty posts, soul searching....
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Our kicking used to be good. Can Bridge play on the right wing so BFA can go back to fullback?
I'm not sold that we're making two play makers a winning strategy.
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@stargazer said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Australia snuck ahead of Scotland after beating fucken Italy?
Man fuck that and fuck you too @NTA
@mn5 said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Australia snuck ahead of Scotland after beating fucken Italy?
Man fuck that and fuck you too @NTA
You lost at home, cock biter. We won away. Eat shit.
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@mn5 said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Australia snuck ahead of Scotland after beating fucken Italy?
Man fuck that and fuck you too @NTA
You lost at home, cock biter. We won away. Eat shit.
@nta said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mn5 said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Australia snuck ahead of Scotland after beating fucken Italy?
Man fuck that and fuck you too @NTA
You lost at home, cock biter. We won away. Eat shit.
How's the rest of the year gone?
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@nta said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mn5 said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@stargazer said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Australia snuck ahead of Scotland after beating fucken Italy?
Man fuck that and fuck you too @NTA
You lost at home, cock biter. We won away. Eat shit.
How's the rest of the year gone?
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@mn5 well enough to sit above a bunch of skirt wearing rangas in the rankings for now, apparently
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@nta said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@mn5 well enough to sit above a bunch of skirt wearing rangas in the rankings for now, apparently
Yes I know. That's why I'm so triggered. Here's hoping a win over Argie helps the cause.
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Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it... -
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...@derm-mccrum said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...Nup. Whatever may or may not have happened, never happened.
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@derm-mccrum said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...Nup. Whatever may or may not have happened, never happened.
@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@derm-mccrum said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...Nup. Whatever may or may not have happened, never happened.
It was a great result for the Black Caps.
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@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@derm-mccrum said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...Nup. Whatever may or may not have happened, never happened.
It was a great result for the Black Caps.
@donsteppa was looking at my TAB account last night when NZ were paying $15 with the Pakis needing 27 runs and 6 wkts in hand..thought about it,and thought nah..that ain’t gonna happen..
Woke up this morning..WTF..! -
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...@derm-mccrum said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...What game?
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@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@derm-mccrum said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...Nup. Whatever may or may not have happened, never happened.
It was a great result for the Black Caps.
@donsteppa said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@derm-mccrum said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Ok. My head is better now.
Good game at the weekend - don’t know if anyone saw it...Nup. Whatever may or may not have happened, never happened.
It was a great result for the Black Caps.
November is cricket season!
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After the last 7 days, 2018 suddenly feels a lot like 1998, with the distinct difference being that back then we spent most of the year playing much better sides.
Obviously all observations and theories come with the massive caveat that i have absolutely no idea what plan the coaches are working to (if indeed there is one) that might affect performances, tactics, and outcomes.
However, this is a sports forum, and it's a place for us, the great unwashed, to cast our theories out as if we know all, and should be listened to.
Tactics Tim
What the fuck are our tactics? From the outside our plan looks like we spend 60 minutes trying to wear teams out, and then hammer them in the last 20. Our attack has been fucking basic all year, and suddenly looks old-school Boks-esque in that we spend a lot of time smacking in to teams, trying to bash them in to submission. And yet we don't pick personel suited to that game plan. Edge runners, tall blokes, and static props; backed up by a no power midfielder except a dude who hasn't run a crash ball in 2 years.Remember 2003 when we murdered everyone from turnover? Well there are a lot of times when it looks for all the world like that is our only go-to at the moment. Crash ball or punish bad kicks.
This presents a huge problem when the opposition kick well, and you can't generate a turnover because our excellent counter-ruck game has disappeared.
So that raises the question, have we run out of ideas, or did we just spend a year deliberately under-playing our hand?
Defense
Okay what is the go here? We are not playing rush, okay no worries. We have this strange sort of defense where we take a few quick steps then sit back. There also seems to be a point where if they get the ball outside a certain point, we back off and wait for support. We leak a lot more linebreaks and metres than i remember us ever giving up. We're not giving up scores though, because we usually still scramble as well as anyone. We also have started falling off tackles as we start looking for the ball instead of completing the tackle first, worrying about the rest later. That may be linked to the distinct lack of turnover ball mentioned above.Set Piece
Our nice point of difference. Scrum is good (creaked today, but at worst shared the honours i thought) and our lineout is in the main deadly.Players
Well now, the big question, do we have the guys int eh right spots to play the way we want? The bigger question, do the coaches have the stones to drop a big name who may not be fitting what they want? Is there a clear path in their mind for next year? And is that path realistic? or does it rely on a player "coming good" like it did in 2015?That last World Cup actually fills me with a little more confidence. A year out some dudes looked done who were very much not. And we looked like shit as late as the Group stages, but that was part of the plan (apparently).
I really just want to talk about the loose forwards at the moment. Our best 7 broke his neck, and may not make it back. Our next best 7 has been playing bloody well, but is a completely different player. Our captain and only test 8 option is going alright for the main, but is running on what look very old legs. He's slipped in to a tight role i think because he can't play the wide game any more. Who plays 6 is as undecided as any position on the field, hell we have an entire thread on it where few agree. I want to talk about balance. I spoke below about the distinct lack of speed today, and to me, this is our issue. We want to play wide, but do we have the players in these crucial spots to do it? If our first choice trio is Cane, Read, and Squire, that's not real quick. S Barrett off the bench isn't quick either. It's for that reason i can see why Fifita was stuck with for so long, he actually has the wheels to balance that trio out. He's just not good enough. Read's lack of pace actually rules out a few guys for that spot in my eyes, unless Savea is playing, and we change the way the guys operate.
I also wouldn't mind a decent fucking ball runner somewhere in the 13 forwards we pick. One guy who can repeatedly dent the line in the tough stuff. We don't have that at the moment. Our best guys are locks, and that's not ideal, too bloody tall!
In conclusion for this long rambling brain dump, this year was shit, and we have some glaring fucking holes that i can see from the cheap seats. The optimist in me says this year was a holding period to get us through to the ultimate goal next year, while not losing ranking or the Bledisloe. The other option is we have finally got stale/complacent/caught up to. It's far from doom and gloom, we pushed a very good #2 side in the world playing at home right to the wire. It's just not what we are used to.
@mariner4life This is a very good point. But it also wouldn't hurt if you picked some backs who could bend the line in heavy traffic.
Everyone talks about how chips and grubbers are a way to unlock a rush defence. And sure they are. But crawl through this thread and count the moaning on all the kicks. They're bloody hard to execute well, and once you give players a licence to do them they become infectious. So you lose promising attacking positions because instead of recycling, some wing or loosie has grubbered the ball away.
A much better answer to a rush defence is to pass early to a big, fast, nimble meathead while making the defence second guess itself. But to do that, you need to select some big, fast, nimble meatheads. And I for one hope that your selectors continue to ignore the obvious solution to your current backline ineffectiveness.
