Bledisloe #1
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So, just considering the counterfactual to make everyone feel a bit better.
What happens if we don't cop a red card on half time, and go in 13-12 down?
I think our defence stays strong, and their struggle to maintain intensity and accuracy. They run out of ideas, get frustrated, and while it's a tight finish, our attack looks more fluid and we work our way to a 10 point lead. Rieko gets a bit of space, and his speed looks good on the outside.
Everyone but the Wobbles go home happy, and impressed at our mental strength on defence by not conceding many points despite playing one of the worst halves in ages and getting dominated.
Final score 32-22 to the good guys
Optimism much?
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@nzzp The squadron of pigs doing a flyover of the stadium at full time was also a fitting finale
@Donsteppa said in Bledisloe #1:
@nzzp The squadron of pigs doing a flyover of the stadium at full time was also a fitting finale
was that the next (or current) coaching team?
Seriously, though, I don't think it's full panic stations yet. We're back in the pack unelss there's an awful lot of powder being kept dry. No red card, and that game goes to the wire and is probably in the balance ...
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@Donsteppa said in Bledisloe #1:
@nzzp The squadron of pigs doing a flyover of the stadium at full time was also a fitting finale
was that the next (or current) coaching team?
Seriously, though, I don't think it's full panic stations yet. We're back in the pack unelss there's an awful lot of powder being kept dry. No red card, and that game goes to the wire and is probably in the balance ...
@nzzp said in Bledisloe #1:
@Donsteppa said in Bledisloe #1:
@nzzp The squadron of pigs doing a flyover of the stadium at full time was also a fitting finale
was that the next (or current) coaching team?
Seriously, though, I don't think it's full panic stations yet. We're back in the pack unelss there's an awful lot of powder being kept dry. No red card, and that game goes to the wire and is probably in the balance ...
The less happy counterfactual to the red card is that the way the pressure was building - if it wasn’t S Barrett being an oaf - it might well have been someone else. Ardie’s silly smile after conceding the penalty two minutes before for dumb play looms large...
I’d like to think it’s the massive kick up the arse that the senior players and the coaching staff need, but they’ve had a few of those over the last two years that they’ve learnt little from.
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@Duluth well Hanson has been starting to collect the bad sort of records. Lions, Ireland, our number one ranking.
Is next week the Bledisloe?
@Kirwan said in Bledisloe #1:
@Duluth well Hanson has been starting to collect the bad sort of records. Lions, Ireland, our number one ranking.
Is next week the Bledisloe?
Get out of here. He's number one for his whole coaching career and it is a bad record to suddenly be number 2? Weak analysis.
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@Duluth said in Bledisloe #1:
So ex-Canterbury and Crusaders Assistant Steve Hansen can lose the world #1 record, RWC and Bledisloe he was handed by Henry all in a couple of months?
You have to add something to the All Black legacy he said. Well the failed Lions Tour and first losses to Ireland did that.
edit @Kirwan beat me too it.
@rotated said in Bledisloe #1:
@Duluth said in Bledisloe #1:
So ex-Canterbury and Crusaders Assistant Steve Hansen can lose the world #1 record, RWC and Bledisloe he was handed by Henry all in a couple of months?
You have to add something to the All Black legacy he said. Well the failed Lions Tour and first losses to Ireland did that.
edit @Kirwan beat me too it.
Insane. He wasn't handed it by Henry. He retained it every year.
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my 2 cents worth .
A lot of discussion re the backline , while it might not be perfect and a bit flaky , I still think it is the type of backline that could look a million bucks behind a dominant forward pack ,
But there lies the problem, We dont have that , and we could be going to a WC with a pack of forwards that will get dominated in the bigger games . ( 2003 anyone )
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I'd love to see the running metres of the 2 forward packs compared. The Aussies would be streets ahead.
@Wally said in Bledisloe #1:
I'd love to see the running metres of the 2 forward packs compared. The Aussies would be streets ahead.
approx 190 vs 124. O f which Ardie had 60, Coles 24. Thats out of overall 703 v 492, so backs relatively worse.
But, only Ardie (awesome) Coles (not bad) & Taylor (10) got double figures. there were a lot of 0, 1,2,3s
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my 2 cents worth .
A lot of discussion re the backline , while it might not be perfect and a bit flaky , I still think it is the type of backline that could look a million bucks behind a dominant forward pack ,
But there lies the problem, We dont have that , and we could be going to a WC with a pack of forwards that will get dominated in the bigger games . ( 2003 anyone )
@kiwiinmelb yea tough for the backs to get into their groove if the forwards aren't providing any kind of platform to launch from.
Forwards were always under pressure and at best for parts had parity but for the most were dominated, no matter the class you have out back, a forward performance like that and you will always struggle.
Obviously our balance is all out, no BBBR, and the never-ending search for NZ got a talented 6? somewhere, surely, plus some aging props offering little outside parity at scrumtime it means half the pack are not what we expect them to be.
I think Moody is still good to go, but attracts too many penalties, but Frank's is really struggling, offering next to nothing outside of scrums.
SB did himself zero favours as a lock nor as a contender for NZ got a talented 6?
Cane and Ardie, what to do there? I honestly think Cane needs to play the 6 role, let Ardie play his natural game as Cane seems better suited to the role we need from a 6.
Read looks to be playing into form at the right time, although there are questions over his captaincy qualities.
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@Wally said in Bledisloe #1:
I'd love to see the running metres of the 2 forward packs compared. The Aussies would be streets ahead.
approx 190 vs 124. O f which Ardie had 60, Coles 24. Thats out of overall 703 v 492, so backs relatively worse.
But, only Ardie (awesome) Coles (not bad) & Taylor (10) got double figures. there were a lot of 0, 1,2,3s
@Machpants Thanks. It reminds me of that last Irish test we lost. Both starting Irish props ran for around 30 metres and Moody and Franks had 1 and 0 respectively. It's become a big liability for the All Blacks.
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@Machpants Thanks. It reminds me of that last Irish test we lost. Both starting Irish props ran for around 30 metres and Moody and Franks had 1 and 0 respectively. It's become a big liability for the All Blacks.
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A better front row, and a SETTLED backline without players out of position would be a great start. We can afford to have maybe one or two guys who are good in one area but poor in others, but not more than that. Nor can we have slow wingers or unreliable kickers.
Unfortunately this WC is a year too far for a bunch of players, yet they've been retained with loyalty rather than ruthless results.
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@Machpants Thanks. It reminds me of that last Irish test we lost. Both starting Irish props ran for around 30 metres and Moody and Franks had 1 and 0 respectively. It's become a big liability for the All Blacks.
@Wally mobile, skillful ball running props was our thing and other teams looked on and marvelled at our big boppers, no more though...others have them, ours are at times barely doing their core roles.
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In relation to our lack of attack from forwards, in past under modern regime we put emphasis on set piece because we scored a lot from set piece and then a lot from counter attack. (I remember a stat of 80% at one stage say 10 years ago but might be wrong for combined stat) so if teams are not kicking to us or kicking smarter and we sure are not scoring set piece tries anymore then that’s when you question our player type needed in forwards.
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@Stargazer said in Bledisloe #1:
Ah, another TSF meltdown. Everyone completely overreacting as usual.
Sorry dude. We just lost by 21 points. Overreaction? Seriously?
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A better front row, and a SETTLED backline without players out of position would be a great start. We can afford to have maybe one or two guys who are good in one area but poor in others, but not more than that. Nor can we have slow wingers or unreliable kickers.
Unfortunately this WC is a year too far for a bunch of players, yet they've been retained with loyalty rather than ruthless results.
@Mokey said in Bledisloe #1:
a SETTLED backline
Yep that would help, but forwards still need to find a way out of reverse and neutral...gone are the days we deal to teams in 2nd or 3rd gear.
How is Mounga supposed to get his game going starting outside TJ one week, AS next, inside SBW then ALB...then there is our midfield, it looks like the days prior to Nonu-Conrad where I think we went 25 tests without starting the same midfield on consecutive tests.
Our combos should be starting to gel now rather than still looking for them.
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@Mokey said in Bledisloe #1:
a SETTLED backline
Yep that would help, but forwards still need to find a way out of reverse and neutral...gone are the days we deal to teams in 2nd or 3rd gear.
How is Mounga supposed to get his game going starting outside TJ one week, AS next, inside SBW then ALB...then there is our midfield, it looks like the days prior to Nonu-Conrad where I think we went 25 tests without starting the same midfield on consecutive tests.
Our combos should be starting to gel now rather than still looking for them.
@taniwharugby Our musical backline is a shambles, and it really doesn't help to have Smith at the end. He is a far better fullback, and needs time to gather a bit of steam now. He can't explode from a standing/few steps start, he just 'dances'.
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@Stargazer said in Bledisloe #1:
Ah, another TSF meltdown. Everyone completely overreacting as usual.
Sorry dude. We just lost by 21 points. Overreaction? Seriously?
@booboo said in Bledisloe #1:
@Stargazer said in Bledisloe #1:
Ah, another TSF meltdown. Everyone completely overreacting as usual.
Sorry dude. We just lost by 21 points. Overreaction? Seriously?
Well it's only our worst equal margin, not worst on it's own...
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@Stargazer said in Bledisloe #1:
Ah, another TSF meltdown. Everyone completely overreacting as usual.
Sorry dude. We just lost by 21 points. Overreaction? Seriously?
@booboo said in Bledisloe #1:
@Stargazer said in Bledisloe #1:
Ah, another TSF meltdown. Everyone completely overreacting as usual.
Sorry dude. We just lost by 21 points. Overreaction? Seriously?
It's only the most points New Zealand have ever conceded in a Test Match
As well as worst defeat overall in terms of pts conceded + margin of defeatIt's only 6th time ABs have conceded 40+ points
1999 to 2000 was a particularly bad year for AB defencesShit just got serious for ABs
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@pakman said in Bledisloe #1:
@kiwiinmelb said in Bledisloe #1:
@ACT-Crusader said in Bledisoe #1:
@kiwiinmelb said in Bledisoe #1:
@Siam said in Bledisoe #1:
@Crucial I guess all of us remember where we were for that game. The emotional rollercoaster was immense.
In the cold light of day though, jeez our defence to let them back in was a black mark.
But, a win's a win
I was pissed off we let them back in that easily , I didnt enjoy that game the way most did for that reason..... but Im probably a grumpy bastard .
If we are being honest with ourselves, the Aussies had a better side than ours and I know even when we were up that OZ would make some sort of run.
Yep 100 %, and it used to piss me off
I remember well walking back to the car after that fateful day in 1978 when the world tilted on its axis. Took over 30 years for AB dominance over Wannabees to be restored.
I feel much the same today.
@pakman said in Bledisloe #1:
@pakman said in Bledisloe #1:
@kiwiinmelb said in Bledisloe #1:
@ACT-Crusader said in Bledisoe #1:
@kiwiinmelb said in Bledisoe #1:
@Siam said in Bledisoe #1:
@Crucial I guess all of us remember where we were for that game. The emotional rollercoaster was immense.
In the cold light of day though, jeez our defence to let them back in was a black mark.
But, a win's a win
I was pissed off we let them back in that easily , I didnt enjoy that game the way most did for that reason..... but Im probably a grumpy bastard .
If we are being honest with ourselves, the Aussies had a better side than ours and I know even when we were up that OZ would make some sort of run.
Yep 100 %, and it used to piss me off
I remember well walking back to the car after that fateful day in 1978 when the world tilted on its axis. Took over 30 years for AB dominance over Wannabees to be restored.
I feel much the same today.
If last night was at Eden Park then there would be something like that, but we were playing in Perth.
