'Super Rugby' 2021
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i know im missing something
yes, ideally an international super rugby comp is preferred as it bring in more money...but if we're going to persist with a purely domestic comp, for all kinds of reasons..why not a full blooded Mitre 10 cup, take that money the NZR is going to spend running super rugby, use it to run a full 14 team mitre 10 cup comp
surely we cant keep selling a 5-6 team comp overseas for huge money
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i know im missing something
yes, ideally an international super rugby comp is preferred as it bring in more money...but if we're going to persist with a purely domestic comp, for all kinds of reasons..why not a full blooded Mitre 10 cup, take that money the NZR is going to spend running super rugby, use it to run a full 14 team mitre 10 cup comp
surely we cant keep selling a 5-6 team comp overseas for huge money
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@Kiwiwomble The 5/6 team domestic is for 1 season only (2021) due to COVID. It's a stop-gap.
@KiwiMurph i get that, im just saying if we're writing off next season as a stop gap...why not try and make the comp we have awesome rather than such a diluted super comp
we always hear the NPC cant be the top cop anymore...but we havent really seen a fully funded/marketed/backed NPC for a very long time, so we can know for sure and this seem like a great chance to try
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@KiwiMurph i get that, im just saying if we're writing off next season as a stop gap...why not try and make the comp we have awesome rather than such a diluted super comp
we always hear the NPC cant be the top cop anymore...but we havent really seen a fully funded/marketed/backed NPC for a very long time, so we can know for sure and this seem like a great chance to try
@Kiwiwomble There's a number of reasons.
They have a broadcast deal with Sky - they know Super Rugby Aotearoa rates very well. They already have a 14 team Mitre 10 Cup. Does putting ABs into a full 14 team Mitre 10 Cup offset having no Super Rugby at all? No.
You want to talk about a diluted comp - a 14 team domestic comp is diluted even if ABs are playing.
You've then got the issue of all the staff at these Super franchises and that most franchises have some form of private ownership involved - you can't just say 'sorry no Super this year' and put them on pause for a year.
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@Kiwiwomble There's a number of reasons.
They have a broadcast deal with Sky - they know Super Rugby Aotearoa rates very well. They already have a 14 team Mitre 10 Cup. Does putting ABs into a full 14 team Mitre 10 Cup offset having no Super Rugby at all? No.
You want to talk about a diluted comp - a 14 team domestic comp is diluted even if ABs are playing.
You've then got the issue of all the staff at these Super franchises and that most franchises have some form of private ownership involved - you can't just say 'sorry no Super this year' and put them on pause for a year.
@KiwiMurph fair enough on the last point, cant argue with too much of that
disagree with some of the other points, i dont think having the AB dilutes the comp, i think they lift up the players around them and the last time we had a full 14 team comp super rugby and internationals were still taking players away, i would guess it would at least be super 12 when we last saw most AB's still playing more than a couple of NPC games
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Crusaders dominated the competition for two decades....:man_shrugging_light_skin_tone:
Blues finally live up to their potential for one season...quickly, dilute their region (edit) and part of the chiefs too...theyve been asking for it
@Kiwiwomble said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
Crusaders dominated the competition for two decades....:man_shrugging_light_skin_tone:
Blues finally live up to their potential for one season...quickly, dilute their region (edit) and part of the chiefs too...theyve been asking for it
Should base the Pasifika team in Rangiora.
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Pedant alert: I don’t think KM argued that ABs dilute the comp, I think he explained that even with ABs it’s still a diluted comp - quite different ideas
@gt12 ok, re reading i see that, apologies @KiwiMurph
i think half my point still stands, the NPC lifts so much when they're in it
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This post is deleted!
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@Snowy until they pick a palagi and then it just becomes another NZ team...because they cannot legally not 'employ' someone who isnt an Islander, hwoever when it comes to picking sports teams, that sort of thing becomes a grey area anyway, proving you should have been offered the contract over someone else but weren't purely cos you is white would be tough to prove.
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@Snowy until they pick a palagi and then it just becomes another NZ team...because they cannot legally not 'employ' someone who isnt an Islander, hwoever when it comes to picking sports teams, that sort of thing becomes a grey area anyway, proving you should have been offered the contract over someone else but weren't purely cos you is white would be tough to prove.
@taniwharugby said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Snowy until they pick a palagi and then it just becomes another NZ team...because they cannot legally not 'employ' someone who isnt an Islander, hwoever when it comes to picking sports teams, that sort of thing becomes a grey area anyway, proving you should have been offered the contract over someone else but weren't purely cos you is white would be tough to prove.
Employment law comes into it for sure, but why call them that?
The Redskins come to mind. -
The team will be under Tina, Samoa and Fijian RU governance. NZR won't be running it or picking coaches, so any employment law issues will be their problem. If NZR can get away with picking NZ only qualified people in SR, then the Pacific team can do three same with island qualified. It won't be based on raced, but international qualification, is my guess.
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The team will be under Tina, Samoa and Fijian RU governance. NZR won't be running it or picking coaches, so any employment law issues will be their problem. If NZR can get away with picking NZ only qualified people in SR, then the Pacific team can do three same with island qualified. It won't be based on raced, but international qualification, is my guess.
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
If NZR can get away with picking NZ only qualified people in SR
there are always some who arent, and again, NZ Citizen, but plays for Fiji/Samoa/Tonga...
As for being under the PI Governance, I expect still have to comply with NZ Laws.
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The team will be under Tina, Samoa and Fijian RU governance. NZR won't be running it or picking coaches, so any employment law issues will be their problem. If NZR can get away with picking NZ only qualified people in SR, then the Pacific team can do three same with island qualified. It won't be based on raced, but international qualification, is my guess.
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
so any employment law issues will be their problem
Even if based in NZ? Really?
Our laws will apply I think.
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
If NZR can get away with picking NZ only qualified people in SR
there are always some who arent, and again, NZ Citizen, but plays for Fiji/Samoa/Tonga...
As for being under the PI Governance, I expect still have to comply with NZ Laws.
@taniwharugby yes. But under NZ laws you cannot deny an NZer a job because they are not qualified to play for the ABs, but NZR successfully do.
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@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
so any employment law issues will be their problem
Even if based in NZ? Really?
Our laws will apply I think.
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@taniwharugby yes. But under NZ laws you cannot deny an NZer a job because they are not qualified to play for the ABs, but NZR successfully do.
@Machpants but there have been plenty over the years who are not AB eligible who play super rugby in NZ, granted numbers are low, but it happens.
It would be hard to prove you have been denied a contract based on being white or not being AB eligible for other too.
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@Snowy yes they will have to comply too the same amount that NZR do, which (around eligibility) is not at all
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Snowy yes they will have to comply too the same amount that NZR do, which (around eligibility) is not at all
NZR have the choice to pick anybody that they deem eligible for the team, that isn't employment law.
