'Super Rugby' 2021
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@Snowy said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
Still not sure about the "depth" headline though. A full super season and a few internationals might show some cracks - but it probably would for us too.
IF (and it's a big if) SA rock up for the Rugby Championship, it's going to stress the players bigtime. 6 big games in a row - load management will be critical to not get knocked over at the end of the tourney.
I can see us losing to Argentina ... there's an argument for them to play their B side for the first few weeks, and then bring their best players off the bench and start them towards the end of the comp...
EDIT: for clarification, I can see the potential for us to play poorly at the end of the comp, and a fresher/more motivated side could get up on us
@nzzp said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Snowy said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
Still not sure about the "depth" headline though. A full super season and a few internationals might show some cracks - but it probably would for us too.
IF (and it's a big if) SA rock up for the Rugby Championship, it's going to stress the players bigtime. 6 big games in a row - load management will be critical to not get knocked over at the end of the tourney.
I can see us losing to Argentina ... there's an argument for them to play their B side for the first few weeks, and then bring their best players off the bench and start them towards the end of the comp...
I dunno how many of their top players are even in Oz, I've not seen a squad list that are actually there and available
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@KiwiMurph a 5+5 comp is miles better than 5 + Force + Pacific RagTag + Ilford Seconds that was mentioned.
NZR have done very very poorly recently. The Board must look pretty hard at this, and deliver some firm messages
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@KiwiMurph can't really see that as forcing since NZR announced that was one of their preferred options prior to the Xmas quarantine fiasco
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@KiwiMurph can't really see that as forcing since NZR announced that was one of their preferred options prior to the Xmas quarantine fiasco
Sumo isn't the most objective.
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@Derpus NZ had three debutants too - and our most experienced back was Rieko with 29 caps!
At times the forward alignment was all over the shop, as the system bedded in. I think we've got a lot of upside once the team plays together; hopefully far more than the Wobs who played really well
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NZPA says wind your fucking neck in to NZR
And they're right
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Looks like common sense prevailed/NZR backed the fuck down from being tossers
@Machpants said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
Looks like common sense prevailed/NZR backed the fuck down from being tossers
Not really. There is still two round of SRA like this year but then a few crossover matches afterwards. Its what I want in the future. Start off with SRA with only 5 team (8 games per team) with no semis etc but also have a crossover knockout including as many teams as possible. Maybe yearly including SA Aust and NZ and maybe Wales Ireland and Scotland Japan PI etc as well, It might be possible to have a world event say every 4 years. Pools of 5 teams and winners progress to the finals for example. Quarters semi and finals in one location maybe. Anything but the ridiculous travel nonsense with SR finals
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A couple of different trans- Ta$man formats are suggested.
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@Kirwan said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
I hope they go back to a format where all teams play each other once.
I just don't think Aust teams will be good enough (if they stick with 5). And 5 strong NZ teams almost always beating 5 weaker Aust (4 teams can't compete) is bad for Aust rugby. So either NZ help aust by allowing our players to join their teams. Or don't have a combined competition as the main event
Also is 11 games enough (assuming 12 teams)?
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@Kirwan said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
I hope they go back to a format where all teams play each other once.
I just don't think Aust teams will be good enough (if they stick with 5). And 5 strong NZ teams almost always beating 5 weaker Aust (4 teams can't compete) is bad for Aust rugby. So either NZ help aust by allowing our players to join their teams. Or don't have a combined competition as the main event
Also is 11 games enough (assuming 12 teams)?
@Winger said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
@Kirwan said in 'Super Rugby' 2021:
I hope they go back to a format where all teams play each other once.
I just don't think Aust teams will be good enough (if they stick with 5). And 5 strong NZ teams almost always beating 5 weaker Aust (4 teams can't compete) is bad for Aust rugby. So either NZ help aust by allowing our players to join their teams. Or don't have a combined competition as the main event
Also is 11 games enough (assuming 12 teams)?
Ignoring their depth issue (that has been changable in the past with the Tahs winning, same with the Brumbies), 11 games then a short finals series is plenty. If my maths isn't terrible isn't that over three months of rugby?
Quality over quantity, and if the broadcaster wants more rugby, get the super rugby players into NPC and show that. Less cutover seperate parts of the season NPC/Super/Tests. That's a lot of rugby.
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Via an email I received:
The 2021 Super Rugby Draw is scheduled to be announced next week with the season kicking off from February 27, 2021. 2021 Memberships will include 4 x home matches against all NZ opponents & 2 x home matches against Australian opponents.So that implies a full set of home and away games for each NZ team and either 4 or 5 Aust teams in the competition.
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Via an email I received:
The 2021 Super Rugby Draw is scheduled to be announced next week with the season kicking off from February 27, 2021. 2021 Memberships will include 4 x home matches against all NZ opponents & 2 x home matches against Australian opponents.So that implies a full set of home and away games for each NZ team and either 4 or 5 Aust teams in the competition.
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Via an email I received:
The 2021 Super Rugby Draw is scheduled to be announced next week with the season kicking off from February 27, 2021. 2021 Memberships will include 4 x home matches against all NZ opponents & 2 x home matches against Australian opponents.So that implies a full set of home and away games for each NZ team and either 4 or 5 Aust teams in the competition.
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Let's assume for the purpose of this exercise that Super Rugby as we know it, is kaput.
There's been plenty of media around this and with so much speculation going on, under the current circumstances and with the pre-Covid 19 talk around SA going a different way anyway, let's run with the concept that South African involvement is no longer tenable.
What is everyones' preferred model for 2021? Heaps of different things have been suggested, from a 'super-charged' season-long NPC (I'd love to see it this season in lieu of an abbreviated NZ-only Super Rugby comp), to a NZ and Australian comp, to the latter plus Argentina and then also something involving Japan and/or the Pacific Island nations.
I'm not going to go through why each of these models would or wouldn't work. I have a clear favourite, although a few moons have to align for it to happen.
What's certain is that any comp will involve five Kiwi franchises and at least four Australian teams. I say at least four because this could be a window of opportunity for the Western Force. It should also involve the Jaguares. Last years' beaten finalists have proven their worth as competitors and probably now as a drawcard, and we'd need the income from Argentinian TV rights. So that's 10 or 11 sides.
Without SA which provided the bulk of the all-important TV rights monies, we need another large nation with an interest, a playing base, finances and within striking distance of the South Pacific region. None of the Island nations fit that bill. The solution is obvious: Japan.
Problem is, it's been tried and for whatever reason didn't work (for Saanzar at least). But this isn't now Saanzar. It could however be Janzar. As long as this new iteration of SR didn't clash with the Top League, I think it could be put to the JRU that they could enter 4-5 Kiwi-style franchises made up of 3-4 Top League sides each (I think there are now 16?). It lenghthens their season for sure, but no more than ours, or Australia's, and let's be honest, the physicality of the Top League isn't to the same level of SR, and possibly not even quite to the level of the NPC, so this season isn't going to break guys. An incentive could be a commitment to regular games between Japan, NZ, Australia and Argentina, possibly even entry into the Rugby Championship in lieu of their bunnies South Africa.
Surely a heavy rather than half-hearted Japanese involvement in SR and TRC would yeild financial dividends and secure the future of these competitions and help us to retain players. It also opens up the possibility of the 4-5 Japanese teams signing a limited number of NZ players (on a 'sabbatical' basis) who could still be available for NZ, rather than losing them to European clubs. A bonus could be that these guys - if not selected for NZ - then come back and play NPC.
In an ideal world I'd like to see the Force return, although it does worry me how thin Australia's playing stocks would be when split five ways, plus five Japanese teams and the Jaguares (I could imagine though the Argentine RU could argue for another team or teams). That'd be 16 sides. It'd be a round robin, but I'd have two bye weekends for each side starting maybe two to three rounds in and completed with two to three rounds to go. This makes it a 17 week round robin and gives you a start and finish when you don't have any messy games-in-hand disparity. There wouldn't be any garbage conference systems and my finals series would be eight teams over three weeks (QF, SF and final). Total length 20 weeks. Let's say we had this comp this year, starting on Friday the 14th of February it would be completed on Saturday the 27th of June. A week off and then we host an in-bound tour for 3-4 weeks and get into TRC at the end of July or early August perhaps after another small gap. All going well, the last few weeks of the NPC we have full-strength provinces.
In terms of time zones, Japan works well for Australia and NZ but we would potentially lose some audience in Europe as games in SA were at a good time for them. The gains in Japan could outweigh that loss though.
Thoughts?
