Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November
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@taniwharugby So PUJ looks really promising in his Eden Park cameo and they give him zero more chances? He's been the best 13 in the country this season.
What a clown show.
@KiwiMurph said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@taniwharugby So PUJ looks really promising in his Eden Park cameo and they give him zero more chances? He's been the best 13 in the country this season.
What a clown show.
and not like the midfield is firing , i think most people would say its a weak point...try something new?...nah
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@pakman said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
- 73.30 ANOTHING FARKING PENALTY right in front. Scrum? No. Weber taps (tip from TJP?), turnover, kicked to halfway, dubious penalty from maul??, Sanchez kicks it. 10-25. GAME OVER.
I'm going in to bat for Weber on this one. To win that game, you need two tries, and the clock is against you. I can understand why you tap and go - try and keep the pace up, keep the Argies in oxygen deficit, and score quickly. So, I can understand the logic behind it, and it's not a horror decision.
I can also understand the kick to the corner and drive - but that did not work well for us in the game. We lost a lot of lineout ball.
BY this time we're chasing the game, too,
@nzzp said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@pakman said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
- 73.30 ANOTHING FARKING PENALTY right in front. Scrum? No. Weber taps (tip from TJP?), turnover, kicked to halfway, dubious penalty from maul??, Sanchez kicks it. 10-25. GAME OVER.
I'm going in to bat for Weber on this one. To win that game, you need two tries, and the clock is against you. I can understand why you tap and go - try and keep the pace up, keep the Argies in oxygen deficit, and score quickly. So, I can understand the logic behind it, and it's not a horror decision.
I can also understand the kick to the corner and drive - but that did not work well for us in the game. We lost a lot of lineout ball.
BY this time we're chasing the game, too,
Yep. I was screaming at the tv for them just to get farking on with it. Time was running out and there was absolutely no urgency.
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@taniwharugby So PUJ looks really promising in his Eden Park cameo and they give him zero more chances? He's been the best 13 in the country this season.
What a clown show.
@KiwiMurph we lack very little punch in the midfield atm. PUJ proved in Super Rugby he was hard to handle, why not give the kid a go.
Maybe if Foster wasn’t so conservative and actually selected the likes of PUJ and Jordan, we might not have been staring down 3 losses in a row.
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With regard to the midfield, I would add that Goodhue is a 13 not a 12. Select either him or ALB there and then get on with finding the right 12. Obviously I know who should be there, but that unfortunately will never happen.
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Starting the likes of PUJ, Will Jordan, Caleb Clarke, Akira Ioane from the beginning may have been a ticket out for Fozzie.
It might have covered up his uninspired coaching.
Perhaps he could have said they were experimenting with youth.As it is, he's played his top side, was overly Conservative, and lost.
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@KiwiMurph we lack very little punch in the midfield atm. PUJ proved in Super Rugby he was hard to handle, why not give the kid a go.
Maybe if Foster wasn’t so conservative and actually selected the likes of PUJ and Jordan, we might not have been staring down 3 losses in a row.
@Canes4life said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@KiwiMurph we lack very little punch in the midfield atm. PUJ proved in Super Rugby he was hard to handle, why not give the kid a go.
Maybe if Foster wasn’t so conservative and actually selected the likes of PUJ and Jordan, we might not have been staring down 3 losses in a row.
What you say makes far too much sense for Foster to listen to.
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Starting the likes of PUJ, Will Jordan, Caleb Clarke, Akira Ioane from the beginning may have been a ticket out for Fozzie.
It might have covered up his uninspired coaching.
Perhaps he could have said they were experimenting with youth.As it is, he's played his top side, was overly Conservative, and lost.
@Frank said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
As it is, he's played his top side, was overly Conservative, and lost.
This is a really really good point. We haven't really developed players, tried new things, we've just had a steady hand on a tiller and still lost.
The challenge for Fozzie now is to take two weeks to really get a new team moving in the right direction, and performing. When you see good coaching, you see clarity from people about their roles, and what good looks like. It's taking non-star players and getting the best out of them. We have seen the exact opposite of that so far - people going further backwards the longer they spend in camp.
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@Frank said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
As it is, he's played his top side, was overly Conservative, and lost.
This is a really really good point. We haven't really developed players, tried new things, we've just had a steady hand on a tiller and still lost.
The challenge for Fozzie now is to take two weeks to really get a new team moving in the right direction, and performing. When you see good coaching, you see clarity from people about their roles, and what good looks like. It's taking non-star players and getting the best out of them. We have seen the exact opposite of that so far - people going further backwards the longer they spend in camp.
@nzzp said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
The challenge for Fozzie now is to take two weeks to really get a new team moving in the right direction
TBF I dont think the team itself is too far off, its more tactics that are the worry, but yes, looking to the future is key too.
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@nzzp said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
The challenge for Fozzie now is to take two weeks to really get a new team moving in the right direction
TBF I dont think the team itself is too far off, its more tactics that are the worry, but yes, looking to the future is key too.
@taniwharugby said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@nzzp said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
The challenge for Fozzie now is to take two weeks to really get a new team moving in the right direction
TBF I dont think the team itself is too far off, its more tactics that are the worry, but yes, looking to the future is key too.
Tactics, execution and discipline
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@taniwharugby said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@nzzp said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
The challenge for Fozzie now is to take two weeks to really get a new team moving in the right direction
TBF I dont think the team itself is too far off, its more tactics that are the worry, but yes, looking to the future is key too.
Tactics, execution and discipline
@canefan our discipline on Saturday was better than the previous one, Argies were pinged more than us...and we didnt get any cards, so theres that
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@canefan our discipline on Saturday was better than the previous one, Argies were pinged more than us...and we didnt get any cards, so theres that
@taniwharugby said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@canefan our discipline on Saturday was better than the previous one, Argies were pinged more than us...and we didnt get any cards, so theres that
I had to stop watching after 25 minutes and once I learned the result I never bothered to watch the rest, so I'll take your word for it
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Somewhat interesting that the last time the All Blacks nearly lost to Argentina it was Scott Robertson that saved them.
@Unite said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
Somewhat interesting that the last time the All Blacks nearly lost to Argentina it was Scott Robertson that saved them.
at least they had the excuse of last game of the season and being out on the diesel all week. Not so much this time.
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PUJ had some defensive deficiencies previously in Super Rugby. Not sure we have seen enough of him to know if they have been sorted.
@Crazy-Horse said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
PUJ had some defensive deficiencies previously in Super Rugby. Not sure we have seen enough of him to know if they have been sorted.
People say this about Jordan too but can't say I've noticed it, so is it really that bad? Because I'm definitely noticing defensive and attacking deficiencies of those there at the moment.
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@Jailbreak7 is KQ and I claim my bag of chips.
@Gibbit's reply had me in stitches.
https://twitter.com/oldmannato/status/1328252640866619393?s=19
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Currently in a debate on another forum, apparently when coles gave that guy a wee slap it was all his fault for starting something....and when frizell got shoved in the face he was to blame because he retaliated...and it’s all made doubly worse because they slapped rather than shoved which is inherently more disrespectful...which is something the abs have always been...disrespectful to anyone the player...man there are people out there that really don’t like us...we’re bad losers, bad winners and when we draw we’re just disrespectful
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Deep breath.
Been avoiding this thread since half time on Saturday as I'm sure it's all been analysed far more expertly and written far more eloquently than I could manage.
Have not read this thread (kinda glanced over some of the others) and it probably take me all week to read all of this. But will share thoughts regardless.
What would have been funny is recording Mrs Boo's watching experience. Didn't get that potty mouth from me.
Anyway, at that stage in the thread I was angry with both our idiot fumble fingered directionless passive lumps of lard and Angus Gardner.
I don't like having a crack at refs (but I still do it) but I'll give myself leave to have a shot at Angus who was awful in that first half. He got gamed by the Argies and should have pinged them from that first argument where Sanchez whined and whinged.
It went too far and deserved a rebuke.
Then he got suckered by their niggle and our stoopid stoopid reaction to it. Not sure who was dumber, Angus or Coles and Frizzel.
So he settled into the mindset of if the ABs look like they're infringing they are. The Jordie "late charge" was just ridiculous.
But I'm not here to whinge about Angus, as his level of dumb was steadily overtaken by us as the game wore on. However I do have to say he contributed to their lead which forced us into catch up footy. But we overshadowed him in contributing to our own demise.
Lots to complain about, but mostly our lack of go forward. And ball skills.
Random thoughts follow.
I really worry about the effectiveness of our tight five. We just weren't getting over the advantage line.
Sam W was Sam W, but the rest were kind of ineffectual.
We seem to have overrated SRA. Paddy T ( huge fan) had not delivered in tests.
We looked small. Since when? Missed the "pack weight" graphic. IIRC correctly the first scrum was waaay into the game so we may all have missed it. (Was I right in thinking it was 30 odd minutes in? Or did I just miss it?).
Argues gamedvthe ref (see above). Kudos.
Wherever we were trying to hit it up/Take it into contact they read us I said at half time that I felt we were running big guys into the 13 channel, and that there seemed to be more space wider. I'm not talking trying to shift it to the winger to score off first phase. I'm talking about finding somewhere where we can get over the gain line. Thought we either had to do that really close, or really wide.
Maybe some inside balls would be good.
Not convinced about our kicking. To my mind you either belt the living daylights out of it or just don't. Keep it in hand. Forget box kicking it achieves nothing for us.
I agree with @gt12 about just picking one. Pick Sam. Pick specialist (and very talented Sotutu at) 8. And even though Frizzell was much more effective that previously, puck the best 6, Ioane, at 6. Ardie comes off the bench.
Would have preferred Beaudy at 10, Jordie at 15, but realistically 10/15 of either RM/BB or BB/JB should do the job.
12 and 13 are round the wrong way.
Reiko should start on the wing. Either. And, despite being a massive fanboi, I think he needs to reign it in just a tad. The Instagram post is indicative of a bit if a tood.
In all of that, I think our backs are close, but our forwards really need to find their mojo.
Also, her resembled Australia with the amount of dropped ball.
And finally ... I started a bit of a rant last week post Brisbane, about conceding penalties. Just don't! If we get isolated release the fucking ball. Conceding possession and 30m-40m of territory is not worth it. Let them have it and work hard for the territory. So often we give away a penalty on attack, nay the 22, and find ourselves conceding points from a lineout 30km out from our own line. Stop it.
Have to say I was not convinced by Bled 2 and 3. Despite the record score in 3 we stopped playing for 30minutes.
I really want Fozzie to succeed. He is the All Black coach after all. And we're guaranteed him until this time next year (so stop the whinging). But I understand the reservations.
So much for "I'll just do a short post then flick through the thread". I'm sure this has all been said. But I restart the read from half time and catch up with you all in about a week.
