Springboks v British & Irish Lions I
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@act-crusader funny you'd say that, I actually think they got the loose-trio wrong. Curry I agree with, but not so much the other two.
I don't see what the Lawes selection brings, for all the talk about his physicality and brawn I have never seen him have great game. I have been massively impressed by Beirne on tour and even in the six nations and if I had to choose between the two players it would even be close.
Conan seems like gimmick selection. Gatland wanted the best athlete he could find but I haven't seen anything so far on tour to suggest that he will be able to impose himself on the Springbok defence. I don't know if Gatland had any better options available to him.
Having said that there is now 1000 per cent chance those two are going tear it up this weekend.
@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@act-crusader funny you'd say that, I actually think they got the loose-trio wrong. Curry I agree with, but not so much the other two.
I don't see what the Lawes selection brings, for all the talk about his physicality and brawn I have never seen him have great game. I have been massively impressed by Beirne on tour and even in the six nations and if I had to choose between the two players it would even be close.
Conan seems like gimmick selection. Gatland wanted the best athlete he could find but I haven't seen anything so far on tour to suggest that he will be able to impose himself on the Springbok defence. I don't know if Gatland had any better options available to him.
Having said that there is now 1000 per cent chance those two are going tear it up this weekend.
Lawes is there if AWJ breaks early
He'll be warmed up and slip straight into second row.
On comes Beirne at 6
If the Lawes (Beirne), Curry, Conan combo isn't working then on comes Watson either as a direct replacement for Curry or in addition to Curry to pick up the tempo
Second scenario Watson replaces Conan and Curry goes to 8
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@sidbarret I thought Lawes had a pretty good 6N. I'd pick him over Itoje...
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@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@bones yeah sure, but Itoje was pretty rubbish in the 6n so that isn't saying much
Odd you say that. In the two matches where pretty much the whole team went missing -v Scotland and v Ireland, Itoje was our one bright spark, belying all the excuses of either not enough rugby (Sarries boys) or too much rugby (everyone else). He did get pinged a fair bit but that was understandable if he’s the only bugger putting himself about.
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@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@act-crusader funny you'd say that, I actually think they got the loose-trio wrong. Curry I agree with, but not so much the other two.
I don't see what the Lawes selection brings, for all the talk about his physicality and brawn I have never seen him have great game. I have been massively impressed by Beirne on tour and even in the six nations and if I had to choose between the two players it would even be close.
Conan seems like gimmick selection. Gatland wanted the best athlete he could find but I haven't seen anything so far on tour to suggest that he will be able to impose himself on the Springbok defence. I don't know if Gatland had any better options available to him.
Having said that there is now 1000 per cent chance those two are going tear it up this weekend.
Lawes is there if AWJ breaks early
He'll be warmed up and slip straight into second row.
On comes Beirne at 6
If the Lawes (Beirne), Curry, Conan combo isn't working then on comes Watson either as a direct replacement for Curry or in addition to Curry to pick up the tempo
Second scenario Watson replaces Conan and Curry goes to 8
@mikethesnow I get that he offers versatility, but if he is there to cover lock, is he really the next best that lions have and could he not do that from the bench?
Watson is another interesting one. He obviously offers a lot carrying and pilfering the ball, but does he have the stopping power to win the gain line? I know it is just one instance, but in the second sharks game the sharks ran lock at him off line out for a massive gain. If the lions can open up the game he can be great for them, but if bok bench get roll on late in the game I fear he could be targeted.
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@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@act-crusader funny you'd say that, I actually think they got the loose-trio wrong. Curry I agree with, but not so much the other two.
I don't see what the Lawes selection brings, for all the talk about his physicality and brawn I have never seen him have great game. I have been massively impressed by Beirne on tour and even in the six nations and if I had to choose between the two players it would even be close.
Conan seems like gimmick selection. Gatland wanted the best athlete he could find but I haven't seen anything so far on tour to suggest that he will be able to impose himself on the Springbok defence. I don't know if Gatland had any better options available to him.
Having said that there is now 1000 per cent chance those two are going tear it up this weekend.
Lawes is there if AWJ breaks early
He'll be warmed up and slip straight into second row.
On comes Beirne at 6
If the Lawes (Beirne), Curry, Conan combo isn't working then on comes Watson either as a direct replacement for Curry or in addition to Curry to pick up the tempo
Second scenario Watson replaces Conan and Curry goes to 8
@mikethesnow said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@act-crusader funny you'd say that, I actually think they got the loose-trio wrong. Curry I agree with, but not so much the other two.
I don't see what the Lawes selection brings, for all the talk about his physicality and brawn I have never seen him have great game. I have been massively impressed by Beirne on tour and even in the six nations and if I had to choose between the two players it would even be close.
Conan seems like gimmick selection. Gatland wanted the best athlete he could find but I haven't seen anything so far on tour to suggest that he will be able to impose himself on the Springbok defence. I don't know if Gatland had any better options available to him.
Having said that there is now 1000 per cent chance those two are going tear it up this weekend.
Lawes is there if AWJ breaks early
He'll be warmed up and slip straight into second row.
On comes Beirne at 6
If the Lawes (Beirne), Curry, Conan combo isn't working then on comes Watson either as a direct replacement for Curry or in addition to Curry to pick up the tempo
Second scenario Watson replaces Conan and Curry goes to 8
Nail. Head. I think we’d have seen a different back row had AWJ not just been coming back from injury. Although I’m not keen on the balance of the back 5 in the forwards, I can see the rationale. If we had two 80 minute locks we’d have a much different back row. I’d like to have seen Beirne, Simmonds and then Curry/Watson.
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@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@bones yeah sure, but Itoje was pretty rubbish in the 6n so that isn't saying much
Odd you say that. In the two matches where pretty much the whole team went missing -v Scotland and v Ireland, Itoje was our one bright spark, belying all the excuses of either not enough rugby (Sarries boys) or too much rugby (everyone else). He did get pinged a fair bit but that was understandable if he’s the only bugger putting himself about.
@catogrande obviously you would pay closer attention than me when England is playing and saw more of the good that Itoje did, but you have be truly amazing to balance out (I think) 6 penalties in a game.
But yeah, maybe I just don't notice what Lawes brings to the team. It really would not have been issue had I not been so impressed with what I see from Beirne.
On a more general note the Lions selection was always gonna be interesting. It feels like there are very few nailed on starters, but just about everybody they brought on tour is good enough to start. The difference between their best and worst option is much smaller than on previous tours, largely because weaker players are better.
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@catogrande obviously you would pay closer attention than me when England is playing and saw more of the good that Itoje did, but you have be truly amazing to balance out (I think) 6 penalties in a game.
But yeah, maybe I just don't notice what Lawes brings to the team. It really would not have been issue had I not been so impressed with what I see from Beirne.
On a more general note the Lions selection was always gonna be interesting. It feels like there are very few nailed on starters, but just about everybody they brought on tour is good enough to start. The difference between their best and worst option is much smaller than on previous tours, largely because weaker players are better.
@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@catogrande obviously you would pay closer attention than me when England is playing and saw more of the good that Itoje did, but you have be truly amazing to balance out (I think) 6 penalties in a game.
But yeah, maybe I just don't notice what Lawes brings to the team. It really would not have been issue had I not been so impressed with what I see from Beirne.
On a more general note the Lions selection was always gonna be interesting. It feels like there are very few nailed on starters, but just about everybody they brought on tour is good enough to start. The difference between their best and worst option is much smaller than on previous tours, largely because weaker players are better.
I think Eddie popularised the term 'finishers'
Beirne is a better 'finisher' than Lawes.
Lawes has a very balanced, complete game.
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@catogrande obviously you would pay closer attention than me when England is playing and saw more of the good that Itoje did, but you have be truly amazing to balance out (I think) 6 penalties in a game.
But yeah, maybe I just don't notice what Lawes brings to the team. It really would not have been issue had I not been so impressed with what I see from Beirne.
On a more general note the Lions selection was always gonna be interesting. It feels like there are very few nailed on starters, but just about everybody they brought on tour is good enough to start. The difference between their best and worst option is much smaller than on previous tours, largely because weaker players are better.
@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@catogrande obviously you would pay closer attention than me when England is playing and saw more of the good that Itoje did, but you have be truly amazing to balance out (I think) 6 penalties in a game.>
Yeah 6 penalties is too much (Scotland game I think) but two of those were harsh in anyone’s view (downright wrong in my one-eyed opinion), so we could just as easily be talking about 4 penalties. Taking into account his role as general nuisance, the match itself and most of his colleagues taking the day off, I’d take that.
But yeah, maybe I just don't notice what Lawes brings to the team. It really would not have been issue had I not been so impressed with what I see from Beirne.>
Lawes for me is a good bench option. Very good lock and can do a good job at 6, but purely as a 6 I’d take Beirne everyday and also Navidi before Lawes.
On a more general note the Lions selection was always gonna be interesting. It feels like there are very few nailed on starters, but just about everybody they brought on tour is good enough to start. The difference between their best and worst option is much smaller than on previous tours, largely because weaker players are better.>
100%
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Cock on block prediction - I think both teams are going to surprise us with their tactics. I think the lions are going to try and play like the Boks and Boks are going play a lot wider and looser than what we are used to.
I still think think we'll see the boks box kicking a lot in their own half, we probably see more inter-passing amongst the forwards. I think we'll also see Kolisi slotting into the Vermeulen role in the middle of the pitch with Smith in the wider channels (the Kieran Read role). This suits Kolisi better and I think we might see a big game from him.
The starting lions pack will try and impose themselves on the Boks with more scrumming for penalties and mauling. I don't think they are suited to big multi-phase attacks against this Springbok defence, but with Biggar, Daly and Hogg think they will try to get the ball wide with strike moves designed to score off first and second phase.
If the big strike play is stopped, I think they will be happy to kick long rather than endlessly recycling the ball. South Africa will of course kick it back, so expect a lot ping pong.
I really hope both teams can keep their discipline and we don't see anyone sent off. The most likely player to get into trouble for South Africa is Elstadt (who should not be in the team because he is shit).
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Cock on block prediction - I think both teams are going to surprise us with their tactics. I think the lions are going to try and play like the Boks and Boks are going play a lot wider and looser than what we are used to.
I still think think we'll see the boks box kicking a lot in their own half, we probably see more inter-passing amongst the forwards. I think we'll also see Kolisi slotting into the Vermeulen role in the middle of the pitch with Smith in the wider channels (the Kieran Read role). This suits Kolisi better and I think we might see a big game from him.
The starting lions pack will try and impose themselves on the Boks with more scrumming for penalties and mauling. I don't think they are suited to big multi-phase attacks against this Springbok defence, but with Biggar, Daly and Hogg think they will try to get the ball wide with strike moves designed to score off first and second phase.
If the big strike play is stopped, I think they will be happy to kick long rather than endlessly recycling the ball. South Africa will of course kick it back, so expect a lot ping pong.
I really hope both teams can keep their discipline and we don't see anyone sent off. The most likely player to get into trouble for South Africa is Elstadt (who should not be in the team because he is shit).
@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
Cock on block prediction - I think both teams are going to surprise us with their tactics. I think the lions are going to try and play like the Boks and Boks are going play a lot wider and looser than what we are used to.
I still think think we'll see the boks box kicking a lot in their own half, we probably see more inter-passing amongst the forwards. I think we'll also see Kolisi slotting into the Vermeulen role in the middle of the pitch with Smith in the wider channels (the Kieran Read role). This suits Kolisi better and I think we might see a big game from him.
The starting lions pack will try and impose themselves on the Boks with more scrumming for penalties and mauling. I don't think they are suited to big multi-phase attacks against this Springbok defence, but with Biggar, Daly and Hogg think they will try to get the ball wide with strike moves designed to score off first and second phase.
If the big strike play is stopped, I think they will be happy to kick long rather than endlessly recycling the ball. South Africa will of course kick it back, so expect a lot ping pong.
I really hope both teams can keep their discipline and we don't see anyone sent off. The most likely player to get into trouble for South Africa is Elstadt (who should not be in the team because he is shit).
Agree with the style of play
Boks 17 - 13 BIL
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BIL by 6
22-16
@act-crusader said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
BIL by 6
22-16
I have weird feeling that game is not going to be close - something like 32 - 12, but fucked if I know who is going to score the 32.
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@mikethesnow I get that he offers versatility, but if he is there to cover lock, is he really the next best that lions have and could he not do that from the bench?
Watson is another interesting one. He obviously offers a lot carrying and pilfering the ball, but does he have the stopping power to win the gain line? I know it is just one instance, but in the second sharks game the sharks ran lock at him off line out for a massive gain. If the lions can open up the game he can be great for them, but if bok bench get roll on late in the game I fear he could be targeted.
@sidbarret said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@mikethesnow I get that he offers versatility, but if he is there to cover lock, is he really the next best that lions have and could he not do that from the bench?
Watson is another interesting one. He obviously offers a lot carrying and pilfering the ball, but does he have the stopping power to win the gain line? I know it is just one instance, but in the second sharks game the sharks ran lock at him off line out for a massive gain. If the lions can open up the game he can be great for them, but if bok bench get roll on late in the game I fear he could be targeted.
Isn't Kwagga Smith starting for the Boks? Surely Watson can get the same amount of go forward
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Another factor to keep in mind is the refereeing - Berry is for me the best of the referees in this series. I really don't like O'Keefe (too random) and know nothing Raynal other than being French which does not instill much confidence.
The way the maul is refereed is going to be very contentious with South Africa either complaining about players being in on the side or the Lions supporters wondering why they are being penalized. The way it is being refereed at the moment is really dogs breakfast and the sooner world rugby sorts it out the better.
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6-7-8 (and9) always a good thing to have settled in a team I reckon. We are going to miss Duane V. And Skipper Kolisi Covid recovery untested…. Watson WILL be in maximum 50 mins IMO. Sublime at the moment. We will also miss retired Flo as bomb squad loosie.
Front row Trev is legend but even though I thought he was scrummed in on twice illegally Argie style in SA -A match…. they will have worked that shit out hopefully.
Midfield fuknose why BIL didn’t pick Faletau? Monster …
Still going Boks by 9 coz I do love my Saffa blinkers
Looking forward to a lekker game and the sun will be shining 
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6-7-8 (and9) always a good thing to have settled in a team I reckon. We are going to miss Duane V. And Skipper Kolisi Covid recovery untested…. Watson WILL be in maximum 50 mins IMO. Sublime at the moment. We will also miss retired Flo as bomb squad loosie.
Front row Trev is legend but even though I thought he was scrummed in on twice illegally Argie style in SA -A match…. they will have worked that shit out hopefully.
Midfield fuknose why BIL didn’t pick Faletau? Monster …
Still going Boks by 9 coz I do love my Saffa blinkers Looking forward to a lekker game and the sun will be shining @mantissanet said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
Midfield fuknose why BIL didn’t pick Faletau? Monster …
Aki? Kinda different...
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@mantissanet said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
Midfield fuknose why BIL didn’t pick Faletau? Monster …
Aki? Kinda different...
@bones I kinda like him…scratch that… I’m of the opinion centres run the game… he reminds me of Jauzion
Love his game full stop -
@bones I kinda like him…scratch that… I’m of the opinion centres run the game… he reminds me of Jauzion
Love his game full stop@mantissanet said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@bones I kinda like him…scratch that… I’m of the opinion centres run the game… he reminds me of Jauzion
Love his game full stopHaha no I mean Faletau is an 8, so not a midfielder...
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@bones I kinda like him…scratch that… I’m of the opinion centres run the game… he reminds me of Jauzion
Love his game full stop@mantissanet said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@bones I kinda like him…scratch that… I’m of the opinion centres run the game… he reminds me of Jauzion
Love his game full stopIf you’d talking number 8s don’t you mean Picamoles ? What a game he had against the ABs in 2015
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@mantissanet said in Springboks v British & Irish Lions 1:
@bones I kinda like him…scratch that… I’m of the opinion centres run the game… he reminds me of Jauzion
Love his game full stopHaha no I mean Faletau is an 8, so not a midfielder...
@bones I rest my case
