All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour
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@kiwiwomble said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@chris in general yes...but...when ask the also say they're aiming to play this broken counter attack kind of rugby...but when they get the ball in broken play they look frantic...are they looking for an organised kind of broken play?
I don't know it looks like they are a bit confused, maybe no clear messages from the coaching staff.
as JB mostly kicked the ball straight down centre field and gave possession away, normally we would try to counter attack with space in front of us.
@chris said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@kiwiwomble said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@chris in general yes...but...when ask the also say they're aiming to play this broken counter attack kind of rugby...but when they get the ball in broken play they look frantic...are they looking for an organised kind of broken play?
I don't know it looks like they are a bit confused, maybe no clear messages from the coaching staff.
as JB mostly kicked the ball straight down centre field and gave possession away, normally we would try to counter attack with space in front of us.
Jordie kicked quite a lot to right hand touch.
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@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
If Cane 100% fit, I’d like to see him, Paps and Akira start with Savea on bench.
Nugget and Weber 9.
Havili and Tuapea midfield.
Yuck. If Tupaea starts he has to play 2nd 5, and Havili isn't a centre.
The selection of the halfback, loose forwards and TH prop will tell us if the coaches are going to address what they said were problems against Ireland.
@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
If Cane 100% fit, I’d like to see him, Paps and Akira start with Savea on bench.
Nugget and Weber 9.
Havili and Tuapea midfield.
Yuck. If Tupaea starts he has to play 2nd 5, and Havili isn't a centre.
The selection of the halfback, loose forwards and TH prop will tell us if the coaches are going to address what they said were problems against Ireland.
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
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When is the team named, seriously?
Is it a Sunday game again, meaning team naming is a bloody Friday?
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When is the team named, seriously?
Is it a Sunday game again, meaning team naming is a bloody Friday?
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
When is the team named, seriously?
Is it a Sunday game again, meaning team naming is a bloody Friday?
Game at 9 p.m. Saturday French time.
Team named in about three hours.
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
When is the team named, seriously?
Is it a Sunday game again, meaning team naming is a bloody Friday?
Game at 9 p.m. Saturday French time.
Team named in about three hours.
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
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@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
Calling @bayimports ?
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@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
If Cane 100% fit, I’d like to see him, Paps and Akira start with Savea on bench.
Nugget and Weber 9.
Havili and Tuapea midfield.
Yuck. If Tupaea starts he has to play 2nd 5, and Havili isn't a centre.
The selection of the halfback, loose forwards and TH prop will tell us if the coaches are going to address what they said were problems against Ireland.
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
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@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
I fucking hope so.
I miss (late career) Owen Franks and his 8 tackles made, two tackles missed, 2 carries, 4 metres. It's that bad.
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
Calling @bayimports ?
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
Calling @bayimports ?
unfortunately that mate took a different role, so no more hot sauce
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@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
Much like Franks before him, I tend to query just how good a scrummager he is. Does he never, ever, ever get penalised or FK'd? Does he absolutely dominate, or is he just mostly reliable on our own ball, but like Franks, prone to giving away the occasional penalty? Because that just doesn't cut it for me - I'll take an extra 1 or 2 penalties at scrumtime for someone who can actually hurt the opposition in every other aspect of play (ball in hand, distribution, tackling, lineouts, rucks, mauls....).
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@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
Calling @bayimports ?
unfortunately that mate took a different role, so no more hot sauce
@bayimports said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
Calling @bayimports ?
unfortunately that mate took a different role, so no more hot sauce
Sorry to hear you guys split up.
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If Cane 100% fit, I’d like to see him, Paps and Akira start with Savea on bench.
Nugget and Weber 9.
Havili and Tuapea midfield.
Rieko and Jordan wings.
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
If Cane 100% fit, I’d like to see him, Paps and Akira start with Savea on bench.
Nugget and Weber 9.
Havili and Tuapea midfield.
Rieko and Jordan wings.
Going to need a whole load of dog for the first 40 at least.
Blackadder, Cane, Dalton
Savea for when it opens up
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@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
Much like Franks before him, I tend to query just how good a scrummager he is. Does he never, ever, ever get penalised or FK'd? Does he absolutely dominate, or is he just mostly reliable on our own ball, but like Franks, prone to giving away the occasional penalty? Because that just doesn't cut it for me - I'll take an extra 1 or 2 penalties at scrumtime for someone who can actually hurt the opposition in every other aspect of play (ball in hand, distribution, tackling, lineouts, rucks, mauls....).
@bones said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
Much like Franks before him, I tend to query just how good a scrummager he is. Does he never, ever, ever get penalised or FK'd? Does he absolutely dominate, or is he just mostly reliable on our own ball, but like Franks, prone to giving away the occasional penalty? Because that just doesn't cut it for me - I'll take an extra 1 or 2 penalties at scrumtime for someone who can actually hurt the opposition in every other aspect of play (ball in hand, distribution, tackling, lineouts, rucks, mauls....).
I never played prop, but my take is that Nepo and Owen are very correct technically in that they push straight and square, and transmit the power behind them very effectively. In the first 40 that seems highly desirable, against the staring oppo front row, who will be fresh.
There are attacking THs, perhaps like Meeuws, but that seems often to involve angling in some way, and can be very badly exposed by a top LH, such as Woody did to Kees. It seems LHs can more safely attack, and historically Joe (and Karl) are very good at that.
One thing we can agree on is that if TH gets muntered the scrum can become a huge problem.
Perhaps take a leak out of Bok playbook and play THs 40 minutes each? -
@bones said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
Much like Franks before him, I tend to query just how good a scrummager he is. Does he never, ever, ever get penalised or FK'd? Does he absolutely dominate, or is he just mostly reliable on our own ball, but like Franks, prone to giving away the occasional penalty? Because that just doesn't cut it for me - I'll take an extra 1 or 2 penalties at scrumtime for someone who can actually hurt the opposition in every other aspect of play (ball in hand, distribution, tackling, lineouts, rucks, mauls....).
I never played prop, but my take is that Nepo and Owen are very correct technically in that they push straight and square, and transmit the power behind them very effectively. In the first 40 that seems highly desirable, against the staring oppo front row, who will be fresh.
There are attacking THs, perhaps like Meeuws, but that seems often to involve angling in some way, and can be very badly exposed by a top LH, such as Woody did to Kees. It seems LHs can more safely attack, and historically Joe (and Karl) are very good at that.
One thing we can agree on is that if TH gets muntered the scrum can become a huge problem.
Perhaps take a leak out of Bok playbook and play THs 40 minutes each?@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
I never played prop, but my take is that Nepo and Owen are very correct technically in that they push straight and square, and transmit the power behind them very effectively. In the first 40 that seems highly desirable, against the staring oppo front row, who will be fresh.
Sure, but he still gets penalised at scrum time, so I'm just not sure what we're actually seeing? If he was amazing and 100% reliable then ok, I can kind of understand it - but what's the cost for the other 95% of the game? If he's giving away pens on defence, missing tackles, dropping the pill (TJ doesn't help), throwing shitty passes, then I just can't see how the trade off is of any value, even more so when he's not 100% reliable at scrum time, it seems quite absurd.
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@bayimports said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
Calling @bayimports ?
unfortunately that mate took a different role, so no more hot sauce
Sorry to hear you guys split up.
@bones said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@bayimports said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman that's stupid...ill be asleep by then.
Calling @bayimports ?
unfortunately that mate took a different role, so no more hot sauce
Sorry to hear you guys split up.
i didnt say we split up, just a different role, Im now on top..
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@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
I do hear you. Nepo isn't a naturally coordinated type of fellow. That said, I thought he did well against Wales. Time in squad would suggest they are clear he's the man scrum time. I suspect he's also a pretty good lifter.
Need Joe to step up on looser stuff. Still remember him throwing behind back offload against French in 2015! -
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
I never played prop, but my take is that Nepo and Owen are very correct technically in that they push straight and square, and transmit the power behind them very effectively. In the first 40 that seems highly desirable, against the staring oppo front row, who will be fresh.
Sure, but he still gets penalised at scrum time, so I'm just not sure what we're actually seeing? If he was amazing and 100% reliable then ok, I can kind of understand it - but what's the cost for the other 95% of the game? If he's giving away pens on defence, missing tackles, dropping the pill (TJ doesn't help), throwing shitty passes, then I just can't see how the trade off is of any value, even more so when he's not 100% reliable at scrum time, it seems quite absurd.
@bones said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
I never played prop, but my take is that Nepo and Owen are very correct technically in that they push straight and square, and transmit the power behind them very effectively. In the first 40 that seems highly desirable, against the staring oppo front row, who will be fresh.
Sure, but he still gets penalised at scrum time, so I'm just not sure what we're actually seeing? If he was amazing and 100% reliable then ok, I can kind of understand it - but what's the cost for the other 95% of the game? If he's giving away pens on defence, missing tackles, dropping the pill (TJ doesn't help), throwing shitty passes, then I just can't see how the trade off is of any value, even more so when he's not 100% reliable at scrum time, it seems quite absurd.
It may be the refs who aren't 100% reliable at scrum time.
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Pakman team:
Joe/Coles/Nepo/BBBR/Whitelock/Cane(if 100%)/Paps/Akira/Nugget/Ritchie/Quinn/Reece/Rieko/Jordan/Jordie
Bench: Karl/Samsoni/Lomax/Vaa'i/Ardie/Weber/DMac/Havili
If Cane not 100%, Paps to 7 and Sotutu at 8.
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Pakman team:
Joe/Coles/Nepo/BBBR/Whitelock/Cane(if 100%)/Paps/Akira/Nugget/Ritchie/Quinn/Reece/Rieko/Jordan/Jordie
Bench: Karl/Samsoni/Lomax/Vaa'i/Ardie/Weber/DMac/Havili
If Cane not 100%, Paps to 7 and Sotutu at 8.
Is Jacobson available? He doesn't seem to have as much impact against the top sides IMHO as earlier in the season? And although he seemed to do well at 6, and initially at 8, seems a bit quiet to me in more recent games, but perhaps he was working in tight hence I saw less of him..
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@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
I do hear you. Nepo isn't a naturally coordinated type of fellow. That said, I thought he did well against Wales. Time in squad would suggest they are clear he's the man scrum time. I suspect he's also a pretty good lifter.
Need Joe to step up on looser stuff. Still remember him throwing behind back offload against French in 2015!@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@bovidae said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
@pakman said in All Blacks v France, 2021 NH Tour:
Against Cyril Baille you want your best scrummager starting. It isn’t Lomax.
I've been one of most vocal supporters of Laulala, mainly for his scrummaging ability. I am certainly not suggesting Lomax starts, but Tu'ungafasi if he is dropped. In reality I expect Laulala will be retained, but his time in black must be coming to an end because of his lack of impact around the field.
I do hear you. Nepo isn't a naturally coordinated type of fellow. That said, I thought he did well against Wales. Time in squad would suggest they are clear he's the man scrum time. I suspect he's also a pretty good lifter.
Need Joe to step up on looser stuff. Still remember him throwing behind back offload against French in 2015!I might be imagining it, but I seem to recall when Laulala started out at the Crusaders, he was a mobile prop with good loose skills? He's not on his own, but the all round handling in the team has taken a complete nose dive this season - whether that is stemming from the terrible service from halfback, or just lack of appropriate training I can't be sure. But like I said - Smith plays and we're a completely different team - is that papering over the cracks, or is it just having a halfback that can adequately perform his role?
