The Current State of Rugby
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@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
This argument of TV money vs bums on seats balancing out surely has more nuance to it.....
The Heineken cup (or whatever it is called now) up North has a sense of occasion about each game.
The stadiums have atmosphere and are generally rammed.
Seeing Danes Coles run on for his final home game to 12 people and a dog is just deflating.
The optics are terrible.
I find it jarring when I watch the highlights and the commentator be it an Aussie or Kiwi is trying to give the viewer a gee up "week 11 in super rugby and its a top of the table clash between Brumbies and Chiefs".....cuts to two teams running out to a handful of people. It's all quite odd.
It seems unsustainable to me. If the locals are that disenfranchised. Either its too expensive, on at inconvenient times, or people don't care enough any more. And that should worry the various Unions and Authorities involved.
Firstly I think NZers don't attend sport any more. Aussie have a different crowd demographic for rugby so my comment doesn't include them.
Evening games in winter in particular. Good on NZR for changing to the 7pm kick-off, which alleviates some of that. And good on them for having earlier games.
But it's not the standard of the Rugby that is affecting crowds. Somehow they need to make it more attractive, easier and cheaper for people to go.
@booboo said in The Current State of Rugby:
But it's not the standard of the Rugby that is affecting crowds. Somehow they need to make it more attractive, easier and cheaper for people to go.
It is for me, but I've largely fallen out of love for professional rugby. Appreciate I'm a sample of 1, but I can't be bothered as much any more; I'll still watch and support, but it's dropped well down my priority list. A lot of that is to do with the quality of the game these days; I find it far more grinding and less imagininative than we had. Modern defences, refs, laws and bulked up players don't help. There's arguably better watching at Club or NPC
So, not taking a season ticket next year for the first time in 17 years. I'll go, but will pick and choose the games around my life outside the oval ball
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This argument of TV money vs bums on seats balancing out surely has more nuance to it.....
The Heineken cup (or whatever it is called now) up North has a sense of occasion about each game.
The stadiums have atmosphere and are generally rammed.
Seeing Danes Coles run on for his final home game to 12 people and a dog is just deflating.
The optics are terrible.
I find it jarring when I watch the highlights and the commentator be it an Aussie or Kiwi is trying to give the viewer a gee up "week 11 in super rugby and its a top of the table clash between Brumbies and Chiefs".....cuts to two teams running out to a handful of people. It's all quite odd.
It seems unsustainable to me. If the locals are that disenfranchised. Either its too expensive, on at inconvenient times, or people don't care enough any more. And that should worry the various Unions and Authorities involved.
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
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@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
I don't think we are that much different to other parts of the world, just our low population brings everything into sharp relief.
We used to be different because rugby (aside from racing and beer) was the only gig in our little country so it got a much bigger % of attention than it was due.
Do those fans in europe watch all the games or just the ones that are relevant to their team? Those crowds as a proportion of population? The population density is another factor as there is a decent catchment close to the game (or regular transport). Then you have away fans. With bigger populations comes better transport networks and away fans are a real thing. -
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
I don't think we are that much different to other parts of the world, just our low population brings everything into sharp relief.
We used to be different because rugby (aside from racing and beer) was the only gig in our little country so it got a much bigger % of attention than it was due.
Do those fans in europe watch all the games or just the ones that are relevant to their team? Those crowds as a proportion of population? The population density is another factor as there is a decent catchment close to the game (or regular transport). Then you have away fans. With bigger populations comes better transport networks and away fans are a real thing.@Crucial said in The Current State of Rugby:
away fans are a real thing.
all that said, I'm a filthy hypocrite as I'm sliding down SH1 to FMG Stadium tomorrow with an old friend from overseas to watch the game. And as a long time Blues fan, I'll be supporting the Chefs against the anti-rugby Horse People.
I feel slightly ill, but that might only be the thought of someone potentially drinking Waikato Draught.
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have to say, we dont do ourselves any favours with stadiums that are too big for super/NPC level, lots of premiership stadiums are under 15k, but everyone here as stadiums for the one , at most, AB test they might get so theyre much bigger than they need to be most of the time.....which makes 8-10k people look like a few hundred
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Highlanders are a great example of the kiwi tyranny of distance and sparse population. Plenty here in Central Otago that would love to go to games but a round trip to Dunners is out of the question. The realistic crowd catchment for the Landers is very small and without the students with cheap/free passes to the zoo the stadium would be very light on numbers.
Yes, if the team performed better and the likelihood of a positive night out was in the offing, more would go but there's still a relative cap on spectators in a general sense.
The opportunity though is that rugby can still be the big offering in town. Other options are taking games to Invercargill and Queenstown. -
Highlanders are a great example of the kiwi tyranny of distance and sparse population. Plenty here in Central Otago that would love to go to games but a round trip to Dunners is out of the question. The realistic crowd catchment for the Landers is very small and without the students with cheap/free passes to the zoo the stadium would be very light on numbers.
Yes, if the team performed better and the likelihood of a positive night out was in the offing, more would go but there's still a relative cap on spectators in a general sense.
The opportunity though is that rugby can still be the big offering in town. Other options are taking games to Invercargill and Queenstown.@Crucial the fanbase of the North Queensland Cowboys calls bullshit
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@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
The punditry is too nice and friendly these days.
We actually need the odd contrarian who nails his colours to the mast and slates the odd player.
Watching the breakdown they basically name every candidate for a shirt and say "yeah he's tracking alrite, he could be in with a shout".
Just make some bloody statements. "Beaudy is stinking the place out and shouldn't be in the 23" for example.
They are too close and too pally pally with the incumbents.
At least Marshall will fight them in the streets :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:
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@Crucial the fanbase of the North Queensland Cowboys calls bullshit
@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Crucial the fanbase of the North Queensland Cowboys calls bullshit
Fair enough although I'm not sure that family attendance due to inbreeding should be counted as an example.
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@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
The punditry is too nice and friendly these days.
We actually need the odd contrarian who nails his colours to the mast and slates the odd player.
Watching the breakdown they basically name every candidate for a shirt and say "yeah he's tracking alrite, he could be in with a shout".
Just make some bloody statements. "Beaudy is stinking the place out and shouldn't be in the 23" for example.
They are too close and too pally pally with the incumbents.
At least Marshall will fight them in the streets :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:
@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
The punditry is too nice and friendly these days.
We actually need the odd contrarian who nails his colours to the mast and slates the odd player.
Watching the breakdown they basically name every candidate for a shirt and say "yeah he's tracking alrite, he could be in with a shout".
Just make some bloody statements. "Beaudy is stinking the place out and shouldn't be in the 23" for example.
They are too close and too pally pally with the incumbents.
At least Marshall will fight them in the streets :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:
So essentially you just want the NRL360 journo versions of NZ rugby.
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@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
The punditry is too nice and friendly these days.
We actually need the odd contrarian who nails his colours to the mast and slates the odd player.
Watching the breakdown they basically name every candidate for a shirt and say "yeah he's tracking alrite, he could be in with a shout".
Just make some bloody statements. "Beaudy is stinking the place out and shouldn't be in the 23" for example.
They are too close and too pally pally with the incumbents.
At least Marshall will fight them in the streets :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:
So essentially you just want the NRL360 journo versions of NZ rugby.
@Nepia said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
The punditry is too nice and friendly these days.
We actually need the odd contrarian who nails his colours to the mast and slates the odd player.
Watching the breakdown they basically name every candidate for a shirt and say "yeah he's tracking alrite, he could be in with a shout".
Just make some bloody statements. "Beaudy is stinking the place out and shouldn't be in the 23" for example.
They are too close and too pally pally with the incumbents.
At least Marshall will fight them in the streets :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:
So essentially you just want the NRL360 journo versions of NZ rugby.
Get Chris Rattue in there instead of Muliaina :face_with_tears_of_joy:
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NRL360 doesn't talk about playing form
They try to get coaches fired, make up stories about clubs that are losing, and blame the NRL administration for everything.
They have a fair bit less to say about off-field stuff now that old mate Kenty turned out to be just as bad.
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@Nepia said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
The punditry is too nice and friendly these days.
We actually need the odd contrarian who nails his colours to the mast and slates the odd player.
Watching the breakdown they basically name every candidate for a shirt and say "yeah he's tracking alrite, he could be in with a shout".
Just make some bloody statements. "Beaudy is stinking the place out and shouldn't be in the 23" for example.
They are too close and too pally pally with the incumbents.
At least Marshall will fight them in the streets :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:
So essentially you just want the NRL360 journo versions of NZ rugby.
Get Chris Rattue in there instead of Muliaina :face_with_tears_of_joy:
@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Nepia said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
@taniwharugby said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Steve yeah the lack of bums on seats is poor optics, and will probably sway a few dollars from TV sponsors, although if NZR/Sky have good viewer stats, again, not a major right now.
@nzzp yeah I'm with you, I'm not bothered if I miss a super game anymore, although this weekends games do move up in importance.
Sky has changed the way we watch as well though, I mean it is at least a dozen years since I last got up in the middle of the night to watch a test, and worse, in recent years, I'll look at the result and then decide if I want to scan the game, watch extended highlights or skip it all together.
The punditry is too nice and friendly these days.
We actually need the odd contrarian who nails his colours to the mast and slates the odd player.
Watching the breakdown they basically name every candidate for a shirt and say "yeah he's tracking alrite, he could be in with a shout".
Just make some bloody statements. "Beaudy is stinking the place out and shouldn't be in the 23" for example.
They are too close and too pally pally with the incumbents.
At least Marshall will fight them in the streets :beaming_face_with_smiling_eyes:
So essentially you just want the NRL360 journo versions of NZ rugby.
Get Chris Rattue in there instead of Muliaina :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Would be funny to have a guy just talk about the Warriors for the entirety of a rugby show.
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@Crucial the fanbase of the North Queensland Cowboys calls bullshit
@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Crucial the fanbase of the North Queensland Cowboys calls bullshit
You talking about attendance? Is Townsville similar to Dunedin or is it more like Otago in size?
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@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Crucial the fanbase of the North Queensland Cowboys calls bullshit
You talking about attendance? Is Townsville similar to Dunedin or is it more like Otago in size?
@Bones said in The Current State of Rugby:
@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
@Crucial the fanbase of the North Queensland Cowboys calls bullshit
You talking about attendance? Is Townsville similar to Dunedin or is it more like Otago in size?
Population is about 50k more than Dunners if Wiki is to be believed.
In perspective if 1 in 20 of those extra folk attend a game thats another 2.5k bums on seats -
My point was large numbers of fans from Cairns and Mackay and Mt Isa, all basically four hours from Townsville, travel regularly for cowboys games.
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This argument of TV money vs bums on seats balancing out surely has more nuance to it.....
The Heineken cup (or whatever it is called now) up North has a sense of occasion about each game.
The stadiums have atmosphere and are generally rammed.
Seeing Danes Coles run on for his final home game to 12 people and a dog is just deflating.
The optics are terrible.
I find it jarring when I watch the highlights and the commentator be it an Aussie or Kiwi is trying to give the viewer a gee up "week 11 in super rugby and its a top of the table clash between Brumbies and Chiefs".....cuts to two teams running out to a handful of people. It's all quite odd.
It seems unsustainable to me. If the locals are that disenfranchised. Either its too expensive, on at inconvenient times, or people don't care enough any more. And that should worry the various Unions and Authorities involved.
@Steve said in The Current State of Rugby:
This argument of TV money vs bums on seats balancing out surely has more nuance to it.....
The Heineken cup (or whatever it is called now) up North has a sense of occasion about each game.
The stadiums have atmosphere and are generally rammed.
Seeing Danes Coles run on for his final home game to 12 people and a dog is just deflating.
The optics are terrible.
I find it jarring when I watch the highlights and the commentator be it an Aussie or Kiwi is trying to give the viewer a gee up "week 11 in super rugby and its a top of the table clash between Brumbies and Chiefs".....cuts to two teams running out to a handful of people. It's all quite odd.
It seems unsustainable to me. If the locals are that disenfranchised. Either its too expensive, on at inconvenient times, or people don't care enough any more. And that should worry the various Unions and Authorities involved.
Yes, great points. Population is one factor, but the main difference is that the supporters want to go to the games / the occasion. It's a completely different mindset.
For those that disagree, could you please tell me why Im watching an Auckland / Canterbury semi-final in the main domestic competition in front of a non sold out small stadium?
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My point was large numbers of fans from Cairns and Mackay and Mt Isa, all basically four hours from Townsville, travel regularly for cowboys games.
@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
My point was large numbers of fans from Cairns and Mackay and Mt Isa, all basically four hours from Townsville, travel regularly for cowboys games.
In Ozzie that's a small trip, in NZ that's a weekend away
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My point was large numbers of fans from Cairns and Mackay and Mt Isa, all basically four hours from Townsville, travel regularly for cowboys games.
@mariner4life said in The Current State of Rugby:
My point was large numbers of fans from Cairns and Mackay and Mt Isa, all basically four hours from Townsville, travel regularly for cowboys games.
That makes it much easier to understand.
