All Blacks vs Wales
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@KiwiMurph It took Foster 29 tests and injuries to all of his available centres to realize that Jordie's physical attributes might be best utilized at 12.
Meanwhile, Razor had already been advocating for J.Barrett as the All Black's 12 for the last 3 years.
We'd already have established experienced combinations instead of dealing with Foster's indecisiveness, last minute fixes determined by injuries forcing his hand.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks vs Wales:
It took Foster 29 tests and injuries to all of his available centres to realize that Jordie's physical attributes might be best utilized at 12.
Meanwhile, Razor had already been advocating for J.Barrett as the All Black's 12 for the last 3 years.He's played one game at 12 against an Australian team which was pretty much dominated by an AB team - and one coached by Foster at that.
So let's see how he goes against some decent NH sides before proclaiming him the new messiah at 12.
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@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@KiwiMurph @TheMojoman #metoo
Although I'll put forward the suggestion that ST and Taylor swap roles. Feel we'll get more from his impact against less structured defences.
I'm ready for the counter arguments. But I disagree.
I also feel my suggestion was kind of supported by performances on Saturday.
my counter to that would be that Sami is about the only forward getting over the advantage line when he carries.. you need that from the start, not just the last 20
I get that. Love him as much as everyone else on here.
But he wasn't effective starting on Saturday.
Not saying I'm unhappy with him starting, but would give serious consideration to swapping the hookers.
Really? He went forward with his balling running as he always does. Retallick's try came from Samisoni busting the defence and then putting BBBR away with the final pass.
The lineout certainly wasn't operating at 100% but to me the throws looked ok to me - looked more like issues with reception by the jumpers.
He's our best hooker by a country mile - need him playing 50-60 minutes in big tests. He's shown in multiple tests he is an effective starter. Suddenly benching him based on one outing vs Japan when he wasn't even that bad feels like over-thinking it.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@KiwiMurph @TheMojoman #metoo
Although I'll put forward the suggestion that ST and Taylor swap roles. Feel we'll get more from his impact against less structured defences.
I'm ready for the counter arguments. But I disagree.
I also feel my suggestion was kind of supported by performances on Saturday.
my counter to that would be that Sami is about the only forward getting over the advantage line when he carries.. you need that from the start, not just the last 20
I get that. Love him as much as everyone else on here.
But he wasn't effective starting on Saturday.
Not saying I'm unhappy with him starting, but would give serious consideration to swapping the hookers.
Really? He went forward with his balling running as he always does. Retallick's try came from Samisoni busting the defence and then putting BBBR away with the final pass.
The lineout certainly wasn't operating at 100% but to me the throws looked ok to me - looked more like issues with reception by the jumpers.
He's our best hooker by a country mile - need him playing 50-60 minutes in big tests. He's shown in multiple tests he is an effective starter. Suddenly benching him based on one outing vs Japan when he wasn't even that bad feels like over-thinking it.
Sami’s throws were off in Saturday. Lucky BBBR try wasn’t cancelled for crooked throw. Even TJ noticed that and a second one, later in first H, I think.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@KiwiMurph @TheMojoman #metoo
Although I'll put forward the suggestion that ST and Taylor swap roles. Feel we'll get more from his impact against less structured defences.
I'm ready for the counter arguments. But I disagree.
I also feel my suggestion was kind of supported by performances on Saturday.
my counter to that would be that Sami is about the only forward getting over the advantage line when he carries.. you need that from the start, not just the last 20
I get that. Love him as much as everyone else on here.
But he wasn't effective starting on Saturday.
Not saying I'm unhappy with him starting, but would give serious consideration to swapping the hookers.
Really? He went forward with his balling running as he always does. Retallick's try came from Samisoni busting the defence and then putting BBBR away with the final pass.
The lineout certainly wasn't operating at 100% but to me the throws looked ok to me - looked more like issues with reception by the jumpers.
He's our best hooker by a country mile - need him playing 50-60 minutes in big tests. He's shown in multiple tests he is an effective starter. Suddenly benching him based on one outing vs Japan when he wasn't even that bad feels like over-thinking it.
Sami’s throws were off in Saturday. Lucky BBBR try wasn’t cancelled for crooked throw. Even TJ noticed that and a second one, later in first H, I think.
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@KiwiMurph @TheMojoman #metoo
Although I'll put forward the suggestion that ST and Taylor swap roles. Feel we'll get more from his impact against less structured defences.
I'm ready for the counter arguments. But I disagree.
I also feel my suggestion was kind of supported by performances on Saturday.
my counter to that would be that Sami is about the only forward getting over the advantage line when he carries.. you need that from the start, not just the last 20
I get that. Love him as much as everyone else on here.
But he wasn't effective starting on Saturday.
Not saying I'm unhappy with him starting, but would give serious consideration to swapping the hookers.
Really? He went forward with his balling running as he always does. Retallick's try came from Samisoni busting the defence and then putting BBBR away with the final pass.
The lineout certainly wasn't operating at 100% but to me the throws looked ok to me - looked more like issues with reception by the jumpers.
He's our best hooker by a country mile - need him playing 50-60 minutes in big tests. He's shown in multiple tests he is an effective starter. Suddenly benching him based on one outing vs Japan when he wasn't even that bad feels like over-thinking it.
Sami’s throws were off in Saturday. Lucky BBBR try wasn’t cancelled for crooked throw. Even TJ noticed that and a second one, later in first H, I think.
Don't believe a word of what the commentators say with regard to decisions. They spent ages trying to convince everyone about a forward pass that wasn't because they only looked at the passer's body and not his arm/hand.
The refs on the board can probably confirm this but 'crooked' throws aren't necessarily a problem unless the catcher reaches to the outside of the line to catch. -
@nzzp said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Winger said in All Blacks vs Wales:
Not a big fan of Reece. Shame that Jordan isn't available
I really rate Reece. Quality winger, huge workrate, effective. Proven against top opposition.
Jordan this year has had question marks at the top level; bloody good player, but hasn't put it on the park consistently.
It was good to see Reece get a good hitout. He made some errors but since the Irish series he’s played less than 80 minutes of test footy. I really like his endeavour and the fact he backs himself. With Jordan out, unless they are going to do something funky with Ioane or Jordie, then he is the next cab off the rank.
@ACT-Crusader kind of like Mackenzie at times throwing woeful passes under pressure. Agree on his attacking brilliance though.
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@pakman said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@booboo said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@KiwiMurph @TheMojoman #metoo
Although I'll put forward the suggestion that ST and Taylor swap roles. Feel we'll get more from his impact against less structured defences.
I'm ready for the counter arguments. But I disagree.
I also feel my suggestion was kind of supported by performances on Saturday.
my counter to that would be that Sami is about the only forward getting over the advantage line when he carries.. you need that from the start, not just the last 20
I get that. Love him as much as everyone else on here.
But he wasn't effective starting on Saturday.
Not saying I'm unhappy with him starting, but would give serious consideration to swapping the hookers.
Really? He went forward with his balling running as he always does. Retallick's try came from Samisoni busting the defence and then putting BBBR away with the final pass.
The lineout certainly wasn't operating at 100% but to me the throws looked ok to me - looked more like issues with reception by the jumpers.
He's our best hooker by a country mile - need him playing 50-60 minutes in big tests. He's shown in multiple tests he is an effective starter. Suddenly benching him based on one outing vs Japan when he wasn't even that bad feels like over-thinking it.
Sami’s throws were off in Saturday. Lucky BBBR try wasn’t cancelled for crooked throw. Even TJ noticed that and a second one, later in first H, I think.
Don't believe a word of what the commentators say with regard to decisions. They spent ages trying to convince everyone about a forward pass that wasn't because they only looked at the passer's body and not his arm/hand.
The refs on the board can probably confirm this but 'crooked' throws aren't necessarily a problem unless the catcher reaches to the outside of the line to catch.@Crucial It's amazing how after all these years in the commentary box, they still don't get the rules. I know there have been a lot of law changes over the years to digest, but the "back out of the hand" guideline for determining forward passes has been there for years now.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter And why I think Frizell will be in team, he carries in close and usually will get over advantage line. Why Barrett is good at 6 I think
Saturday is counterpoint to that
He had less run metres than runs
Frizell is the modern day Reuben Thorne which isn’t all negative. You need the backrowers who do the dirty work, strong tackles, clean outs etc.
@TheMojoman said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter And why I think Frizell will be in team, he carries in close and usually will get over advantage line. Why Barrett is good at 6 I think
Saturday is counterpoint to that
He had less run metres than runs
Frizell is the modern day Reuben Thorne which isn’t all negative. You need the backrowers who do the dirty work, strong tackles, clean outs etc.
Which he didn't do against Japan, what was it four tackles, hardly any run metres, got chopped down with ease.
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@TheMojoman said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@WillieTheWaiter And why I think Frizell will be in team, he carries in close and usually will get over advantage line. Why Barrett is good at 6 I think
Saturday is counterpoint to that
He had less run metres than runs
Frizell is the modern day Reuben Thorne which isn’t all negative. You need the backrowers who do the dirty work, strong tackles, clean outs etc.
Which he didn't do against Japan, what was it four tackles, hardly any run metres, got chopped down with ease.
@Kirwan Yeah he had a poor test, wasn't the only one obviously, but his breakdown work was very poor and was very ineffective with his work in general. Our forwards struggled with the pace of the game and he was one of the main culprits.
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@Kirwan Yeah he had a poor test, wasn't the only one obviously, but his breakdown work was very poor and was very ineffective with his work in general. Our forwards struggled with the pace of the game and he was one of the main culprits.
@African-Monkey said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Kirwan Yeah he had a poor test, wasn't the only one obviously, but his breakdown work was very poor and was very ineffective with his work in general. Our forwards struggled with the pace of the game and he was one of the main culprits.
As was Sotutu before I get accused of bias. Dalton and Cane were the only loosies doing the "dirty work" IMO.
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@Winger said in All Blacks vs Wales:
Not a big fan of Reece. Shame that Jordan isn't available
Reece is a better winger than Jordan, offers a lot more physicality which Jordan lacks.
5kg heavier, much stronger & dominant tackler, with a ridiculous work-rate off the ball.
Jordan is a fullback and isn't nearly as effective on the wing.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Winger said in All Blacks vs Wales:
Not a big fan of Reece. Shame that Jordan isn't available
Reece is a better winger than Jordan, offers a lot more physicality which Jordan lacks.
5kg heavier, much stronger & dominant tackler, with a ridiculous work-rate off the ball.
Jordan is a fullback and isn't nearly as effective on the wing.
Bollocks from start to finish.
Jordan is close on 100kgs and Sevu is around 90kgs. Seriously, you only have to look at them to see that Jordan is much bigger.
A prime example of how believing bogus internet weights will lead to totally fucked-up analysis!!!!!!
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@Crucial It's amazing how after all these years in the commentary box, they still don't get the rules. I know there have been a lot of law changes over the years to digest, but the "back out of the hand" guideline for determining forward passes has been there for years now.
@Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Crucial It's amazing how after all these years in the commentary box, they still don't get the rules. I know there have been a lot of law changes over the years to digest, but the "back out of the hand" guideline for determining forward passes has been there for years now.
I give them a little bit of leeway on that one as the key aspect they missed was a timing one.
If the receiver is ahead of the ball carrier, the BC cannot reach forward and pass them the ball back out of the hand.
However, if the BC reaches forward to offload before the receiver gets in front then it is OK.
TJ and Meg were only looking at where the players were relative to each other at the point of transfer not before the action of reaching forward started. -
In regard to the team in the OP:
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Pretty sure Retallick will be out and Barrett to 4. Probably Vaa'i on the bench, but maybe Big Patty.
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Pretty likely to see Frizell at 6 and Akira on the bench.
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I reckon Jordan being out makes it less likely they'll try Jordie at 12 for this one. I won't be surprised to see Havili at 12 and Beaudy on the bench.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Winger said in All Blacks vs Wales:
Not a big fan of Reece. Shame that Jordan isn't available
Reece is a better winger than Jordan, offers a lot more physicality which Jordan lacks.
5kg heavier, much stronger & dominant tackler, with a ridiculous work-rate off the ball.
Jordan is a fullback and isn't nearly as effective on the wing.
Bollocks from start to finish.
Jordan is close on 100kgs and Sevu is around 90kgs. Seriously, you only have to look at them to see that Jordan is much bigger.
A prime example of how believing bogus internet weights will lead to totally fucked-up analysis!!!!!!
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks vs Wales:
Jordan is close on 100kgs and Sevu is around 90kgs. Seriously, you only have to look at them to see that Jordan is much bigger
Therefore... Sevu is faster? Sweet - stick him on the wing.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks vs Wales:
@Winger said in All Blacks vs Wales:
Not a big fan of Reece. Shame that Jordan isn't available
Reece is a better winger than Jordan, offers a lot more physicality which Jordan lacks.
5kg heavier, much stronger & dominant tackler, with a ridiculous work-rate off the ball.
Jordan is a fullback and isn't nearly as effective on the wing.
Bollocks from start to finish.
Jordan is close on 100kgs and Sevu is around 90kgs. Seriously, you only have to look at them to see that Jordan is much bigger.
A prime example of how believing bogus internet weights will lead to totally fucked-up analysis!!!!!!
@Chris-B I’d say Sevu is close to 100. Jordan is quite a bit taller than Sevu but if you’ve seen the footage of these two in the gym Sevu is no shrinking violet.
The thing with Sevu is the low centre of gravity plus the power that makes him challenging for defenders to get to the ground in the tackle.
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In regard to the team in the OP:
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Pretty sure Retallick will be out and Barrett to 4. Probably Vaa'i on the bench, but maybe Big Patty.
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Pretty likely to see Frizell at 6 and Akira on the bench.
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I reckon Jordan being out makes it less likely they'll try Jordie at 12 for this one. I won't be surprised to see Havili at 12 and Beaudy on the bench.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks vs Wales:
In regard to the team in the OP:
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Pretty sure Retallick will be out and Barrett to 4. Probably Vaa'i on the bench, but maybe Big Patty.
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Pretty likely to see Frizell at 6 and Akira on the bench.
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I reckon Jordan being out makes it less likely they'll try Jordie at 12 for this one. I won't be surprised to see Havili at 12 and Beaudy on the bench.
If Jordie doesn't start at 12 the meltdown on here is going to be fucking epic
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@Chris-B I’d say Sevu is close to 100. Jordan is quite a bit taller than Sevu but if you’ve seen the footage of these two in the gym Sevu is no shrinking violet.
The thing with Sevu is the low centre of gravity plus the power that makes him challenging for defenders to get to the ground in the tackle.
@ACT-Crusader Your latter part is exactly right.
But, Will is four inches taller than Sevu and a solid unit.
Piri Weepu was the same height as Sevu and has an official playing weight of 96kgs. In his latter playing days he might have got close to 100kgs.
Sevu is no Piri.
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I really like what Reece brings to the table but Jordan's ceiling is quite a bit higher. I'm expecting him to finish his career as one of our top try scorers. Jordan starting with Reece on the bench would be ideal for the RWC. Reece can wreck some havoc in the final 20 against tiring teams.
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I really like what Reece brings to the table but Jordan's ceiling is quite a bit higher. I'm expecting him to finish his career as one of our top try scorers. Jordan starting with Reece on the bench would be ideal for the RWC. Reece can wreck some havoc in the final 20 against tiring teams.
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks vs Wales:
I really like what Reece brings to the table but Jordan's ceiling is quite a bit higher. I'm expecting him to finish his career as one of our top try scorers. Jordan starting with Reece on the bench would be ideal for the RWC. Reece can wreck some havoc in the final 20 against tiring teams.
I think that post may quote one from the start of the season almost word for word.
Nothing has changed.
