Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?
-
From Counties Joshua Gray ( Winger) could end up as cover at Chiefs or at Moana. Kauvaka Kaivelata ( Loosehead Prop) Might get an upgraded contract he was a NDC player. Ian West-Stevens (Hooker) might get some interest from some teams.
@mikedogz said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
From Counties Joshua Gray ( Winger) could end up as cover at Chiefs or at Moana. Kauvaka Kaivelata ( Loosehead Prop) Might get an upgraded contract he was a NDC player. Ian West-Stevens (Hooker) might get some interest from some teams.
I think West-Stevens is a bit small and limited isn't he?
-
Tahlor Cahill is one the Crusaders will probably sign for one of those 2 locking spots open.
Blair Murray might also be on their radar.
A couple of North Harbour players Kade Banks and J Melvin have had good NPC seasons maybe on a teams radar somewhere.
Got to agree Jacomb has been impressive for Taranaki. -
@KiwiMurph said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
I'm amazed more teams don't leave open spots for NPC. They are in such a rush to lock up players - when a lot of the time those players are journeymen. Do you really need to contract Apisai for example.
In fairness, I think for the most part there has been a shift towards bringing through guys through local pathways. For example, looking at the Highlanders, they've contracted all the guys they wanted to keep last year + 5 players from others teams (including Patchell) and then the rest are academy players.
The only exception being Henry Bell, who is the perfect example... Apisai, the example you used was a panic move, because the Highlanders didn't expect Bell to do so well in the NPC, and I'm guessing Apisai had offers in the USA/Japan, which put the pressure on.
The only reason 'journeyman' are generally locked in these days, is if franchises are dumb enough to give them multi-year deals. For example, the Highlanders and Chiefs would probably quite happily have Heremaia Murray over Jonah Lowe and Ngane Punivai, but these guys are locked into contracts.
And in truth, most of the good talent is contracted long before Super Rugby as a result of the streamlining if U20, high performance programmes etc. There is always the odd player who slips through, but in recent times, they haven't tended to be world-beaters, and that will become increasingly the case.
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
The only exception being Henry Bell, who is the perfect example... Apisai, the example you used was a panic move, because the Highlanders didn't expect Bell to do so well in the NPC, and I'm guessing Apisai had offers in the USA/Japan, which put the pressure on.
I guess that's my point. If not Bell there would have been other options. Zero reason to panic and sign Apisai - he's not Super Rugby standard.
-
Here is a 23 of the best uncontracted players... I've chosen not to include guys who already seem to be in pathways, and could well have signed pre-contracts for 2025 (e.g Wrampling). This was quite difficult, particularly in certain positions so willing to tweak to get the best possible team.
- Adams
- Rhys Marshall
- Hintz
- Cridge
- Parsons
- Ryall
- Melvin
- McGahan
- Hauiti-Parapara
- Cruden
- H Murray
- Grindlay
- Tuhakaraina
- Filipo
- T Robinson
- O'Reilly
- Brighouse
- Mitchell
- Franklin
- P Tuifua
- Judd
- Jacomb
- B Murray
-
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
The only exception being Henry Bell, who is the perfect example... Apisai, the example you used was a panic move, because the Highlanders didn't expect Bell to do so well in the NPC, and I'm guessing Apisai had offers in the USA/Japan, which put the pressure on.
I guess that's my point. If not Bell there would have been other options. Zero reason to panic and sign Apisai - he's not Super Rugby standard.
@KiwiMurph said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
The only exception being Henry Bell, who is the perfect example... Apisai, the example you used was a panic move, because the Highlanders didn't expect Bell to do so well in the NPC, and I'm guessing Apisai had offers in the USA/Japan, which put the pressure on.
I guess that's my point. If not Bell there would have been other options. Zero reason to panic and sign Apisai - he's not Super Rugby standard.
Teams are probably more willing to risk it in the backs, but I guess they felt Apisai offered a level they felt was worth taking as the third choice, because if not him, it could have even been someone worse, and you are always going to need your third hooker.
-
From Counties Joshua Gray ( Winger) could end up as cover at Chiefs or at Moana. Kauvaka Kaivelata ( Loosehead Prop) Might get an upgraded contract he was a NDC player. Ian West-Stevens (Hooker) might get some interest from some teams.
@mikedogz Kaivelata and Bartlett would be the options if McMillan wants a younger LH. Proffit did a decent job so I wouldn't be surprised if he is retained. Kaivelata has also played TH, and that is the position that needs to be filled. I guess that depends on whether they are confident he can fill that role.
-
I'm amazed more teams don't leave open spots for NPC. They are in such a rush to lock up players - when a lot of the time those players are journeymen. Do you really need to contract Apisai for example.
@KiwiMurph In theory that should be what happens.
BUT (a) the players want certainty that they have a contract or they risk missing out on a MLR gig too, and (b) the teams probably feel they can't afford to wait until after the NPC as one of the other teams could swoop in and sign the player you are looking at.
-
@KiwiMurph In theory that should be what happens.
BUT (a) the players want certainty that they have a contract or they risk missing out on a MLR gig too, and (b) the teams probably feel they can't afford to wait until after the NPC as one of the other teams could swoop in and sign the player you are looking at.
@Bovidae said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@KiwiMurph In theory that should be what happens.
BUT (a) the players want certainty that they have a contract or they risk missing out on a MLR gig too, and (b) the teams probably feel they can't afford to wait until after the NPC as one of the other teams could swoop in and sign the player you are looking at.
Times have changed. Player ID is way better these days, Heremaia Murray has been around a couple of years, so if anyone would have wanted him, they'd have snapped him up by now. Has he been any better this year than he was last year, or has he just scored more tries which has people talking more?
Grindlay is the only real new name to crop up this year, who might have piqued the interest.
-
@Bovidae said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@KiwiMurph In theory that should be what happens.
BUT (a) the players want certainty that they have a contract or they risk missing out on a MLR gig too, and (b) the teams probably feel they can't afford to wait until after the NPC as one of the other teams could swoop in and sign the player you are looking at.
Times have changed. Player ID is way better these days, Heremaia Murray has been around a couple of years, so if anyone would have wanted him, they'd have snapped him up by now. Has he been any better this year than he was last year, or has he just scored more tries which has people talking more?
Grindlay is the only real new name to crop up this year, who might have piqued the interest.
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
Grindlay is the only real new name to crop up this year, who might have piqued the interest.
What do mean by "new"? Grindlay was a 1st XV/NZ Schools star and was also in the NZ U20s. He moved back to Taranaki as he wasn't wanted in Auckland. Sure you can identify the talent but that doesn't mean they are all contracted.
-
@Bovidae said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@KiwiMurph In theory that should be what happens.
BUT (a) the players want certainty that they have a contract or they risk missing out on a MLR gig too, and (b) the teams probably feel they can't afford to wait until after the NPC as one of the other teams could swoop in and sign the player you are looking at.
Times have changed. Player ID is way better these days, Heremaia Murray has been around a couple of years, so if anyone would have wanted him, they'd have snapped him up by now. Has he been any better this year than he was last year, or has he just scored more tries which has people talking more?
Grindlay is the only real new name to crop up this year, who might have piqued the interest.
@frugby obviously I am bias.
But some of the tries he scored have been excellent tries that require some ability and vision, and its his smarts that put him up a level or 2 more.
Gets himself in the right spots to be able to take advantage, he is quick, but not super quick.
After his debut season last year got called into the Highlanders earlier this year as injury cover, but didnt get used.
Be interesting to see how he goes at 7s and hopefully this is a stepping stone for him into super rugby.
-
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
Grindlay is the only real new name to crop up this year, who might have piqued the interest.
What do mean by "new"? Grindlay was a 1st XV/NZ Schools star and was also in the NZ U20s. He moved back to Taranaki as he wasn't wanted in Auckland. Sure you can identify the talent but that doesn't mean they are all contracted.
@Bovidae said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
Grindlay is the only real new name to crop up this year, who might have piqued the interest.
What do mean by "new"? Grindlay was a 1st XV/NZ Schools star and was also in the NZ U20s.
By 'new' I mean new at NPC level.
He moved back to Taranaki as he wasn't wanted in Auckland. Sure you can identify the talent but that doesn't mean they are all contracted.
No it does not, but if you look from 2017 onwards, there has been a steady decline in the amount of players shooting through from 'nowhere' into Super Rugby squads... there tends to be 1-2 a year, but the contracting has almost gone full circle back to the days when teams picked 'local players', local now being locally by NPC teams, or academies.
-
@frugby obviously I am bias.
But some of the tries he scored have been excellent tries that require some ability and vision, and its his smarts that put him up a level or 2 more.
Gets himself in the right spots to be able to take advantage, he is quick, but not super quick.
After his debut season last year got called into the Highlanders earlier this year as injury cover, but didnt get used.
Be interesting to see how he goes at 7s and hopefully this is a stepping stone for him into super rugby.
@taniwharugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@frugby obviously I am bias.
But some of the tries he scored have been excellent tries that require some ability and vision, and its his smarts that put him up a level or 2 more.
Gets himself in the right spots to be able to take advantage, he is quick, but not super quick.
After his debut season last year got called into the Highlanders earlier this year as injury cover, but didnt get used.
Be interesting to see how he goes at 7s and hopefully this is a stepping stone for him into super rugby.
I'm not hating on Murray, I'm surprised he hasn't been wanted, but he has been more or less this good for two years now and he hasn't even been offered an injury training deal this time by the looks. There will be reason for it, be that or defence or decision-making... and dear I say it, (and as a Highlanders fan I know this oh too well) there is quite a big difference between NPC and Super Rugby.
Koroi, Punivai, McKay, Lowe, Nabura & Coombes-Fabling are just a few of the great NPC players we have had, who have not made it at Super Rugby level.
-
@Bovidae said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
Grindlay is the only real new name to crop up this year, who might have piqued the interest.
What do mean by "new"? Grindlay was a 1st XV/NZ Schools star and was also in the NZ U20s.
By 'new' I mean new at NPC level.
He moved back to Taranaki as he wasn't wanted in Auckland. Sure you can identify the talent but that doesn't mean they are all contracted.
No it does not, but if you look from 2017 onwards, there has been a steady decline in the amount of players shooting through from 'nowhere' into Super Rugby squads... there tends to be 1-2 a year, but the contracting has almost gone full circle back to the days when teams picked 'local players', local now being locally by NPC teams, or academies.
@frugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
but the contracting has almost gone full circle back to the days when teams picked 'local players', local now being locally by NPC teams, or academies.
That I agree with. When I made the comment about the lack of "outside players" in some SR U18 teams, I fully expect some of those players to be in different U20 teams in 2024/25.
-
Going back to the original point of this thread, what are teams actually shopping for?
Highlanders (2+1): Hooker & Midfielder + Midfielder Cover
Crusaders (5-6+1): Locks 2x, Loose Forward & Outside Back 2-3x + Midfielder Cover
Hurricanes (2?): Halfback & Outside Back
Chiefs (3): Locks 2x & Loose Forward
Blues (?) -
@taniwharugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@frugby obviously I am bias.
But some of the tries he scored have been excellent tries that require some ability and vision, and its his smarts that put him up a level or 2 more.
Gets himself in the right spots to be able to take advantage, he is quick, but not super quick.
After his debut season last year got called into the Highlanders earlier this year as injury cover, but didnt get used.
Be interesting to see how he goes at 7s and hopefully this is a stepping stone for him into super rugby.
I'm not hating on Murray, I'm surprised he hasn't been wanted, but he has been more or less this good for two years now and he hasn't even been offered an injury training deal this time by the looks. There will be reason for it, be that or defence or decision-making... and dear I say it, (and as a Highlanders fan I know this oh too well) there is quite a big difference between NPC and Super Rugby.
Koroi, Punivai, McKay, Lowe, Nabura & Coombes-Fabling are just a few of the great NPC players we have had, who have not made it at Super Rugby level.
@frugby and I guess to an extent they may look at a player and think henhad a great season, maybe we will wait as many have that 2nd season syndrome, but if they do it comes back to spaces and timing, plus another factor might be the teams desire to stay within thier region.
-
Going back to the original point of this thread, what are teams actually shopping for?
Highlanders (2+1): Hooker & Midfielder + Midfielder Cover
Crusaders (5-6+1): Locks 2x, Loose Forward & Outside Back 2-3x + Midfielder Cover
Hurricanes (2?): Halfback & Outside Back
Chiefs (3): Locks 2x & Loose Forward
Blues (?) -
@frugby and I guess to an extent they may look at a player and think henhad a great season, maybe we will wait as many have that 2nd season syndrome, but if they do it comes back to spaces and timing, plus another factor might be the teams desire to stay within thier region.
@taniwharugby said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
@frugby and I guess to an extent they may look at a player and think henhad a great season, maybe we will wait as many have that 2nd season syndrome, but if they do it comes back to spaces and timing, plus another factor might be the teams desire to stay within thier region.
Certainly do think when teams get down to the last couple of spots, there seems to be more of a willingness to go local.
-
i would be surprised if last years new outside backs were all signed on multi year contracts
@ploughboy said in Who will earn a first Super Rugby 2024 contract ?:
i would be surprised if last years new outside backs were all signed on multi year contracts
My thought as well, though it does seem like the majority of players, particularly younger ones are offered two-year deals. Seems to be very few one and done players.
