All Blacks v Argentina II
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@Jet Oh I'm all for winning - the rugby that is, don't really care too much who wins the toughest press conference competition. As I said it's a volume of posts from multiple people all playing amateur psychologist, rather than a single one.
The 'big dick' post was a good one, and i agreed with a fair bit of it: it analysed some rugby, lack of specialists, lack of balance caused by locked-in selections etc. Although bemoaning not enough tough guys then advocating for hotham, jordan, love did make me chuckle (they're only backs I know).@reprobate said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet Oh I'm all for winning - the rugby that is, don't really care too much who wins the toughest press conference competition. As I said it's a volume of posts from multiple people all playing amateur psychologist, rather than a single one.
The 'big dick' post was a good one, and i agreed with a fair bit of it: it analysed some rugby, lack of specialists, lack of balance caused by locked-in selections etc. Although bemoaning not enough tough guys then advocating for hotham, jordan, love did make me chuckle (they're only backs I know).I watched this video after our interaction last night and funnily enough the host Kevin Ferguson started going on about how Australia and NZ are "woke" countries and have lost our mongrel. He also joked how the Wallabies have been crap since Raelene Castle banned freedom of religious expression (Folau) and their nadir since.
Their contention was parents wrap their kids in cotton wool in Australasia and how contact sport and expressing yourself through physicality is still celebrated in South Africa. The kids arent stuck inside playing Fortnite.
They mentioned they had 22,000 fans at a Paarl boys high school game during the week and contrasted it with the poor attendances in the Cake Tin and a "sold out" Suncorp where South African fans practically outnumbered the Aussies. Drew Mitchell echoed this sentiment about the large Bok fans turnout in Brisbane on the KOKO show.
Bombastic episode, but interesting to see how things are viewed from afar, albeit barstool talk.
Scott Gibbes is a regular on the show now. Never realised he moved to South Africa.
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@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
For Darry's try, which was basically McKenzie and Barrett breaking away, it's Blackadder right on Darry's shoulder as he scores. Massive props to Darry for being up there too by the way.
So what you're saying is that this tearaway loose forward with a big motor was beaten to the punch by a to date run of the mill lock known for doing the tight stuff and not exactly having pace?
@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
For Darry's try, which was basically McKenzie and Barrett breaking away, it's Blackadder right on Darry's shoulder as he scores. Massive props to Darry for being up there too by the way.
So what you're saying is that this tearaway loose forward with a big motor was beaten to the punch by a to date run of the mill lock known for doing the tight stuff and not exactly having pace?
Thats exactly what im saying. And guess where our open side flanker was.
Standing on our own 22 with his hands on his hips.
Blackadder started from a deeper position than Papalii and Dalton didnt try a leg to get there.
Dalton top left, Darry with white head tape to the right. Blackadder just inside 22.
Watch the footage. Dalton just stops and puts hands on hips. Darry and Blackadder chase McKenzie's chip and chase, overtaking Perenara en route half way up the field. Darry looks fair quick for a lock in the footage. Well done to him.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
For Darry's try, which was basically McKenzie and Barrett breaking away, it's Blackadder right on Darry's shoulder as he scores. Massive props to Darry for being up there too by the way.
So what you're saying is that this tearaway loose forward with a big motor was beaten to the punch by a to date run of the mill lock known for doing the tight stuff and not exactly having pace?
Thats exactly what im saying. And guess where our open side flanker was.
Standing on our own 22 with his hands on his hips.
Blackadder started from a deeper position than Papalii and Dalton didnt try a leg to get there.
Dalton top left, Darry with white head tape to the right. Blackadder just inside 22.
Watch the footage. Dalton just stops and puts hands on hips. Darry and Blackadder chase McKenzie's chip and chase, overtaking Perenara en route half way up the field. Darry looks fair quick for a lock in the footage. Well done to him.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
For Darry's try, which was basically McKenzie and Barrett breaking away, it's Blackadder right on Darry's shoulder as he scores. Massive props to Darry for being up there too by the way.
So what you're saying is that this tearaway loose forward with a big motor was beaten to the punch by a to date run of the mill lock known for doing the tight stuff and not exactly having pace?
Thats exactly what im saying. And guess where our open side flanker was.
Standing on our own 22 with his hands on his hips.
Blackadder started from a deeper position than Papalii and Dalton didnt try a leg to get there.
Dalton top left, Darry with white head tape to the right. Blackadder just inside 22.
Watch the footage. Dalton just stops and puts hands on hips. Darry and Blackadder chase McKenzie's chip and chase, overtaking Perenara en route half way up the field. Darry looks fair quick for a lock in the footage. Well done to him.
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
For Darry's try, which was basically McKenzie and Barrett breaking away, it's Blackadder right on Darry's shoulder as he scores. Massive props to Darry for being up there too by the way.
So what you're saying is that this tearaway loose forward with a big motor was beaten to the punch by a to date run of the mill lock known for doing the tight stuff and not exactly having pace?
Thats exactly what im saying. And guess where our open side flanker was.
Standing on our own 22 with his hands on his hips.
Blackadder started from a deeper position than Papalii and Dalton didnt try a leg to get there.
Dalton top left, Darry with white head tape to the right. Blackadder just inside 22.
Watch the footage. Dalton just stops and puts hands on hips. Darry and Blackadder chase McKenzie's chip and chase, overtaking Perenara en route half way up the field. Darry looks fair quick for a lock in the footage. Well done to him.
Dalton top left with hands on hips while the rest of the Allblacks try and score a try. He is still ahead of Darry and Blackadder at this point.
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@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
For Darry's try, which was basically McKenzie and Barrett breaking away, it's Blackadder right on Darry's shoulder as he scores. Massive props to Darry for being up there too by the way.
So what you're saying is that this tearaway loose forward with a big motor was beaten to the punch by a to date run of the mill lock known for doing the tight stuff and not exactly having pace?
Thats exactly what im saying. And guess where our open side flanker was.
Standing on our own 22 with his hands on his hips.
Blackadder started from a deeper position than Papalii and Dalton didnt try a leg to get there.
Dalton top left, Darry with white head tape to the right. Blackadder just inside 22.
Watch the footage. Dalton just stops and puts hands on hips. Darry and Blackadder chase McKenzie's chip and chase, overtaking Perenara en route half way up the field. Darry looks fair quick for a lock in the footage. Well done to him.
Dalton top left with hands on hips while the rest of the Allblacks try and score a try. He is still ahead of Darry and Blackadder at this point.
Can I ask what you'd like Paps to do here?
Run in field as fast as possible?
I'm a bit lost - it's been a while since I played, but even then we had attack patterns and if you were last man out you didn't bolt infield just because you were a loosie.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet what was the play before?
I cant see from the footage. Im just looking at the highlight video in YouTube.
But keep in mind this is minute 14 not minute 79.
You have McCaws number on your back.
Move your fucking ass.
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Can I ask what you'd like Paps to do here?
Run in field as fast as possible?
I'm a bit lost - it's been a while since I played, but even then we had attack patterns and if you were last man out you didn't bolt infield just because you were a loosie.
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Can I ask what you'd like Paps to do here?
Run in field as fast as possible?
I'm a bit lost - it's been a while since I played, but even then we had attack patterns and if you were last man out you didn't bolt infield just because you were a loosie.
upfield. not infield.
Following the play to the next breakdown.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Can I ask what you'd like Paps to do here?
Run in field as fast as possible?
I'm a bit lost - it's been a while since I played, but even then we had attack patterns and if you were last man out you didn't bolt infield just because you were a loosie.
upfield. not infield.
Following the play to the next breakdown.
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Can I ask what you'd like Paps to do here?
Run in field as fast as possible?
I'm a bit lost - it's been a while since I played, but even then we had attack patterns and if you were last man out you didn't bolt infield just because you were a loosie.
upfield. not infield.
Following the play to the next breakdown.
It's not Remember the Titans mate, he can't clear a path for Dmac.
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It was a knock on and the players near the knock are expecting a scrum. Then the chip kick worked
The main thing watching the replay is how slow Blackadder is in comparison to Taylor. Codie flys past him
@Duluth said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
It was a knock on and the players near the knock are expecting a scrum. Then the chip kick worked
The main thing watching the replay is how slow Blackadder is in comparison to Taylor. Codie flys past him
I'm going to have to watch this fucking game, aren't I?
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It was a knock on and the players near the knock are expecting a scrum. Then the chip kick worked
The main thing watching the replay is how slow Blackadder is in comparison to Taylor. Codie flys past him
@Duluth said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
It was a knock on and the players near the knock are expecting a scrum. Then the chip kick worked
The main thing watching the replay is how slow Blackadder is in comparison to Taylor. Codie flys past him
This is true.
The point I was making was that Bones questioned whether Blackadder gets around the park , and in his defence I noted that he does his best as his physical limitations allow. He was first man on the scene as Darry dots down and would have been available for an offload should Darry have been a yard short.
And I was noting that while slow, and while not Kaino-esque or McCaw-esque he tries his heart out.
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@Duluth said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
It was a knock on and the players near the knock are expecting a scrum. Then the chip kick worked
The main thing watching the replay is how slow Blackadder is in comparison to Taylor. Codie flys past him
This is true.
The point I was making was that Bones questioned whether Blackadder gets around the park , and in his defence I noted that he does his best as his physical limitations allow. He was first man on the scene as Darry dots down and would have been available for an offload should Darry have been a yard short.
And I was noting that while slow, and while not Kaino-esque or McCaw-esque he tries his heart out.
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@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Interesting title to this weeks podcast after what has been said on here since the match.
It was a good show. We are losing the collisions (surprise surprise), and everything goes downhill from there. Sounds like SA have made a leap, the games over there could get very ugly if we don't lock in fast
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
I'll reserve judgement until the EOYT, maybe earlier if the downward slide continues, but he needs to sort the forwards mess pronto.
he won 3 games in a row as AB coach and lost a fourth is a downward slide?
Well it certainly isn't upwards, is it?
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
I'll reserve judgement until the EOYT, maybe earlier if the downward slide continues, but he needs to sort the forwards mess pronto.
he won 3 games in a row as AB coach and lost a fourth is a downward slide?
Well it certainly isn't upwards, is it?
key word: slide
"to move along in continuous contact with a smooth or slippery surface"
3 wins, 1 loss, = a dip or fall, not yet a slide.
Another loss, as in, continues to fall,then you can call it a slide. -
@Jet just checked back, I said he doesn't appear to get around more than Cane. Definitely didn't question whether he got around the park.
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Isn't the line of thought "he's not the fastest, not the most effective, but he tries his best" the epitome of the woke criticism the saffas were accusing us of above?
What I do know is that if Dalton was on the blindside of the scrum in front of our line, he wouldn't have been brushed off like he was Terry Wright like the son of Todd was.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Kirwan I'm even more puzzled now why Cane wouldn't be used to do the same job Blackadder did on Saturday. It doesn't appear to the eye that Blackadder gets around the park more than Cane and at least Cane hits hard. Better in the lineout?
Blackadder gets around the park to be fair. He is into everything as much as his physical talents permit. He's not hiding or sea gulling on the wing. He doesnt hit like a Kaino or poach like a McCaw which is a problem. But I have no issue with Cane coming back. We need mongrel.
I still think Blackadder should be cut some slack as he is never fit long enough to actually see what he is like when in form. I still think we havnt seen his ceiling.
For Darry's try, which was basically McKenzie and Barrett breaking away, it's Blackadder right on Darry's shoulder as he scores. Massive props to Darry for being up there too by the way.
Im more worried that we have seen Papalii's ceiling and whether it will ever be enough.
Thats not to advocate for anyone over Papalii, just to say that maybe we dont have a vintage batch of loose forwards knocking around.
Which is scary when you think that South Africa dont even have Evan Roos or Cameron Hanekom in their squad. It's a production line of monsters. We need to find a few big lumps in high school and soon.
Id encourage anyone to watch Cameron Hanekoms performance in the URC semi against Leinster.
Keep in mind he was up agains Caelan Doris and Josh Van Der Flier that day. He is only 22.@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
just to say that maybe we dont have a vintage batch of loose forwards knocking around.
I think this is the key. We have a bunch of loose forwards similar to what Razor was a player actually - solid depth/placeholder loosies - but in no danger of pushing for a world XV.
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@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
just to say that maybe we dont have a vintage batch of loose forwards knocking around.
I think this is the key. We have a bunch of loose forwards similar to what Razor was a player actually - solid depth/placeholder loosies - but in no danger of pushing for a world XV.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
just to say that maybe we dont have a vintage batch of loose forwards knocking around.
I think this is the key. We have a bunch of loose forwards similar to what Razor was a player actually - solid depth/placeholder loosies - but in no danger of pushing for a world XV.
That's interesting, it could well be that we just don't have the best players.
While that may be the foremost reason, my current opinion is that we don't have the players we can select playing as a team as well as they can be.
