All Blacks v Argentina II
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@darylmitchell said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
I actually don’t think it’s our carriers so much. I think it’s more our attack that's the problem - we’re not putting any deception into how we attack
The carriers are getting stopped on teh gain line all night. And we don't have many effective ball runners. FFS they asked Ardie to do that 19 times - that's ridiculous.
Deception helps, but at some point you need power carries with clarity. So much flat footed ball that we thought would disappear ... but it seems to be a tactic.
@nzzp said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@darylmitchell said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
I actually don’t think it’s our carriers so much. I think it’s more our attack that's the problem - we’re not putting any deception into how we attack
The carriers are getting stopped on teh gain line all night. And we don't have many effective ball runners. FFS they asked Ardie to do that 19 times - that's ridiculous.
Deception helps, but at some point you need power carries with clarity. So much flat footed ball that we thought would disappear ... but it seems to be a tactic.
It helps if you try and run into space.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Also, I think goalkicking per se has not been a weakness. With exits it is as much accuracy as distance that is the issue IMO.
Well, it took ABs about four kick offs for ABs to realise Argies were kicking right and deep to negate TJS returning off his left boot. Noticed later they passed to DMac.
@pakman said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Also, I think goalkicking per se has not been a weakness. With exits it is as much accuracy as distance that is the issue IMO.
Well, it took ABs about four kick offs for ABs to realise Argies were kicking right and deep to negate TJS returning off his left boot. Noticed later they passed to DMac.
ok so using their brains would be an improvement as well...
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@Duluth said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
It was a knock on and the players near the knock are expecting a scrum. Then the chip kick worked
The main thing watching the replay is how slow Blackadder is in comparison to Taylor. Codie flys past him
This is true.
The point I was making was that Bones questioned whether Blackadder gets around the park , and in his defence I noted that he does his best as his physical limitations allow. He was first man on the scene as Darry dots down and would have been available for an offload should Darry have been a yard short.
And I was noting that while slow, and while not Kaino-esque or McCaw-esque he tries his heart out.
I would try my heart out to if I was an All Black.
Unfortunately, trying your heart out should be the bare minimum and not a quality that gets you selected in the starting 15.
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@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Not sure but Blackadder missed that tackle off the scrum near our line after the dodgy passing from our guys - which eventually led to a try.
Contrast to Papali'i who nailed two guys in a row off an earlier scrum.
Blackadder looks like a guy confused and off the pace at times in between doing some good things. He basically looks like a guy who's played bugger all rugby in recent years which of course - he is.
The guy making 20 tackles is the one off the pace?
@reprobate said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Not sure but Blackadder missed that tackle off the scrum near our line after the dodgy passing from our guys - which eventually led to a try.
Contrast to Papali'i who nailed two guys in a row off an earlier scrum.
Blackadder looks like a guy confused and off the pace at times in between doing some good things. He basically looks like a guy who's played bugger all rugby in recent years which of course - he is.
The guy making 20 tackles is the one off the pace?
My feeling is that they play the same game - it’s the same old story of unbalance. Both of them are ‘Cane’ like workers. We don’t need two of them.
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@reprobate said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Not sure but Blackadder missed that tackle off the scrum near our line after the dodgy passing from our guys - which eventually led to a try.
Contrast to Papali'i who nailed two guys in a row off an earlier scrum.
Blackadder looks like a guy confused and off the pace at times in between doing some good things. He basically looks like a guy who's played bugger all rugby in recent years which of course - he is.
The guy making 20 tackles is the one off the pace?
My feeling is that they play the same game - it’s the same old story of unbalance. Both of them are ‘Cane’ like workers. We don’t need two of them.
@gt12 I agree, but think that Cane, DP and LJ are the most similar. EB is a bit different.
I can't understand the thinking behind the overall selection, because alongside that we have Sititi who is nothing like Savea, and Finau is different to all the others. Where's the plan? -
@gt12 I agree, but think that Cane, DP and LJ are the most similar. EB is a bit different.
I can't understand the thinking behind the overall selection, because alongside that we have Sititi who is nothing like Savea, and Finau is different to all the others. Where's the plan? -
@gt12 I agree, but think that Cane, DP and LJ are the most similar. EB is a bit different.
I can't understand the thinking behind the overall selection, because alongside that we have Sititi who is nothing like Savea, and Finau is different to all the others. Where's the plan?What is it you think is different about Blackadder?
He and Jacobson are both utilities that are too small to be world class 6/8
Cane and Papali'i are both specialist 7s.
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What is it you think is different about Blackadder?
He and Jacobson are both utilities that are too small to be world class 6/8
Cane and Papali'i are both specialist 7s.
@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
What is it you think is different about Blackadder?
He and Jacobson are both utilities that are too small to be world class 6/8
Cane and Papali'i are both specialist 7s.
Blackadder looks lankier, maybe slightly longer forearms.
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On the loose forwards, Papali'i and Blackadder hit the same number of breakdowns throughout the match with the starting locks, Codie Taylor and Tyrel Lomax the next best.
Blackadder (20), Vaa'i (15) and De Groot (10) were the busiest tacklers, with Vaa'i and De Groot each making two dominant hits.
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@reprobate you have to question whether it's a microcosm of the wider issues - a lack of clarify and clear plan with too many cooks in the kitchen (5 different selectors).
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@reprobate you have to question whether it's a microcosm of the wider issues - a lack of clarify and clear plan with too many cooks in the kitchen (5 different selectors).
And this is on Razor.
In his determination to do things differently, he's appears to have made a number of miscalculations thus far- ignoring Akira and Sotutu in favor a bunch of 6.5s
- 5 coaches
- weird ass Super rugby style game plan
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@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
What is it you think is different about Blackadder?
He and Jacobson are both utilities that are too small to be world class 6/8
Cane and Papali'i are both specialist 7s.
Blackadder looks lankier, maybe slightly longer forearms.
@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
What is it you think is different about Blackadder?
He and Jacobson are both utilities that are too small to be world class 6/8
Cane and Papali'i are both specialist 7s.
Blackadder looks lankier, maybe slightly longer forearms.
All elbows and knees like his Dad Todd.
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@gt12 I agree, but think that Cane, DP and LJ are the most similar. EB is a bit different.
I can't understand the thinking behind the overall selection, because alongside that we have Sititi who is nothing like Savea, and Finau is different to all the others. Where's the plan?@reprobate said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@gt12 I agree, but think that Cane, DP and LJ are the most similar. EB is a bit different.
I can't understand the thinking behind the overall selection, because alongside that we have Sititi who is nothing like Savea, and Finau is different to all the others. Where's the plan?Both power runners with some question marks over other aspects of their game. Both shine more provided their loosie mates do the donkey work. I think they’re more similar than you think.
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@dogmeat said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@darylmitchell said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
I get the point, it doesn't seem a relevant criticism for Razor, he is after all the most successful coach in the history of NZ domestic rugby.
Maurice Trapp's Auckland won 95% of the games he coached them in. Fred Allen's record given the competitiveness of other sides is at least as good and Razor's already lost more tests than the Needle did as a coach.
Comparisons with 60 years ago are of course pointless but Razor and his supporters are learning very quickly that domestic success is only one indicator of future test coaching ability.
How he responds to this setback will quickly determine if he is First Class or Economy
Maurice Trapp won 91% of his games with Auckland, John Hart won 87% and Graham Henry 80% - according to this:
https://www.rugbydatabase.co.nz/team/coachList.php?teamId=9
Razor is NZ's most successful domestic coach of the professional era, as he's won 3 titles at NPC level and 7 titles at Super Rugby level, the amateur game obviously shouldn't count for much in this discussion, if it did that would open up another can of worms wouldn't it?
@darylmitchell said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Maurice Trapp won 91% of his games with Auckland,
He had a brilliant record in his first Ak stint 86/90 = 95.5%.
But he come back for one season after Ak had declined and he had a rubbish record.
In those five years Auckland played 90 games for 86 wins, one draw and three losses - two of the losses when Auckland's large All Black contingent was not available.
During that time Trapp's side won all their 38 Ranfurly Shield defences, as part of Auckland's fabulous 61 successful defences between 1985 and 1993.
Trapp returned briefly as Auckland selector-coach when Graham Henry left in mid-season for Wales in 1998, and is a member of the ARU board.
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Tony brown turned down Razor in 2019 to be part of his AB coaching bid to stay with JJ and Japan.
I’m not entirely sure where he has earned his reputation from his work with Japan and Highlanders (although that just may be ignorance on my part)
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Tony brown turned down Razor in 2019 to be part of his AB coaching bid to stay with JJ and Japan.
He didn't turn him down so much as said he would stay with just the JJ team. I didn't get the impression he was anti Robertson just loyal to JJ
But that was then. He was obviously open to offers when Robertson was appointed.
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@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Tony brown turned down Razor in 2019 to be part of his AB coaching bid to stay with JJ and Japan.
He didn't turn him down so much as said he would stay with just the JJ team. I didn't get the impression he was anti Robertson just loyal to JJ
But that was then. He was obviously open to offers when Robertson was appointed.
@Winger said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Tony brown turned down Razor in 2019 to be part of his AB coaching bid to stay with JJ and Japan.
He didn't turn him down so much as said he would stay with just the JJ team. I didn't get the impression he was anti Robertson just loyal to JJ
But that was then. He was obviously open to offers when Robertson was appointed.
Yeah, it's rather frustrating they couldn't at least try to make room for Tony Brown (who was off contract in 2024 after finishing up with Japan) considering how they could found room for 8 other assistants of various convoluted descriptions Lol...
It seems to me that if Razor wanted it to happen enough he and Mark Robinson could've made a genuine attempt to get him but Brown simply wasn't part of the 'crew' being ex-Crusaders players or coaches, including the lineout and contact skills coaches Ellison and Flynn.
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The All Blacks' marketing crew is using the 2015 team to try and flog tickets to see 2024 side against Argentina.
Talk about desperate.
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I was really hoping for some innovation with the new coaching staff.
But we are now on game 4 and I have seen nothing yet. Super disappointed, might as well have just kept the fat man.
Just hope this game we see some kind of plan and direction.
Some little pop passes at the line, some backline moves, aggressive cleanouts, just show us something. -
I was really hoping for some innovation with the new coaching staff.
But we are now on game 4 and I have seen nothing yet. Super disappointed, might as well have just kept the fat man.
Just hope this game we see some kind of plan and direction.
Some little pop passes at the line, some backline moves, aggressive cleanouts, just show us something.
