NPC 2025
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How good is afternoon rugby though, have to think players enjoy it more too.
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SR is the NPC of the modern professional era. This isn't the Ranfurly Shield we're talking about, the NPC has a generation or two of support and with the advent of SR at least another generation is otherwise engaged, as I suspect are the average viewers as that's where the talent lies.
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I personally still love the NPC and following the Taniwha plus a couple other teams that I have ties to.
Its still the best comp in terms of seeing what new talent is coming through
Nobody turns up to first class cricket but it’s still the main pathway in terms of identifying new talent
I know after Northlands back to back wins the social engagement on the Taniwha FB site has been massive.
Fair to say we have been starved of success hence people have come out of the woodwork over last couple of weeks
My interest in Super Rugby is a 6/10 but I’m more likely to follow the teams that have Taniwha players running around in their squads.
I do have a massive soft spot for Moana Pacifika and I will say the game against the Blues this year at North Harbour stadium was the best live super rugby game experience I have had in a very long time
One thing I will say I have never abandoned the Taniwha through the bad (and it’s fair to say there’s been some very bad over the years ) because every now again they surprise me . -
Well I never comment on tests during halftime, or super, guess that means I not interested in any rugby. Funny enough, I can enjoy game without telling everyone online what I think while it on.
I’m talking about populations and you keep responding with single data points
I’ll repeat with more detail something I said earlier
Every year for the last decade TSF traffic has increased (probably not this year after the url issue)
Average posts on AB threads have followed that pattern. There is an extra boost in RWC years.
Average posts in SR games involving at least one NZ side has also increased in a similar pattern. (there is a weird extra boost during covid for SR)
Like for like all those things are going up
NPC is going in the opposite direction. Declining chat despite traffic to the site being up. I’m not talking in anecdotes, I’m talking about what is happening across this communities population. This subset is more likely to watch NPC than the general population.
To put it bluntly people who prefer the NPC skew much older. As they move on they are not replaced.
Recognising a problem is not death riding something. I actually think the people who are over the top positive about the competition are a net negative. Pretending the competition isn’t in a steep decline doesn’t help fix anything.
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@Duluth Fair enough mate, I really like the NPC and consider it really important to our rugby and pathways, you don't etc.
You right in that no matter what you say against it I kind of block out, and no doubt vice versa.
The one thing we know we all kind of block anything that doesn't go along with our beliefs etc. Doesn't make you or I wrong, just how it is. For me I hope NPC lasts long enough to see me out. After that I don't care. -
@Duluth Fair enough mate, I really like the NPC and consider it really important to our rugby and pathways, you don't etc.
You right in that no matter what you say against it I kind of block out, and no doubt vice versa.
The one thing we know we all kind of block anything that doesn't go along with our beliefs etc. Doesn't make you or I wrong, just how it is. For me I hope NPC lasts long enough to see me out. After that I don't care.Nah. Duluth has said that he enjoys the NPC. Nowhere has he stated that he doesn't consider it a part of our pathways system. So, you are blocking other views out to the point of misinterpretation and understanding.
You have said that people want to get rid of the NPC. I haven't seen that. What people have said is that there are questions around its viability in its current state. That the engagement numbers are down, 5hrough broadcast and Duluth citing his engagement numbers on the forum.
I like the NPC for three reasons. To follow Otago, follow the Highlanders players in other teams and to track the up and coming lads like Muliaina, Pledger and Casey.
The NPC is here to stay. The PUs tail that wags the NZR dog will ensure that. As a small nation with diverse interests we just can't afford to sustain 19 professional football teams. The operational costs must be out the gate. Flying 30 staff from Invercargill to Rotorua for example must cost over 15k.
The rugby calendar makes it difficult to move the chess pieces around a bit. Ideally the Super season would be closer to two full rounds. It can't be played without All Blacks. The NPC needs to be after the club season finishes. This means we are a bit stuck. The competition needs to be delivered in a cheaper way.
Again. No one wants rid of it. But an opportunity was lost to take a step back and consolidate how rugby is delivered in NZ.
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@SouthernMann I have said I want a consolidated competition of about 10 teams. Whether that is a pro NPC with a few less teams or an expanded SR I don't care. The end result would be very similar. The current setup is not working
Interesting fact - a popular NPC captain anonymously posted on this forum about his team shouldn't exist. No one would accuse that person of hating the NPC... his suggestion was similar to mine
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@SouthernMann I have said I want a consolidated competition of about 10 teams. Whether that is a pro NPC with a few less teams or an expanded SR I don't care. The end result would be very similar. The current setup is not working
Interesting fact - a popular NPC captain anonymously posted on this forum about his team shouldn't exist. No one would accuse that person of hating the NPC... his suggestion was similar to mine
My apologies. I lost track of what everyone was saying.
A provincial competition in some form is useful. Not the way it is.
We have gone $1 e/w on our comps.
I'd consolidate down. May be add another NZ team. Make it two rounds. Then pull back NPC to a more cost effective model. We would still get the up abd coming guys
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@SouthernMann said in NPC 2025:
We have gone $1 e/w on our comps.
Exactly. We're just blundering along.
If the mooted salary cap changes go ahead the NPC will be essentially dead. Meaningful rugby will be restricted to five locations
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@Duluth Once again I apologise , I was under impression that you thought the NPC should be canned. I actually would love the idea of super being canned and a 10 team NPC etc, just know it's not going to happen because of money. Just all the talk of less interest etc , that is across all levels of rugby (and sport probably). I don't follow Super as mush as used too either, but just think we need these steps up for rugby, and can't see with test schedules we will ever be able to have one comp going from March to September etc.
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@Duluth Once again I apologise , I was under impression that you thought the NPC should be canned. I actually would love the idea of super being canned and a 10 team NPC etc, just know it's not going to happen because of money. Just all the talk of less interest etc , that is across all levels of rugby (and sport probably). I don't follow Super as mush as used too either, but just think we need these steps up for rugby, and can't see with test schedules we will ever be able to have one comp going from March to September etc.
The flow on of tails wagging dogs mean clubs would not want provincial rugby being played when the club season is on.
Super Rugby is here to stay. The buck each was philosophy needs to be canned. A proper decent comp. Which aligns international windows as well.
The other issue with a hypothetical 10 team comp. Is you end up having the same shitty conversations with the likes of Northland, Counties, North Harbour, Manawatu and Southland. Sorry guys. You don't make the cut. Then who pays for four more fully professional NZ teams?
As Duluth mentioned a change to the salary cap will be massive. It will become a comp for guys under 22s, Super players and other lads who bugger off for MLR (which is on the fritz).
I fully understand you are steadfast in your support of the near 50-year-old competition. It just isn't fit for purpose.
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I was speaking to a rugby producer at Sky last week and I asked a few questions about he NPC coverage have games at the same time etc. He said it doesn't matter because the audience is essentially zero. ABs, massive gap, SR, then another massive gap, NPC according to him
This confirms what i've thought for a long time.
Both comps cost NZR a lot of money.
Which ever way you set it up domestic pro rugby; that cost isn't going to change.
Neither SR or NPC could exist as a stand alone fully pro entity.And if SR was to be the only pro comp, it should be set up separated from NZR.
Like the French RU does with the NLR (T14/PD2).
There is no way I want to see NZR subsidising a separate pro rugby comp; I think most of the money would just end up in the pockets of individual players.
I'd prefer the current system we have to that.
NZR does seem to spread "the love" quite well (whether they like it or not).
NOTE!
In France the money flows the other way.
The NLR actually subsidises the FFR by making payments to the national team players.
The French clubs own the contracts of the star players.
In NZ the contracts of the star players are owned by NZR.
And If some pro domestic comp in NZ wants the star players; they should have to pay NZR for them.
I cant see NZR ever ending its contracting of the best players.Any rugby player in NZ who thinks they can earn top dollar without an a AB contract is absolutely in dreamland.
Average wage is about as much as you can expect. Which I assume is what the average is now. -
@SouthernMann said in NPC 2025:
As Duluth mentioned a change to the salary cap will be massive. It will become a comp for guys under 22s, Super players and other lads who bugger off for MLR (which is on the fritz).
The cut is worse than it sounds too because of the inflation in recent years. To maintain player payments in real terms, the cap should be going up by a lot.
Players won't swallow that. They'll look at other opportunities and some on the margins will exit the game altogether
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@SouthernMann , it's your opinion it's not fit for purpose. To keep saying the tail wagging the dog etc makes no sense. Like it or not every level of rugby has to be played at different times, or are you suggesting club rugby scrapped or something. I honestly saying that while not exactly right, we have the best system we can have in a place the size of NZ. Club rugby to feed NPC to feed the next years super, to feed the test teams. Also limited by mid year tests etc, so makes good sense for a time to break up comps.
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Yeah; all pro sports comps have star players.
Except in NZ.
The NZ public is not that stupid; they know the best players are not playing.NZR had good chance last week to run the entire AB squad in the NPC; imagine the hype you could have created!
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Players won't swallow that. They'll look at other opportunities and some on the margins will exit the game altogether
That is already what happens, and cant see that changing what ever you do..
NZ economy is not large enough to have more than one team (ABs) that will get a player top dollar by world standards.
