All Blacks v Argentina II

Canes4life

Taking a stab at the 23 for this week, I think we'll role with the following:

Williams
Taylor
Newell
Barrett (C)
Holland
Va'ai
Savea
Sititi
Ratima
Barrett
Ioane
Barrett
Proctor
Reece
Jordan
Taukei'aho
De Groot
Tosi
Parker
Lakai
Christie
McKenzie
Tupaea

nostrildamus

@MajorRage said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

He gets over the gain line, and then some. It’s a crucial component of his job. Means he attracts more defenders too which creates space.
He is, without doubt, an incredible talent and player.
It doesn’t mean he’s beyond criticism for his weaknesses tho. As others point out, it means the back row needs balance to compensate.
Which is why he should never play with Kirifi.

The observations sound reasonable but the movement from claims to conclusion is more open IMHO (and extrapolating from others):

Savea doesn't do all the tight 7 required
We need a big bopper
Kirifi isn't big enough enough when playing with Savea...
Therefore Savea unbalances the loose trio and so don't have Savea at 8 and Kirifi at 7 as we need a big, tight-playing 6.

Don't have a problem with part of the conclusion but maybe a big reason is not foremost because Savea is a particular type of player but because we don't have a big bruising hard type of 6 anyway. Blackadder is more of a bunny than a bruiser, Finau's light flickers, Parker hasn't been tried, most of the other 6's tend to be lighter, smaller, and/or more mobile in NZ super teams. Even if we had a bigger 7 like Dalton, we probably still haven't found the right 6. Oh there is/was one but Robertson et al didn't seem to want him! So maybe the 6 problem is still a problem regardless of who the 7 should be.

mariner4life

what 6 problem? The 6 we have now is the best we have had in years!

nostrildamus

@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

what 6 problem? The 6 we have now is the best we have had in years!

Well, actually we have a new 6 problem. The current 6, and I grant you looks a good 6, is also one of our top locks.

sparky

@Canes4life I think that's about what will be selected.

Preston will probably start ahead of Christie.

Robertson has said that both Williams and Sititi are "managed minutes" and neither will play the full game. Hard to know if that it 50 minutes from the start or thirty minutes from the bench.

Dan54

@Canes4life I would be keen on more or less same team too, though admit to be almost keener on having a peek of Parker at 8. Sititi fan etc, but even more size would genuinely excite me.

ShaquilleOatmeal

They could give Parker and Sititi half a game each at eight. Although, they'll probably have Kirifi or Lakai on the bench too and they'll want to move Savea to eight to give that player time - they'll almost certainly play Savea for the whole game.

Frank

@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

but even more size would genuinely excite me.

A phrase often heard

taniwharugby

@sparky guess it depends what sheet you sing from, but years gone by the theory was if they were not 100%, you start them, that way you can manage thier minutes, whereas off the bench, an injury hits, they could still hit the field in the 3rd minute...

Bones

@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

@sparky guess it depends what sheet you sing from, but years gone by the theory was if they were not 100%, you start them, that way you can manage thier minutes, whereas off the bench, an injury hits, they could still hit the field in the 3rd minute...

Probably not so bad in the FR though.

Dan54

@Frank said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

but even more size would genuinely excite me.

A phrase often heard

Hope it wasn't my wife you heard uttering that Frank!:confounded_face:

pakman

I’m craving sauce!!

cgrant

@Canes4life said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

Taking a stab at the 23 for this week, I think we'll role with the following:

Williams

Taylor

Newell

Barrett (C)

Holland

Va'ai

Savea

Sititi

Ratima

Barrett

Ioane

Barrett

Proctor

Reece

Jordan

Taukei'aho

De Groot

Tosi

Parker

Lakai

Christie

McKenzie

Tupaea

I think they will probably start De Groot with Williams on the bench. The latter has not played for a long time now.

akan004

booboo

@cgrant said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

@Canes4life said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

Taking a stab at the 23 for this week, I think we'll role with the following:

Williams

Taylor

Newell

Barrett (C)

Holland

Va'ai

Savea

Sititi

Ratima

Barrett

Ioane

Barrett

Proctor

Reece

Jordan

Taukei'aho

De Groot

Tosi

Parker

Lakai

Christie

McKenzie

Tupaea

I think they will probably start De Groot with Williams on the bench. The latter has not played for a long time now.

That's why I would start him.

ACT Crusader

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

what 6 problem? The 6 we have now is the best we have had in years!

Well, actually we have a new 6 problem. The current 6, and I grant you looks a good 6, is also one of our top locks.

But looks far more comfortable in this role because of where his natural strengths are. Plus we have 3 good locks in the squad as well.

ACT Crusader

Things seem pretty tight lipped but a whisper of two changes

Landers92

Here’s the backline as it stands at the moment. Could be a late change, couldn’t get names around that. Same as last week apart from the forced ALB change.

Ratima
B.Barrett
Ioane
J.Barrett
Proctor
Reece
Jordan

Bench
21. Christie
22. Dmac
23. Tupaea

canefan

@Landers92 said in All Blacks v Argentina II:

Here’s the backline as it stands at the moment. Could be a late change, couldn’t get names around that. Same as last week apart from the forced ALB change.

Ratima

B.Barrett

Ioane

J.Barrett

Proctor

Reece

Jordan

Bench
21. Christie
22. Dmac
23. Tupaea

No surprises then

Frank

This means this is probably the backline vs Boks subject to Roigard and Hotham recovery times.

The Silver Fern

All Blacks v Argentina II