The Silver Fern

It's almost like the Aussies are taking the piss eh. Give them a thrashing without your best bowlers, apart from Starc, who destroys them.
Next up, our best bat won't play and Starc won't get any wickets, and we'll still thrash you.

@Canes4life I used to really dislike him as a player, thought he was a bit dirty and didn't have much going on, but I'm a convert now. He's got a great attitude: a great super season meant he got a taste of the top level where he didn't set the world on fire, and his response is to come back early and get training.

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@booboo said in All Blacks 2026:

But no fluffybunny is not going to the ground because the beer is Lion Red or Tui ...

Afternoon games would help the gate.

So being able to have better and cheaper piss and food elsewhere while watching the game isn't a valid reason to tip people over into not going, but a 7pm kick-off being after their poor little bed times is?

The positives need to outweigh the negatives, and better and/or cheaper piss and food would be a positive - simple as that. So would afternoon games.

"all of the above"

the casual fan if going to be swayed more by all the other small stuff around the rugby, the food and drink, stadium amenities, convenience, price and time etc

Exactly. The whole 'who cares about that aspect' is the marketing equivalent of not worrying about scrum training because lineouts and rucks are more important.

@booboo said in All Blacks 2026:

But no fluffybunny is not going to the ground because the beer is Lion Red or Tui ...

Afternoon games would help the gate.

So being able to have better and cheaper piss and food elsewhere while watching the game isn't a valid reason to tip people over into not going, but a 7pm kick-off being after their poor little bed times is?

The positives need to outweigh the negatives, and better and/or cheaper piss and food would be a positive - simple as that. So would afternoon games.

@Canes4life said in Hurricanes 2026:

@Nepia said in Hurricanes 2026:

@Canes4life said in Hurricanes 2026:

@Nepia said in Hurricanes 2026:

@Darren said in Hurricanes 2026:

If he is that good, give him a Billy Proctor contract.

Oh god, if he's 16 now that means we have 9 years of @Canes4life going on about him before he finally makes the ABs.

Will never be worse than the McLutchie hype from you fellas. How did that one turn out?

I won’t have to hype up Cooper once he turns pro anyway, the rugby community will door that for me.

Never be worse than suggesting a player should be given a go by their supposed home Super team (something you yourself even suggested on occasion) while that organisation not only picked Hohepa but also has the second best 10 from our team on their books? Sure ...

I’m also not the one that has a chip on their shoulder and has to bad mouth the Canes or Wellington in almost every post I make. Move on man.

Damn, coulda sworn you were that guy.

@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2026:

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks 2026:

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2026:

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks 2026:

@Nepia There are several factors stopping people going as frequently as they used to. The price, as you say - and not just the tickets. Better quality streaming and TVs. A bit of over-saturation of rugby. More competition from other entertainment. Lower-quality competitions, with no All Blacks in the NPC, etc.

This one might just be me, but Super Rugby seems to have lost its appeal a bit with all the changes to teams and competition structure, South African teams leaving, Australian teams underperforming.

I also think atmosphere decline feeds on itself. Smaller crowds create a vicious cycle: empty seats reduce atmosphere, poor atmosphere discourages new or casual fans and once a ground feels quiet, people assume it’s not worth going.

MY personal experience is also the time, we had so many years of night games creeping later and later, am i miss remembering they got to 805pm kickoff? it just became a thing lots of families wouldnt do....and if you dont go with your family i think your less likely to go as an adult, i dont have kids but i would struggle to get mate to come to the pub or even at someone's house...clashed with bed time or bath etc...and when people did come it was always talked about "beautiful day this avo and was looking for something to do with the kids"...now we're getting some more day games which is good but its definitely not peoples routine

Taking the kids to a night game does seem like it'd be a bit too difficult. Our one kid is too young to sit and watch a game and, yes, his bedtime is (conveniently for watching at home) bang on 7:00. But people must have used to either go with the family or without them. Something's changed there - the cost, time, a different attitude etc - that wasn't an issue before. There were more afternoon games pre-professionalism but that's now a long time ago.

The thing that has changed is the convenience of watching it at home, and the general attitude of convenience. Games at night it certainly a factor, but needing tv money since professional came is the big reason for this. TV pays the money, wants the product at night for good viewing times, and it pretty easy to stay at home and watch it in comfort.
I mean one of fasting growing things is uber eats, just sit at home and have everything brought to you there. Have a peek t how many music festivals etc are shutting up shop as well, it's too hard to go out for some.
Apart from young kids everything else about shit food and beer etc is just an excuse really. My experience is ( I been going to rugby, etc for long time), the food and even beer is probably better now than ever was, usually more choice in both, but crowds are still dwindling.

No Dan. You are ignoring that the beer and food quality in NZ outside of rugby grounds has got a shitload better. Nobody is comparing the offerings at the footy and going "man, how lucky are we? this is way better than it was in the 70s!". They are comparing it to what they can have elsewhere now.

I understand that, but I go to concerts still, and beer isn't great. Mates that go to cricket reckon they don't get great beer either. What sports etc do you go to that has really good beer etc? Genuinely interested. I can get craft beer at a Naki game, and they have food caravans selling a reasonable selection. I will bet I probably get as good beer and food at stadiums in NZ as I got at Suncorp Stadium in Brisbane and cricket at the Gabba. You can't have or feed thousands of people like you do at a restaurant mate, it doesn't work. And you go to any game whether test, super or NPC in NZ and have a look at people lined up to buy a drink or food.
And if people aren't saying how lucky are we it's better than the 70s, they weren't going to rugby in 70s, as you couldn't buy any beers in stadiums then, and that was up until 90s, and don't even recall seeing food stalls there, though no doubt you could get hotdog on a stick. I still say if anyone says they not going to rugby because beer and food not up to standard is just not admitting really they just can't be bothered, which is ok. Just be honest.

Why do you have to turn it into some 'these people don't care about rugby as much as I do' thing? The reason for anybody not going to anything could be classed as "couldn't be bothered", and there is a different threshold for everyone at which they can be bothered - some people have kids etc. One of the reasons people can't be bothered is because the food and beer is shit and/or overpriced - improving it would get more people to the footy.
Same thing with day games, but there is a bigger hurdle there with TV timing.
Food trucks are a good option, but the prices need to be reasonable, not venue-enhanced.
A chiller, mobile eftpos machines and a few people to hand out beer is not a huge expense.

More people at the ground, no matter where rugby fits in their list of priorities is a good thing isn't it?

@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2026:

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks 2026:

@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2026:

@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks 2026:

@Nepia There are several factors stopping people going as frequently as they used to. The price, as you say - and not just the tickets. Better quality streaming and TVs. A bit of over-saturation of rugby. More competition from other entertainment. Lower-quality competitions, with no All Blacks in the NPC, etc.

This one might just be me, but Super Rugby seems to have lost its appeal a bit with all the changes to teams and competition structure, South African teams leaving, Australian teams underperforming.

I also think atmosphere decline feeds on itself. Smaller crowds create a vicious cycle: empty seats reduce atmosphere, poor atmosphere discourages new or casual fans and once a ground feels quiet, people assume it’s not worth going.

MY personal experience is also the time, we had so many years of night games creeping later and later, am i miss remembering they got to 805pm kickoff? it just became a thing lots of families wouldnt do....and if you dont go with your family i think your less likely to go as an adult, i dont have kids but i would struggle to get mate to come to the pub or even at someone's house...clashed with bed time or bath etc...and when people did come it was always talked about "beautiful day this avo and was looking for something to do with the kids"...now we're getting some more day games which is good but its definitely not peoples routine

Taking the kids to a night game does seem like it'd be a bit too difficult. Our one kid is too young to sit and watch a game and, yes, his bedtime is (conveniently for watching at home) bang on 7:00. But people must have used to either go with the family or without them. Something's changed there - the cost, time, a different attitude etc - that wasn't an issue before. There were more afternoon games pre-professionalism but that's now a long time ago.

The thing that has changed is the convenience of watching it at home, and the general attitude of convenience. Games at night it certainly a factor, but needing tv money since professional came is the big reason for this. TV pays the money, wants the product at night for good viewing times, and it pretty easy to stay at home and watch it in comfort.
I mean one of fasting growing things is uber eats, just sit at home and have everything brought to you there. Have a peek t how many music festivals etc are shutting up shop as well, it's too hard to go out for some.
Apart from young kids everything else about shit food and beer etc is just an excuse really. My experience is ( I been going to rugby, etc for long time), the food and even beer is probably better now than ever was, usually more choice in both, but crowds are still dwindling.

No Dan. You are ignoring that the beer and food quality in NZ outside of rugby grounds has got a shitload better. Nobody is comparing the offerings at the footy and going "man, how lucky are we? this is way better than it was in the 70s!". They are comparing it to what they can have elsewhere now.

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:

@Nepia said in All Blacks 2026:

I agree, anyone who was death riding rugby (at Super and NPC level) this year just wasn't watching.

I was really impressed by what I saw of NPC this year, seemed better to my ignorant eyes than the hoopla of Super. Messier, maybe, but far less diluted, and more exciting!

Yeah I'm on board too, the actual footy has been great fun.

@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2026:

@gt12 said in All Blacks 2026:

@Nepia

Agreed, I reckon a Giteau rule is the start of the end of NZ's domestic game being anything more than a development league for other comps. It's worth noting that would help Lam btw, but also his rationale was on this aspect was faulty all the way through, so I'd recommend listening to the interview in full.

Edit:

On live games, I'm not going given how much it costs - no only in terms of money, but also the 1 hour drive there and back again, plus traffic, and the shitty food, and shitty beer. I'm surprised people actually go.

Going to rugby has always been thus mate. In fact it used to be you couldn't buy a beer there anyway. But I genuinely think if people don't go to rugby because of shitty beer, they were never going for rugby anyway. Probably same for food, my only concern would be price for people in family groups, but the same in any sport or where there temporary food stalls. I (and mrs) usually have something to eat before a game, and same with having a beer etc.Geez and I drive always an hour for NPC games, never under 2 hrs for a super game and about 3.5 hours for tests.
It's ok to say I don't want to get off couch, got a brother in law who says exactly that, why go out when I can watch it from couch.
I go to games because I love the game, think it deserves my support, and above all else can actually see more.

Just because something is a bit shit doesn't mean it has to be.
Just because the rugby is the main attraction, there's no harm in the ancillary stuff being good.
If you make it easy and affordable and a good experience, people will go and more importantly will come back, and they'll also bring friends who maybe aren't as into the footy. If people come away with a mild sense of regret at how much it cost and disappointment re quality vs price of what they got, or hold off on buying drinks and food... they don't come back and we get empty grounds.

@DurryMexted That's the thing. There are people saying 'international experience is crucial'. But do they mean:
Coaching an overseas club, or a national team? Does that team have to be successful?
If a national team, does it have to be tier 1? If a club team, which comps count?
Does it have to be as a head coach, or is being an assistant in those environments enough?
What about playing in those environments, does that count?

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2026:

The thing is, I think the people that hired him knew exactly what they were getting.

A marketing man's dream?

The problem I have with this argument is that he's absolutely not. He's barely coherent in an interview.

Does bloody great PowerPoint presentations though, apparently.

It's pretty obvious why he'd be picked: absolutely excellent Super rugby coaching results. I don't think it is valid to say that marketing had become more important than results to NZR and that's why he got the job - he had the bloody results, that was literally the strongest argument in his favour.

It's the powerpoint presentations which should have countered that - and that's on the people doing the hiring. Every time he opens his mouth seems like a red flag to me.

Nah. The people who hired him wanted someone who looked like a winner at international level - plus he was fresh and "different". They knew he was untested at international level but that was an inconvenience to be ignored.

There simply are not going to be candidates who are tested and a proven success at tier one international level on any sort of regular basis.

Tony Brown, Jamie Joseph, Joe Schmidt and Dave Rennie say "Hi"

Correct me if I'm wrong but at the time of Robertson's appointment:
Brown had not been an international head coach (and still hasn't).
Joseph had coached tier 2 Japan.
Joe Schmidt had not been an international head coach.
Dave Rennie had just been sacked from the Wallabies - after he had been passed over for Foster, who had also not been an international head coach.

as @Tim noted, Ireland are technically an international team.
But can I add Gatland (3 6N titles) ? John Kirwan was also an ex-international head coach. And Robbie Deans. And John Mitchell. Maybe we missed a bullet.

So, aside from bullets dodged - Schmidt then - who probably didn't want the job?
Point remains, we can't expect to have a range of first rate internationally tier 1 experienced head coach candidates available when we want them. It's just not realistic.

@Tim said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

Joe Schmidt had not been an international head coach.

Long time head coach of Ireland.

hahaha ah yep.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2026:

The thing is, I think the people that hired him knew exactly what they were getting.

A marketing man's dream?

The problem I have with this argument is that he's absolutely not. He's barely coherent in an interview.

Does bloody great PowerPoint presentations though, apparently.

It's pretty obvious why he'd be picked: absolutely excellent Super rugby coaching results. I don't think it is valid to say that marketing had become more important than results to NZR and that's why he got the job - he had the bloody results, that was literally the strongest argument in his favour.

It's the powerpoint presentations which should have countered that - and that's on the people doing the hiring. Every time he opens his mouth seems like a red flag to me.

Nah. The people who hired him wanted someone who looked like a winner at international level - plus he was fresh and "different". They knew he was untested at international level but that was an inconvenience to be ignored.

There simply are not going to be candidates who are tested and a proven success at tier one international level on any sort of regular basis.

Tony Brown, Jamie Joseph, Joe Schmidt and Dave Rennie say "Hi"

Correct me if I'm wrong but at the time of Robertson's appointment:
Brown had not been an international head coach (and still hasn't).
Joseph had coached tier 2 Japan.
Joe Schmidt had not been an international head coach.
Dave Rennie had just been sacked from the Wallabies - after he had been passed over for Foster, who had also not been an international head coach.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2026:

The thing is, I think the people that hired him knew exactly what they were getting.

A marketing man's dream?

The problem I have with this argument is that he's absolutely not. He's barely coherent in an interview.

Does bloody great PowerPoint presentations though, apparently.

It's pretty obvious why he'd be picked: absolutely excellent Super rugby coaching results. I don't think it is valid to say that marketing had become more important than results to NZR and that's why he got the job - he had the bloody results, that was literally the strongest argument in his favour.

It's the powerpoint presentations which should have countered that - and that's on the people doing the hiring. Every time he opens his mouth seems like a red flag to me.

Nah. The people who hired him wanted someone who looked like a winner at international level - plus he was fresh and "different". They knew he was untested at international level but that was an inconvenience to be ignored.

There simply are not going to be candidates who are tested and a proven success at tier one international level on any sort of regular basis.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2026:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2026:

The thing is, I think the people that hired him knew exactly what they were getting.

A marketing man's dream?

The problem I have with this argument is that he's absolutely not. He's barely coherent in an interview.

Does bloody great PowerPoint presentations though, apparently.

It's pretty obvious why he'd be picked: absolutely excellent Super rugby coaching results. I don't think it is valid to say that marketing had become more important than results to NZR and that's why he got the job - he had the bloody results, that was literally the strongest argument in his favour.

It's the powerpoint presentations which should have countered that - and that's on the people doing the hiring. Every time he opens his mouth seems like a red flag to me.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2026:

The thing is, I think the people that hired him knew exactly what they were getting.

A marketing man's dream?

The problem I have with this argument is that he's absolutely not. He's barely coherent in an interview.

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:

@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:

The same group loved Foster for his great communication and trusting relationship and what did that get the team?

A one-point loss in a RWC Final with 14 men? Can you imagine this lot displaying that level of fortitude, because I can't. Robertson's teamssimply give up when times get hard - something I've never, ever seen in an AB team.

Robertson pushed himself forward with the aid of his media-fluffers as a coaching wunderkind. Looks increasing like he just hopelessly out of his depth.

He's handed over the actual coaching to Hansen so he could concentrate on "Culture and Well-being". The result? He seems to have lost the dressing room

I've had a gutsful of Robertson mate, but revisionism on Foster is unnecessary. His tenure was shit. The WC final was the outlier, that game is not a fair representation of his coaching time with the ABs and it's hardly a 'jesus christ look at what Robertson has done with our mighty lost the final by a point with 14 men ABs' situation. There's been no improvement - which is fucking shit - but lets not pretend we were in a good spot before he took over.

It's also not a candidate's job to present themselves as 'might not be as good as my record shows', it's up to the people doing the hiring to figure that out.

@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2026:

@No-Quarter i think how Ardie plays, he will unbalance most trios he is part of at international level.

Phenomenal athlete, huge ticker, has been an awesome player for us over the years, but for me, we need him to play a different game, or as many have said for several years, we need to have a 6 and 7 (or 8 depending where you start him) that compliment him, whether he is still good enough to dictate that we pick 2 loosies to suit his game, who knows.

Yeah, this is where I sit. He does amazing things. But, he very much does not do some things.
If you set him in stone (it doesn't matter which position), that sets the requirements for the other two loosies - and if we don't have 2 players who can between them do all of those tasks at a world class level, the group will never work.

@game_film said in All Blacks 2026:

Any of Savea’s supposed flaws are magnified by the lack of others in the loosies to complement / counter his skills.

He does come through in the big moments, e.g the turnover at the end of the Boks game at Eden Park.

And the big moments in the other Boks game?

@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2026:

@Jet said in All Blacks 2026:

@Tim said in All Blacks 2026:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/2025-nz-rugby-awards-ardie-saveas-player-of-the-year-prize-caps-a-dominant-year/5AMBW2XMKJFX7APJUPN7TAVXHI/

LOL

Have the fanbase ever been so disconnected from the team/pundits/officialdom?

There is a sizeable consensus on message boards that Ardie should be on the bench or not in the squad at all.

To be honest I think it's a vocal minority that think Savea is overrated. Most NZ fans love him and think he's one of the best players in the world.

People who have a thorough understanding of the game are probably a minority of fans too. Coincidence?

Seriously though, he was superb in Super rugby and nowhere near world xv at test level. The majority of his critics on here at AB level would be very happy to see him getting the super award, because it is deserved.