Italy v All Blacks
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The ruck defense was one of the most frustrating parts of the game. We were constantly watching them wrestle and disrupt our ball as we had only committed one cleaner & one man at best to lock down the ruck, making it terribly difficult for Roigard to clear the ball. This was the same issue that we had against Ireland which i believe made it appear that Ratima had a bad game - when in reality he was having to tidy up loose/disrupted ball at the back of the ruck.
Why cant we seem to adjust to this in game?@DurryMexted leadership?
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@canefan said in Italy v All Blacks:
@Nepia watched the first half, and Rieko always gets the ball and the tackler. The same can be said for most of our backline passing. We are obsessed with tight pop passing to cut through the line. It's rarely pretty or effective. One guy who consistently seems to run nice lines and gets space is Will Jordan
100%. I think Goldie mentioned this which is why he keeps dropping the ball. In the second half the move started working leaving a giant whole between 13 and 14 only for us to f@ck it in the @rse with the link play.
Our backs really seem to play narrow to start with, very compressed making it hard to get to the flanks.
@LatsToTheMax said in Italy v All Blacks:
@canefan said in Italy v All Blacks:
@Nepia watched the first half, and Rieko always gets the ball and the tackler. The same can be said for most of our backline passing. We are obsessed with tight pop passing to cut through the line. It's rarely pretty or effective. One guy who consistently seems to run nice lines and gets space is Will Jordan
100%. I think Goldie mentioned this which is why he keeps dropping the ball. In the second half the move started working leaving a giant whole between 13 and 14 only for us to f@ck it in the @rse with the link play.
Our backs really seem to play narrow to start with, very compressed making it hard to get to the flanks.
And way too flat
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The ruck defense was one of the most frustrating parts of the game. We were constantly watching them wrestle and disrupt our ball as we had only committed one cleaner & one man at best to lock down the ruck, making it terribly difficult for Roigard to clear the ball. This was the same issue that we had against Ireland which i believe made it appear that Ratima had a bad game - when in reality he was having to tidy up loose/disrupted ball at the back of the ruck.
Why cant we seem to adjust to this in game?@DurryMexted said in Italy v All Blacks:
The ruck defense was one of the most frustrating parts of the game. We were constantly watching them wrestle and disrupt our ball as we had only committed one cleaner & one man at best to lock down the ruck, making it terribly difficult for Roigard to clear the ball. This was the same issue that we had against Ireland which i believe made it appear that Ratima had a bad game - when in reality he was having to tidy up loose/disrupted ball at the back of the ruck.
Why cant we seem to adjust to this in game?Agree completely, and I made that comment during the game, we can't complain about the ref if we are not getting numbers to the ruck. The team with more numbers will almost always get the rub of the green from the ref. It's just dumb rugby that may work at Super but it sure as fuck doesn't work at test level. Why haven't the coaches learnt that yet?
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We also need to be a lot more specific when it comes to saying our forwards went well. They didn't. Our props, hookers and one lock went well. The other look was in poor form, and our loose forward trio is completely unbalanced which has led to us getting smashed at ruck time. We are a long way from being where we need to be in the forwards, and our backline is an absolute shambles.
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Well. A little more calm this morning. But. So many work ons. And it does feel like we've regressed since the WC. TBF the forwards went pretty well this tour. But. The backs. And the attack plan / game management for the most part was non-existent. I could not see for the life of me what they were trying to achieve last night. When they were just hammering away at the Italian line but constantly over running or shelling the last pass, it looked pretty clueless and rudderless out there. No-one seemed willing to step up and take responsibility to seize the game by the scruff. Headless chickens. Leadership group? Where the fuck were they? A leader would be a good start. Think this will spell the end of some careers for sure.
@Jailbreak7 said in Italy v All Blacks:
Well. A little more calm this morning. But. So many work ons. And it does feel like we've regressed since the WC. TBF the forwards went pretty well this tour. But. The backs. And the attack plan / game management for the most part was non-existent. I could not see for the life of me what they were trying to achieve last night. When they were just hammering away at the Italian line but constantly over running or shelling the last pass, it looked pretty clueless and rudderless out there. No-one seemed willing to step up and take responsibility to seize the game by the scruff. Headless chickens. Leadership group? Where the fuck were they? A leader would be a good start. Think this will spell the end of some careers for sure.
Crazy how we're suddenly struggling to outflank the rush defense again ever since Beaudens been starting at 10..
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We also need to be a lot more specific when it comes to saying our forwards went well. They didn't. Our props, hookers and one lock went well. The other look was in poor form, and our loose forward trio is completely unbalanced which has led to us getting smashed at ruck time. We are a long way from being where we need to be in the forwards, and our backline is an absolute shambles.
@No-Quarter said in Italy v All Blacks:
We also need to be a lot more specific when it comes to saying our forwards went well. They didn't. Our props, hookers and one lock went well. The other look was in poor form, and our loose forward trio is completely unbalanced which has led to us getting smashed at ruck time. We are a long way from being where we need to be in the forwards, and our backline is an absolute shambles.
Which lock was in poor form? (I couldn't see the game).
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@No-Quarter said in Italy v All Blacks:
We also need to be a lot more specific when it comes to saying our forwards went well. They didn't. Our props, hookers and one lock went well. The other look was in poor form, and our loose forward trio is completely unbalanced which has led to us getting smashed at ruck time. We are a long way from being where we need to be in the forwards, and our backline is an absolute shambles.
Which lock was in poor form? (I couldn't see the game).
@nostrildamus said in Italy v All Blacks:
@No-Quarter said in Italy v All Blacks:
We also need to be a lot more specific when it comes to saying our forwards went well. They didn't. Our props, hookers and one lock went well. The other look was in poor form, and our loose forward trio is completely unbalanced which has led to us getting smashed at ruck time. We are a long way from being where we need to be in the forwards, and our backline is an absolute shambles.
Which lock was in poor form? (I couldn't see the game).
Scott Barrett. I think he got the most TSF MoM point last year, but only three this year.
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@No-Quarter said in Italy v All Blacks:
We also need to be a lot more specific when it comes to saying our forwards went well. They didn't. Our props, hookers and one lock went well. The other look was in poor form, and our loose forward trio is completely unbalanced which has led to us getting smashed at ruck time. We are a long way from being where we need to be in the forwards, and our backline is an absolute shambles.
Which lock was in poor form? (I couldn't see the game).
@nostrildamus said in Italy v All Blacks:
@No-Quarter said in Italy v All Blacks:
We also need to be a lot more specific when it comes to saying our forwards went well. They didn't. Our props, hookers and one lock went well. The other look was in poor form, and our loose forward trio is completely unbalanced which has led to us getting smashed at ruck time. We are a long way from being where we need to be in the forwards, and our backline is an absolute shambles.
Which lock was in poor form? (I couldn't see the game).
Sorry my comment was in response to comments in this thread about the wider season rather than just this game, probably better suited to the AB 2024 thread
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Well said Scotty
They say you can't polish a turd, but you can roll it in glitter. So thank goodness there was a final flourish from Beauden Barrett to provide the sparkle on a dull night in the north of Italy.
https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/11/25/scotty-stevenson-on-the-sidelines-november-25/
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Finally got around to watching this, and haven't read the thread yet.
B Barrett is hard to watch. Roigard's decision making and execution poor also. Scrum good. Sloppy lineouts. We make good progress whenever we pick and go... And the Scott Barrett card we've all been waiting for. Our scrum was worse, and lineout was better with S Barrett off.
Ball security and structure a mess. Still kicking the ball away. A few breaks but support play is a mess. Cards a lottery. Our passing and catching is really mediocre, dropped balls and passes to ground in just about every movement.
De groot was busy and showed he still has value, Lomax good as usual. Scrum dominant. That's about it, it was shit. -
my gut feeling is scooter plays in instinct, charges round....and get cards...but when not thinking he makes yards etc...making him captain is asking him to think...which i think is going to diminish his game
@Kiwiwomble he was/is a pretty good when he captains the crusaders, but maybe international captaincy aint for him.
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@Kiwiwomble he was/is a pretty good when he captains the crusaders, but maybe international captaincy aint for him.
@taniwharugby making decisions with 12k blues/canes/chiefs (highlanders wouldnt get 12k) fans scattered around a NZ ground slightly different to 80k fench/english/south african fans screaming at you
edit:....also, is that the same crusaders that missed out on playoffs
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@Kiwiwomble he was/is a pretty good when he captains the crusaders, but maybe international captaincy aint for him.
@taniwharugby said in Italy v All Blacks:
@Kiwiwomble he was/is a pretty good when he captains the crusaders, but maybe international captaincy aint for him.
Perhaps the opposition isn't to the same level..?
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@LatsToTheMax said in Italy v All Blacks:
@canefan said in Italy v All Blacks:
@Nepia watched the first half, and Rieko always gets the ball and the tackler. The same can be said for most of our backline passing. We are obsessed with tight pop passing to cut through the line. It's rarely pretty or effective. One guy who consistently seems to run nice lines and gets space is Will Jordan
100%. I think Goldie mentioned this which is why he keeps dropping the ball. In the second half the move started working leaving a giant whole between 13 and 14 only for us to f@ck it in the @rse with the link play.
Our backs really seem to play narrow to start with, very compressed making it hard to get to the flanks.
And way too flat
@canefan said in Italy v All Blacks:
@LatsToTheMax said in Italy v All Blacks:
@canefan said in Italy v All Blacks:
@Nepia watched the first half, and Rieko always gets the ball and the tackler. The same can be said for most of our backline passing. We are obsessed with tight pop passing to cut through the line. It's rarely pretty or effective. One guy who consistently seems to run nice lines and gets space is Will Jordan
100%. I think Goldie mentioned this which is why he keeps dropping the ball. In the second half the move started working leaving a giant whole between 13 and 14 only for us to f@ck it in the @rse with the link play.
Our backs really seem to play narrow to start with, very compressed making it hard to get to the flanks.
And way too flat
Yeah this is evident watching even the Wallabies play. The defence gets in our faces a whole lot more.
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@Jailbreak7 said in Italy v All Blacks:
Well. A little more calm this morning. But. So many work ons. And it does feel like we've regressed since the WC. TBF the forwards went pretty well this tour. But. The backs. And the attack plan / game management for the most part was non-existent. I could not see for the life of me what they were trying to achieve last night. When they were just hammering away at the Italian line but constantly over running or shelling the last pass, it looked pretty clueless and rudderless out there. No-one seemed willing to step up and take responsibility to seize the game by the scruff. Headless chickens. Leadership group? Where the fuck were they? A leader would be a good start. Think this will spell the end of some careers for sure.
Crazy how we're suddenly struggling to outflank the rush defense again ever since Beaudens been starting at 10..
@kpkanz said in Italy v All Blacks:
@Jailbreak7 said in Italy v All Blacks:
Well. A little more calm this morning. But. So many work ons. And it does feel like we've regressed since the WC. TBF the forwards went pretty well this tour. But. The backs. And the attack plan / game management for the most part was non-existent. I could not see for the life of me what they were trying to achieve last night. When they were just hammering away at the Italian line but constantly over running or shelling the last pass, it looked pretty clueless and rudderless out there. No-one seemed willing to step up and take responsibility to seize the game by the scruff. Headless chickens. Leadership group? Where the fuck were they? A leader would be a good start. Think this will spell the end of some careers for sure.
Crazy how we're suddenly struggling to outflank the rush defense again ever since Beaudens been starting at 10..
Depth cough depth
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I'm clearly not watching close enough - the grating thing for me isn't the depth, it's the lack of bodies in motion and/or variation in lines. We often pass way deep....to a guy standing still....who does fuck all other than a step forward and a step sideways.... before passing way deep...to a guy standing still...who...
Yeah fucking depressing
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I honestly, at the start of the year, did not expect to hear whisperings, whisperings mind you, that SB might not be considered a locked in locking spot by the end of the season.
Or maybe I am hearing the wrong whisperings... -
I believe he is an actor in the States, his accent is bit of Aussie, American and Kiwi. There is another guy I follow who is based in Mexico. This is Razor at the press conference.
@SBW1 said in Italy v All Blacks:
I believe he is an actor in the States, his accent is bit of Aussie, American and Kiwi. There is another guy I follow who is based in Mexico. This is Razor at the press conference.
Fuck me - first two minutes of that, with the chick actually insisting on answers to the questions she'd asked - that's a hard watch.
Robertson - avoiding questions, struggling to come up with answers, and resulting to "... we knew it was going to be a hard match"
Barrett - asked about TJP - avoiding the question, but having the self-awareness to realise he was doing so, and obviously... finally just answered it, like a confession.
After that - back to standard sycophantic questions, but even with those... Robertson struggling to do basic bullshit press-conference ramble.
And then - "[after this year] ... you learn about test footy". Possibly the most apt ending. -
I honestly, at the start of the year, did not expect to hear whisperings, whisperings mind you, that SB might not be considered a locked in locking spot by the end of the season.
Or maybe I am hearing the wrong whisperings...@nostrildamus said in Italy v All Blacks:
I honestly, at the start of the year, did not expect to hear whisperings, whisperings mind you, that SB might not be considered a locked in locking spot by the end of the season.
Or maybe I am hearing the wrong whisperings...Whisper it quietly but no one expected Tuipulotu and Vai’i to improve like they have
