All Blacks 2025
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I don't know where else to put this, but NZR has decided on a national high-performance pathway for U18s. This will align neatly with what Oz is already doing and may just help the U20s in future.
Note this doesn't replace the New Zealand Secondary Schools Rugby Union (NZSSRU) side.
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No idea where to put this but it sounds like we should've stuck with Fozzie & Co.
https://www.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/comments/1ja7q43/will_jordan_on_the_ireland_quarterfinal/
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No idea where to put this but it sounds like we should've stuck with Fozzie & Co.
https://www.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/comments/1ja7q43/will_jordan_on_the_ireland_quarterfinal/
@darylmitchell said in All Blacks 2025:
No idea where to put this but it sounds like we should've stuck with Fozzie & Co.
https://www.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/comments/1ja7q43/will_jordan_on_the_ireland_quarterfinal/
Few AB teams were as up for a game as that quarter-final and Foster deserves credit for that as does Schmidt for tactical nous. Jordan kinda backs up the stuff people like Mo'unga have said about Foster.
We needed to move on but not getting Schmidt on board for Robertson's first year was a huge fuck-up. Just look at how our forwards have benefitted from Ryan's continuity in the coaching set-up.
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@darylmitchell said in All Blacks 2025:
No idea where to put this but it sounds like we should've stuck with Fozzie & Co.
https://www.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/comments/1ja7q43/will_jordan_on_the_ireland_quarterfinal/
Few AB teams were as up for a game as that quarter-final and Foster deserves credit for that as does Schmidt for tactical nous. Jordan kinda backs up the stuff people like Mo'unga have said about Foster.
We needed to move on but not getting Schmidt on board for Robertson's first year was a huge fuck-up. Just look at how our forwards have benefitted from Ryan's continuity in the coaching set-up.
@Victor-Meldrew I'm pretty certain it was Schmidt's decision not to continue after 2023.
i reckon the (Foster, Schmidt, McLeod, Ryan, Feek, Strawbridge) coaching group of mid 2022-2023 was stronger than Razor's. It's a real shame we didn't stick with them.
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@Victor-Meldrew I'm pretty certain it was Schmidt's decision not to continue after 2023.
i reckon the (Foster, Schmidt, McLeod, Ryan, Feek, Strawbridge) coaching group of mid 2022-2023 was stronger than Razor's. It's a real shame we didn't stick with them.
@darylmitchell said in All Blacks 2025:
i reckon the (Foster, Schmidt, McLeod, Ryan, Feek, Strawbridge) coaching group of mid 2022-2023 was stronger than Razor's. It's a real shame we didn't stick with them.
Need to give the current lot some more time, I think. Reserving my judgement until this year's AI's...
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There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
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There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
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@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
Key talents like Sotutu and Plummer? The key talents of the Blues one successful year after several seasons of being torn apart at the pointy end of the season by the Crusaders? Both players are one season wonders. Nothing suggests the ABs would improve with either of them in the team. Robertsons obsession with Mounga only seems silly after McKenzies performance against Ireland. He had every right to have next to no confidence in Barrett or McKenzie and the only logical solution was a player that is head and shoulders above both.
There are no solutions at 10 or back row. But blame the guy who had nothing to do with NZ rugby not the guy who’s been there for 12 years and has done nothing to foster player development or depth?
Foster was a disaster. There was no game plan or accuracy. You think Robertson was going to be able to turn a turd into gold in one season?
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
Key talents like Sotutu and Plummer? The key talents of the Blues one successful year after several seasons of being torn apart at the pointy end of the season by the Crusaders? Both players are one season wonders. Nothing suggests the ABs would improve with either of them in the team. Robertsons obsession with Mounga only seems silly after McKenzies performance against Ireland. He had every right to have next to no confidence in Barrett or McKenzie and the only logical solution was a player that is head and shoulders above both.
There are no solutions at 10 or back row. But blame the guy who had nothing to do with NZ rugby not the guy who’s been there for 12 years and has done nothing to foster player development or depth?
Foster was a disaster. There was no game plan or accuracy. You think Robertson was going to be able to turn a turd into gold in one season?
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
Foster was a disaster. There was no game plan or accuracy. You think Robertson was going to be able to turn a turd into gold in one season?
I'm reall not interested in Foster in 2025 nor fixated by him as you seem to be - he left 2 seasons ago. I'm interested in how the current coaching set up is going to improve things moving forward and win stuff like the Rugby Championship. It isn't going to do that by Robertson wasting time banging his head against NZR's eligibility criteria.
And calling a team which lost to the RWC to Sth Africa by 1 point with 14 men "a turd", doesn't speak well of your rugby acumen and your respect of the players themselves.
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@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
Foster was a disaster. There was no game plan or accuracy. You think Robertson was going to be able to turn a turd into gold in one season?
I'm reall not interested in Foster in 2025 nor fixated by him as you seem to be - he left 2 seasons ago. I'm interested in how the current coaching set up is going to improve things moving forward and win stuff like the Rugby Championship. It isn't going to do that by Robertson wasting time banging his head against NZR's eligibility criteria.
And calling a team which lost to the RWC to Sth Africa by 1 point with 14 men "a turd", doesn't speak well of your rugby acumen and your respect of the players themselves.
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
Foster was a disaster. There was no game plan or accuracy. You think Robertson was going to be able to turn a turd into gold in one season?
I'm reall not interested in Foster in 2025 nor fixated by him as you seem to be - he left 2 seasons ago. I'm interested in how the current coaching set up is going to improve things moving forward and win stuff like the Rugby Championship. It isn't going to do that by Robertson wasting time banging his head against NZR's eligibility criteria.
And calling a team which lost to the RWC to Sth Africa by 1 point with 14 men "a turd", doesn't speak well of your rugby acumen and your respect of the players themselves.
I responded to a comment, I didn’t bring foster up. It’s a reoccurring theme right down the thread.
The team over that four year period was a turd. I respect them as much as I’d respect any professional doing their job, by their performance. A lot of it didn’t deserve much respect.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
Foster was a disaster. There was no game plan or accuracy. You think Robertson was going to be able to turn a turd into gold in one season?
I'm reall not interested in Foster in 2025 nor fixated by him as you seem to be - he left 2 seasons ago. I'm interested in how the current coaching set up is going to improve things moving forward and win stuff like the Rugby Championship. It isn't going to do that by Robertson wasting time banging his head against NZR's eligibility criteria.
And calling a team which lost to the RWC to Sth Africa by 1 point with 14 men "a turd", doesn't speak well of your rugby acumen and your respect of the players themselves.
I responded to a comment, I didn’t bring foster up. It’s a reoccurring theme right down the thread.
The team over that four year period was a turd. I respect them as much as I’d respect any professional doing their job, by their performance. A lot of it didn’t deserve much respect.
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
I responded to a comment, I didn’t bring foster up.
The discussion was whether we should have stuck with Foster and/or maintained continuity with Schmidt - a perfectly valid point when considering Will Jordan's comments on the RWC performance and what we saw last year.
Your response was posting a highly-original comment on how shit Foster was.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
Key talents like Sotutu and Plummer? The key talents of the Blues one successful year after several seasons of being torn apart at the pointy end of the season by the Crusaders? Both players are one season wonders. Nothing suggests the ABs would improve with either of them in the team. Robertsons obsession with Mounga only seems silly after McKenzies performance against Ireland. He had every right to have next to no confidence in Barrett or McKenzie and the only logical solution was a player that is head and shoulders above both.
There are no solutions at 10 or back row. But blame the guy who had nothing to do with NZ rugby not the guy who’s been there for 12 years and has done nothing to foster player development or depth?
Foster was a disaster. There was no game plan or accuracy. You think Robertson was going to be able to turn a turd into gold in one season?
@KiwiInLondon largely agree on Sotutu and Plummer but in what world has Mo'unga ever shown himself to be 'head and shoulders' above McKenzie at international level? McKenzie's already shown as much potential at 10 for NZ as Mo'unga did over four years, even without taking the Ireland game into consideration.
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Fair to say this is a huge year for Razor. No more mucking around, his reputation as a coach is on the line, he has to show big improvement in selection, development, and tactics
@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
Fair to say this is a huge year for Razor. No more mucking around, his reputation as a coach is on the line, he has to show big improvement in selection, development, and tactics
He needs to be more adventurous. Hopefully he feels a bit more confident and take some risks. He has a solid tight 5, good halfback options and experience in the backs to fall back on - it's a pretty good foundation to work from.
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I'm quite interested to see what kind of year Reiko Ioane has.
Previous coaches have had no issue giving the boot to speedsters who lose their edge even if only by a small margin although unlike them ( well, Umaga ) he broke the norm and shifted positions VERY early.
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@KiwiInLondon said in All Blacks 2025:
There’s a thin line (aka Jordie Barrett try saver while holding the ball up) between a terrible coach and a great coach apparently. Ignoring the fact we were comprehensively beaten by France in the opening round and the fact that we showed absolutely no update in gameplay against South Africa. It was headless chickens on the field. The onfield leadership and adaptability of Fosters team was awful. Playing against a team like Ireland that is incredibly structured was a gift wrapped present to paper over the cracks.
And bugger-all's changed under the bloke touted as the new Messiah. If you look at the AB's abject performance in the RC, it actually got worse
One year on, we find ourselves with a still unsettled back row and a crazy situation at 10 with one decent 10 and another way past his sell by date. There's been zero development plans or back-up options at 10 - unless you consider a converted Crusaders average utility back as the answer. This because of Robertson's truly weird and bizarre obsession with Mo'unga. And we've lost key talent like Sotutu and Plummer to what looks increasingly like seriously inept player management.
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
But never mind. Let's ignore the lessons of what went right and why we managed to almost win RWC2023 with 14 men, and console ourselves with Foster this and Foster that, eh?
Oh you're going on about Foster again.
But I agree adaptability has been a problem with the ABs for some time. And bench timing. I thought our first test against England (I think) was a good use of the bench but then it went back to the meh timing of earlier years. -
I'm quite interested to see what kind of year Reiko Ioane has.
Previous coaches have had no issue giving the boot to speedsters who lose their edge even if only by a small margin although unlike them ( well, Umaga ) he broke the norm and shifted positions VERY early.
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
I'm quite interested to see what kind of year Reiko Ioane has.
Not sure about Reiko, but Rieko Ioane has some competition and needs to show some attacking flair and fire (he is lucky Proctor is injured perhaps).
Previous coaches have had no issue giving the boot to speedsters who lose their edge even if only by a small margin although unlike them ( well, Umaga ) he broke the norm and shifted positions VERY early.
I think Reece (who was never an out and out speedster) is slowing. If Jordan has lost a bit of pace that is a concern too.
Strategically it would be nice to see some fresh and unexpected talent in the outside backs.
