All Blacks 2025
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
Some here.
Some of those old threads are fun reading, now that we see the results with Razor.
That first link starts with my post.
"He took Blackadder's squad who weren't capable of winning super rugby and who had lost experienced ABs ... and I think many posters would agree made it better."
I don't think that has suddenly become untrue. His super record is still darn good.
The question is why hasn't it translated.
Given he now has Ryan again and had some choice with assistant coaches I go back a post I wrote months earlier, did O'Gara have an important contribution to play? -
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
LOL that's
The sheep were probably thinking "We walk together..."We walk with a lot of care
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@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@Darren said in All Blacks 2025:
I'd love to know what he really is like as a coach, from the clips I have seen at training, he just seems to oversee things without being too directly involved, but I could and probably am totally incorrect.
From Sam Whitelock's book.....
Without doubt Razor sees things differently. Here’s a story from our first year working together that sums him up perfectly. I had played massive minutes for the Crusaders and the All Blacks over the past few years, and my body was screaming at me.
A niggly Achilles would plague me for the rest of my career. Razor got me into his office and showed me a photo..... of a rooster leading a group of hens across a bridge. He pointed at the rooster and said, ‘This is you.’
‘Okay,’ I said. ‘Where are you going with this one, Ray?’
‘If there’s something that needs doing, you’re the first one to do it. If there’s a drill that needs demonstrating, you’re first up and doing it. But I need this …’ Then he showed me another photo, and I saw a dog with three sheep in a little mob.
What Razor was showing me, in his inimitable style, was that he needed me to bark from behind.
I can see that sort of thing working with someone of profoundly low intelligence but anyone with half a brain would surely double over with cringe.
It does probably work on club, semi-pro and non-elite-level-pro rugby players who don't get exposed to the game's most analytical coaches and cutting edge tactics (most of these players would all have low-level CTE too, which probably helps).
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
The forwards are going quite well individually (suggests Ryan is doing his job)
i am starting to believe this isn't going as well as we thought. the set piece is going backwards, our ruck work leaves a lot to be desired, and defensively we are soft as butter.
There is a sense that we are going well because we have more depth in our tight 5 than we have had in decades. However, the actual performance of the tight 5 as a unit has been mixed. More concerningly, our back row is comparatively weak in depth, talent and performance.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
The forwards are going quite well individually (suggests Ryan is doing his job)
i am starting to believe this isn't going as well as we thought. the set piece is going backwards, our ruck work leaves a lot to be desired, and defensively we are soft as butter.
Plus worse loose forward trios the All Blacks have ever put. The loose forwards are part of the forward pack.
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@bayimports said in All Blacks 2025:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@bayimports said in All Blacks 2025:
Cory one of our own bomb refusal experts, if he can pass that on, I’m in
Hmm, I thought bomb refusal was what our team was doing so well currently...
I don’t think so in my opinion, now not based on stats but I would suggest that our diffusal of contestable kicks is probably down on what it once was, which irritates me even more when we continue to box kick,
Diffusal, refusal, toemato, tomato...
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@mariner4life #metoo!
But I guess to take some positive from it, given the talk of possible issues in the squad (inc coaching group) it may point towards there not (major) being issues there, so who knows.
Not sure who this Newboult fella is, but he has penned an article re possible replacements for Holland...
Frontrunners: Roger Randle, Andrew Goodman, Scott Hansen
In the mix Joe Schmidt, David Hill
Outside bets James Marshall, Brad Cooper, Cory Brown, Jason O’Halloran
Wild cards: Brad Mooar, Wayne Smith, Ronan O’Gara, Tony Brown
Surely not: Leon MacDonald, Dave RennieAll Blacks coach departs! 15 possible replacements from 'the highly improbable' to the 'slighty awkward' top choice
Backs coach Jason Holland will leave the All Blacks set-up at the end of the season so we have delved into his potential replacements.
Their reason for dismissing Dave Rennie,, "he'd create a clash" is (if those clashes remained private) EXACTLY why I'd want him. I think having someone to challenge Scott Robertson's thinking in camp will get the best out of him and his squad. The best leaders I've worked with know their limitations and know what they don't know, even while projecting utter confidence in public
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@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
The forwards are going quite well individually (suggests Ryan is doing his job)
i am starting to believe this isn't going as well as we thought. the set piece is going backwards, our ruck work leaves a lot to be desired, and defensively we are soft as butter.
Plus worse loose forward trios the All Blacks have ever put. The loose forwards are part of the forward pack.
Other peoples' loose forwards are part of a forward pack.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan having had a couple of sessions with Rennie decades ago ( one being defence focused) and usually with a terrible memory, the learnings stuck in my head to this day. Extremely good communicator and enabler.
So how is it best to hold a tackle bag?
Knuckle grip.
Bok hooker is expert: https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/360864814/springboks-front-rower-jan-hendrik-wessels-gets-nine-match-ban-genital-grab
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@bayimports said in All Blacks 2025:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@bayimports said in All Blacks 2025:
Cory one of our own bomb refusal experts, if he can pass that on, I’m in
Hmm, I thought bomb refusal was what our team was doing so well currently...
I don’t think so in my opinion, now not based on stats but I would suggest that our diffusal of contestable kicks is probably down on what it once was, which irritates me even more when we continue to box kick,
Diffusal, refusal, toemato, tomato...
got it, missed it first time
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@Wurzel said in All Blacks 2025:
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
Suggesting Scott Robertson is some Ted Lasso, David Brent character just ain’t it. The guy has won basically every season of his career until now.
He has underwhelmed in black no doubt, but he isn’t an idiot.
I dunno man, taking one of your most senior players who is clearly a smart guy and showing him pictures of farm animals and asking him to bark at his team mates like a dog seems pretty idiotic to me. I am a bit taken aback by that haha.
If you read the entire book our most-capped and one of our most revered All Blacks talks about how that message resonated with him. He credits the interaction with taking his leadership to a new and necessary level.
I'm willing to bet said All Black is a better judge of what makes a good rugby coach than any of us tapping our little brains out on a message board.
One thing I will say is that leadership style heavy on metaphors, corporate wankspeak and "together we walk" crap is fine when things are going well, but when the going gets tough the wheels tend to fall off very quicky. People lose faith in the culture and the direction of the organisation very fast as it's all too fluffy, which is exactly what we saw in that embarrassing performance against SA in Wellington with players actually giving up they were so disillusioned.
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For what it's worth Razor was my 2nd pick to Schmidt, and only because of Schmidt's experience. One of my most heavily upvoted posts on this forum is about how Razor was a far superior candidate to Fozzie, so I wasn't against his appointment.
I'm just frustrated with him now because 1) he has refused to select the best players in the country, 2) the selections of those he has picked in the squad have been consistently poor in key positions and doesn't look like changing, and 3) the gameplan we are implementing doesn't look well suited to the modern version of test footy. So we are less than the sum of our parts right now.
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The tragedy is that I think Scott Robertson could be a fine international coach. But rather than surrounding himself with wise, experienced heads, he went for sycophants and yes men as his assistants. Rather than picking the best players from across New Zealand, he went with those he was comfortable coaching. He drunk his own Kool aid before he's achieved anything at international level.
Ultimately the culpability is with NZR for allowing this to happen.
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I think the dynamic between Robertson and Jason Ryan changed as a result of Ryan coaching the All Blacks for two years with Foster and Schmidt and leading them to the RWC final.
At the Crusader's Robertson the undisputed king but coming into the All Blacks with no previous test experience while Ryan was already a experienced international forward coach has lead Robertson to allowing Ryan too much influence over him and the team. Players Ryan liked and had a relationship with where instantly Robertson's men (Sam Cane and TJ Perenara stand out as the most obvious) and players Ryan disliked were written off without even being given a chance by Robertson.
It appears to me that the last two years Jason Ryan has actually been the All Blacks Head Coach with Scott Robertson in the role of clown media relations man. Robertson needs to put Ryan back in his place as a forwards coach who coaches the best talent NZ rugby can produce or replace him. But this isn't going to happen on this EOYT given the team selected,
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@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
I think the dynamic between Robertson and Jason Ryan changed as a result of Ryan coaching the All Blacks for two years with Foster and Schmidt and leading them to the RWC final.
At the Crusader's Robertson the undisputed king but coming into the All Blacks with no previous test experience while Ryan was already a experienced international forward coach has lead Robertson to allowing Ryan too much influence over him and the team. Players Ryan liked and had a relationship with where instantly Robertson's men (Sam Cane and TJ Perenara stand out as the most obvious) and players Ryan disliked were written off without even being given a chance by Robertson.
It appears to me that the last two years Jason Ryan has actually been the All Blacks Head Coach with Scott Robertson in the role of clown media relations man. Robertson needs to put Ryan back in his place as a forwards coach who coaches the best talent NZ rugby can produce or replace him. But this isn't going to happen on this EOYT given the team selected,
And how do you know all this?
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Ex-All Black fuels speculation of rift between Robertson's coaching staff
Ex-All Black Israel Dagg has added fuel to speculation that a fall out with assistant coach Scott Hansen is the reason that Jason Holland has departed the All Blacks
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Does Hansen speak to the players and other coaches the same way he does when interviewed? That would rub a lot of people the wrong way.
