England Vs All Blacks
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@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.
Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.
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@Bones said in England Vs All Blacks:
ALB covers zero metres, missed tackles and yellow cards. Triple threat.
Bring it on
He misses yellow cards?
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@Victor-Meldrew said in England Vs All Blacks:
@Bovidae said in England Vs All Blacks:
The Tupaea-Proctor midfield combo has played well together in the past.
England will be aiming to bully us up front (see the SA in Wellington example), so it is the forwards that will need to perform. The ABs can set the tone in the first scrum.
Our forwards are way stronger than 3 years ago and a much tougher proposition and the scrum is one of the strongest for years.
Bring it on
Whilst I don't know enough about the relative merits of the NZ pack circa 2022 and now, what I can say is that we do not have the pack that can really bully others. That has become something of a tired cliche really. Yeah we have probably two very good back rows available but we're lacking in depth at second row AND have no real enforcer, plus neither of our front rows put the fear of God into the opposition although both are more than competent.
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@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.
Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.
Sititi covers 13 as well , best distributor in open space in the team
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@kiwiinmelb said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.
Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.
Sititi covers 13 as well , best distributor in open space in the team
You certainly wouldn't see Rassie wasting a spot with the likes of ALB.
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@Mauss said in England Vs All Blacks:
@Chris-B said in England Vs All Blacks:
It would be interesting to do a detailed season-wide analysis of catching high balls to verify who is best (and worst). Not just a raw score of catches and drops - but, looking at catches in traffic and outcomes compared with expected outcomes - some sort of rational scoring system and commentary.
Unfortunately, it would probably require "someone" to watch all the games again. Maybe he (or she!) can do it next year!
That sounds like an awful lot of work for whoever you’re referring to.
Anyways, speaking of unpaid labour and the exploitation of the working class, this whole high ball-discussion reminds me of a recent Gary’s Economics-video where he’s talking about the rising housing prices. He makes the point that everyone thinks their specific city has a housing crisis while, in reality, it’s a global issue, necessitated by the growing inequality between the ultrarich and the working poor. [Just in case I happened to have piqued someone’s interest, this is the video I’m referring to: youtube.co/watch?v=BTlUyS-T-_4]
I think a similar misconception is at work in the high ball-discussion. The reality is that it’s not just the All Blacks who are experiencing a high ball-crisis. All teams are currently struggling with defensive kick receipts: Welsh fans are about ready to lynch Blair Murray, Freddie Steward shelled multiple high balls against the Wallabies on the 1st of November, Tom Wright didn’t catch a single attacking bomb against the Boks at Ellis Park, and, for the All Blacks XV, 6ft3 Chay Fihaki couldn’t deal with the England A aerials. Whether you're a tall high ball-expert or a scrumcapped Bok midget, the results will most likely be the same: you're going to drop more balls than you're going to catch.
100% on the money. Listening to Irish/Aussie/English specific podcasts and they are ALL bemoaning that their team can't deal with high ball effectively. It’s not just us. As you point out Steward bombed multiple chances in the Aussie game. I caught an interviewe by the BBC rugby podcast with him and he pointed to the escort rule having a big impact on him. He said the coaching staff are emphasising the positioning of other players around the point of the catch to pick up on the scraps, go for a turnover or kick it again to a backfield out of alignment.
With the way game is going (if in doubt - boxkick it), I think this area is getting to be one of the core elements of the game on par with scrum/breakdown etc.
We had this to a lesser degree in 2009 with the ELVs which prompted teams to want to play without the ball. Henry/Hansen realised this after the 2009 disaster and started picking fullbacks on the wing or players with decent highball skills like Dagg, Jane or Kahui.
It is a positive that they are working on it - see Jordie moving to the back to deal with the odd one but it will be tested to the nth degree with the England gameplan.
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@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
ALB is on the bench because he can cover 12 and 13 with wing at a pinch. He had that over Ioane. Should consider himself lucky.
LF going to the wing and Proctor coming in to 13 also tells you a lot about how they now feel about Sevu Reece.
Anybody could cover wing as well as Lienert-Brown and if there's (for the third time this year) an early injury to one of the wings, Jordan will probably make the shift with McKenzie at fullback. It's covering second-five and no other reason Lienert-Brown is on the bench. If the game's close and there aren't any injuries, he'll get Cortez Ratima game time. I doubt we'll see him again after this year unless there are numerous injuries. He, Ioane and Reece will be having their farewell match against Wales.
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@kiwiinmelb said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.
Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.
Sititi covers 13 as well , best distributor in open space in the team
I thought that was De Groot
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@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
ALB is on the bench because he can cover 12
So can Proctor and Leicester.
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@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@kiwiinmelb said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.
Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.
Sititi covers 13 as well , best distributor in open space in the team
You certainly wouldn't see Rassie wasting a spot with the likes of ALB.
Absolute truth.
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@JA said in England Vs All Blacks:
With the way game is going (if in doubt - boxkick it), I think this area is getting to be one of the core elements of the game on par with scrum/breakdown etc.
That’s funny that you say this because I’ve started thinking about the kick-chase as the back equivalent of the lineout. Like the lineout, you have guys who are excellent on their own ball and then you have those who excel in defensive disruption.
It’s actually quite rare – again, like the lineout – that you have players who truly excel in both attacking and defensive facets of the ‘set piece’, because the dynamics, game sense and skillset are so distinct from each other.
I also think coaches are increasingly approaching it as a form of set piece, because a lot of strike moves have incorporated the box kick as a starting premise for the strike, similar to a lineout attack.
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The issue for me with ALB ,you can hardly say he’s played his way into a starting XV not to mention his ability to pick up a card ..An average selection imo based on recent form can recall him being outplayed by Faletoi Peni during the Bunnings NPC
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Well I am pumped for this one, we win this and the grand slam is all but ours - that's no mean feat. And I am finally excited about our bench again, I am fine with Parker starting and grinding them down for 50 minutes to allow us to unleash a fresh and in form Wallace for the last 30 minutes. I think that's a very good 1 - 2 punch.
I don't really know what to expect from England, other than I expect them to be seriously determined to get the W after so many close defeats to us in the last few years. What I am hoping is they come out all guns blazing, we weather the storm, and then we finish all over them with our bench forwards wrecking havoc against tired legs.
A big point of interest is how SBarrett goes. His work in the tight is going to be crucial to weathering that initial storm. I really hope he finds form again, he has shown glimpses, and he does so much work for us in that space that it allows our ball running loosies to have a much bigger impact on the match.
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Just win. They are pricks to lose to!
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@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@kiwiinmelb said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@Landers92 said in England Vs All Blacks:
@MN5 yes, still a pinch. Just passing on the reasoning.
Yeah but they have three guys who can cover 12 in Tupea, LF and Ardie. I'd prefer Ioane there to cover centre and wing with that added dynamism that ALB lacks.
Sititi covers 13 as well , best distributor in open space in the team
You certainly wouldn't see Rassie wasting a spot with the likes of ALB.
Rassie did select Edwill Van Der Merwe though, who many knew has defensive flaws and was exposed by the Wallabies at Ellis Park….
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@No-Quarter I just hope Scooter gets through the game uninjured.
Predictions for the match
- ABs by 9 with penalty kicks being a key part of the game
- two YCs (one each team)
- Lakai to top the tackle count
- Breakdown to be a mess (this Italian ref is as much a lottery as our Georgian friend)
- Will Jordan, QT and Codie Taylor with tries
