All Blacks 2025
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@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
There are some commercial imperatives, but the top of that tree is we need to win - and win well. Suspect we need someone - hopefully Kirk - who can put the Silverlake moneymen back in their box!
If anyone in NZR knows how to deal with the silverlake types it's him.
Being at the top of the competitive tree internationally, is a commercial imperative.
That'll guarantee NZ rugby as sport, stays financially strong.
That aspect is more important to me than the nationist thing.He seems to have an almost identical CV to Wilson Whineray - which gives me hope.
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@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
One thing has become crystal clear in the last few days to me......
Razor was a massive beneficiary of being involved in a perennially successful club environment in Canterbury and the Crusaders. His coaching bona fides were inflated because of that.
If he had coached outside of Christchurch where he had had to build something from scratch or had had no cattle or tradition to work with I can only assume that his flaws would have come to the fore earlier.
The key takeaway on this for the NZR has to the that the recruitment process for an All Black head coach has to be extensive and thorough and they should be looking for a candidate with proven success in a variety of different environments. Being wildly successful in Christchurch is obviously still an achievement but replicating that elsewhere or at least showing the ability to achieve something outside of that domain would have proven Razors qualities.
Warren Gatland, then?
This is a stick that gets poked at Razor, but I'm not convinced that it fully stands up to scrutiny.
Now, there's no doubt that lots of alternative experiences are beneficial to an extent, but I'm far from convinced that coaching some international bunny team is the be all and end all for selecting an All Black coach - and sadly, for Warren, he's my exhibit A.
You couldn't get a more hyper-experienced coach than Warren - and yet, he came back to the Chiefs (presumably with an eye on the AB's position) and lost 0-8 in Super Rugby Aotearoa. How could this happen?
Exhibit B is going to be Stern Vern. Loads of international experience, had the Super rugby champions stacked with All Blacks and (as I'm led to believe
) a bunch of others who should be but for Razor's bias. They lost 9 games this year and lucky to sneak into the play-offs. Where they got beaten by Rob Penney's Crusaders (another experienced international coach who couldn't arrest a disaster last year).Then we've got Jamie Joseph. And John Kirwan. Eddie Jones.
I think it's far from conclusive.
I have some other somewhat harsh thoughts to post on Razor's season subsequently, so those who want to rush to label me an apologist can go fuck themselves.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
One thing has become crystal clear in the last few days to me......
Razor was a massive beneficiary of being involved in a perennially successful club environment in Canterbury and the Crusaders. His coaching bona fides were inflated because of that.
If he had coached outside of Christchurch where he had had to build something from scratch or had had no cattle or tradition to work with I can only assume that his flaws would have come to the fore earlier.
The key takeaway on this for the NZR has to the that the recruitment process for an All Black head coach has to be extensive and thorough and they should be looking for a candidate with proven success in a variety of different environments. Being wildly successful in Christchurch is obviously still an achievement but replicating that elsewhere or at least showing the ability to achieve something outside of that domain would have proven Razors qualities.
Warren Gatland, then?
This is a stick that gets poked at Razor, but I'm not convinced that it fully stands up to scrutiny.
Now, there's no doubt that lots of alternative experiences are beneficial to an extent, but I'm far from convinced that coaching some international bunny team is the be all and end all for selecting an All Black coach - and sadly, for Warren, he's my exhibit A.
You couldn't get a more hyper-experienced coach than Warren - and yet, he came back to the Chiefs (presumably with an eye on the AB's position) and lost 0-8 in Super Rugby Aotearoa. How could this happen?
Exhibit B is going to be Stern Vern. Loads of international experience, had the Super rugby champions stacked with All Blacks and (as I'm led to believe
) a bunch of others who should be but for Razor's bias. They lost 9 games this year and lucky to sneak into the play-offs. Where they got beaten by Rob Penney's Crusaders (another experienced international coach who couldn't arrest a disaster last year).Then we've got Jamie Joseph. And John Kirwan. Eddie Jones.
I think it's far from conclusive.
I have some other somewhat harsh thoughts to post on Razor's season subsequently, so those who want to rush to label me an apologist can go fuck themselves.
Let's have it then!
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
There are some commercial imperatives, but the top of that tree is we need to win - and win well. Suspect we need someone - hopefully Kirk - who can put the Silverlake moneymen back in their box!
If anyone in NZR knows how to deal with the silverlake types it's him.
Being at the top of the competitive tree internationally, is a commercial imperative.
That'll guarantee NZ rugby as sport, stays financially strong.
That aspect is more important to me than the nationist thing.He seems to have an almost identical CV to Wilson Whineray - which gives me hope.
Whineray never won a World Cup.
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@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2025:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
There are some commercial imperatives, but the top of that tree is we need to win - and win well. Suspect we need someone - hopefully Kirk - who can put the Silverlake moneymen back in their box!
If anyone in NZR knows how to deal with the silverlake types it's him.
Being at the top of the competitive tree internationally, is a commercial imperative.
That'll guarantee NZ rugby as sport, stays financially strong.
That aspect is more important to me than the nationist thing.He seems to have an almost identical CV to Wilson Whineray - which gives me hope.
Whineray never won a World Cup.
"almost"
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Nice to see Goldie unconvinced. And questions from the audience fueling the fire
- The team is making the same mistakes
- What will the end of year review look like, who decides if the coaches stay or go? NZR is in disarray at the moment, Kirk is there but there is no CEO
- Our defence is shit; season stats, of all our tackles this season, 5% were dominant contact (5!), 35% were ineffective contact, 60% neutral contact (FUCK ME)
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
Just watching The Breakdown. Wow someone got these guys big time. Mils especialky was toned down compared to last week. Goldie was trying to keep it real. Beaver is ever the optimist
Must have received written warnings?
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@African-Monkey said in All Blacks 2025:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
Just watching The Breakdown. Wow someone got these guys big time. Mils especialky was toned down compared to last week. Goldie was trying to keep it real. Beaver is ever the optimist
Must have received written warnings?
Goldie didn't hold back much (see above). But the outrage level wasn't as high as last week
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
Our defence is shit; season stats, of all our tackles this season, 5% were dominant contact (5!), 35% were ineffective contact, 60% neutral contact (FUCK ME)
Every segment ever of Smash Em Bro to be compulsory watching for every All Black over the summer.
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@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
Our defence is shit; season stats, of all our tackles this season, 5% were dominant contact (5!), 35% were ineffective contact, 60% neutral contact (FUCK ME)
Every segment ever of Smash Em Bro to be compulsory watching for every All Black of the summer.
A few sessions with James Fisher Harris might be in order
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:
I have some other somewhat harsh thoughts to post on Razor's season subsequently, so those who want to rush to label me an apologist can go fuck themselves.
Subsequent to what? Some of us are still awaiting this dollop of measured vitriol!
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
Reflecting on Holland, he's had an outstanding season. The kid is no frills, rolls his sleeves up and gets stuck in. We need more players like that, especially in the back row
I feel like he's got more to give too. I hope Jamie Joseph can turn him into a real bruiser because he certainly has the frame for it.
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@African-Monkey said in All Blacks 2025:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
Reflecting on Holland, he's had an outstanding season. The kid is no frills, rolls his sleeves up and gets stuck in. We need more players like that, especially in the back row
I feel like he's got more to give too. I hope Jamie Joseph can turn him into a real bruiser because he certainly has the frame for it.
I suspect Joseph is looking forward to it!
