All Blacks v Ireland II

Siam

@antipodean
Fuck imagine if an All Black did that knockdown and only a scrum resulted...

Milk

@Milk good from EOS, good analysis, rational thought. I'm giving the usually excellent journo the benefit of the doubt that he is only drawing discussion on the ref rantings that have been going on.

Well, he's certainly trying his best. I think it slipped a bit when he used the number of citing submissions as evidence of our playing style. That said, perhaps I'm being blinkered in ignoring that as evidence.

nzzp

@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:

@booboo said in Ireland II:

@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:

The good news is we have Wayne Barnes this week.

Oh good.

C'mon, you know you love his headmaster approach, mixed with a dose of conviviality ("well done Kieran, bien joué Pascal") spiced up with some schoolboy French "lâchez sept", a no interference approach to the breakdown, and his ability to find an arcane law written in small print from 1906 to pull out at a crucial moment.

I'd be happy if he learned what a forward pass was.

I'm still bemused by his call in Auckland this year. Insane.

Derm McCrum

@antipodean said in Ireland II:

@molloyjh said in Ireland II:

Ah now there are more level headed reactions in fairness:

http://www.the42.ie/analysis-ireland-missed-chances-all-blacks-3092438-Nov2016/

http://www.the42.ie/ireland-all-blacks-aviva-match-report-2016-3090747-Nov2016/

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/autumn-internationals/barrettinspired-defeat-a-missed-opportunity-for-wasteful-ireland-35231354.html

I'd also point out that there cannot be any question that NZ have a discipline issue at the moment. 12-4 was the penalty count in Chicago. 14-4 in Dublin. 3 yellow cards across both Tests to 0. 2 citings to 0. And the citing commissioner apparently referred 12 incidents in the game on Saturday back to the teams. 11 of those to NZ. While I don't like the whinging and the moaning it's pretty clear there is a discipline issue there that can't be ignored.

The Test on the weekend was a one-sided joke from the refereeing. There should have been at least one yellow card for Ireland and Aaron Smith should never have been penalised. Ireland had carte blanche at the ruck and how you get a scrum for being the last man in defence knocking a pass down is beyond baffling.

Agreed. How the fuck were Ireland not playing against 8 men for the rest of the match....?

It's beyond incomprehensible comprehension.

antipodean

@Pot-Hale said in Ireland II:

@antipodean said in Ireland II:

@molloyjh said in Ireland II:

Ah now there are more level headed reactions in fairness:

http://www.the42.ie/analysis-ireland-missed-chances-all-blacks-3092438-Nov2016/

http://www.the42.ie/ireland-all-blacks-aviva-match-report-2016-3090747-Nov2016/

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/autumn-internationals/barrettinspired-defeat-a-missed-opportunity-for-wasteful-ireland-35231354.html

I'd also point out that there cannot be any question that NZ have a discipline issue at the moment. 12-4 was the penalty count in Chicago. 14-4 in Dublin. 3 yellow cards across both Tests to 0. 2 citings to 0. And the citing commissioner apparently referred 12 incidents in the game on Saturday back to the teams. 11 of those to NZ. While I don't like the whinging and the moaning it's pretty clear there is a discipline issue there that can't be ignored.

The Test on the weekend was a one-sided joke from the refereeing. There should have been at least one yellow card for Ireland and Aaron Smith should never have been penalised. Ireland had carte blanche at the ruck and how you get a scrum for being the last man in defence knocking a pass down is beyond baffling.

Agreed. How the fuck were Ireland not playing against 8 men for the rest of the match....?

It's beyond incomprehensible comprehension.

You were your attack was so narrow...

Billy Tell

@Milk

Thanks for posting that, those 2 lads were very classy. EOS hit the nail on the head when he said watch everything with the other jersey on. It applies as much to us as the Irish I suppose, but what tends to get my goat about the Irish whinging is the large dose of hypocrisy that goes with it. We saw this with the Barrett try where the commentators did not even hint at a Sexton high tackle - if Barrett does that to Sexton as he's about to score... Now we have had a couple of very reasonable Irish posters on here recently, so I don't want to tar all and sundry with the same brush, and EOS was certainly very objective there.

jegga

@Milk said in Ireland II:

@Pot-Hale

That was pretty bad ass. Embedded:

That is awesome.

mooshld

@Kiwidom they call it icing the kicker in the NFL. Never seen a player do that before very disappointing from best.

kiwiinmelb

While our discipline has been a major talking point , Someone else posted this on facebook , thought it was interesting , So i cut and paste it for here , Penalties and yellow cards

Wales in Auckland: NZ 8 - Wales 7
Wales in Wellington: NZ 10 – Wales 6
Wales in Dunedin: NZ 10 – Wales 6 (Sam Cane yellow card)
Australia in Sydney: NZ 9 – Aussie 8 (Kieran Read yellow card)
Australia in Wellington: Aussie 15 – NZ 12
Argentina in Hamilton: Pumas 14 – NZ 9
South Africa in Christchurch: NZ 10 – Boks 8
Argentina in Buenos Aires: NZ 12 – Pumas 5 (Joe Moody, Liam Squire yellow cards)
South Africa in Durban: Boks 10 – NZ 8 (Codie Taylor yellow card)
Australia in Auckland: NZ 11 – Aussie 10
Ireland in Chicago: NZ 12 – Ireland 4 (Joe Moody yellow card)
Italy in Rome: NZ 5 – Italy 4
Ireland in Dublin: NZ 14 – Ireland 4 (Aaron Smith, Malakai Fekitoa yellow cards)
Overall Penalty Count: NZ 130 – Opposition 101
Yellow Cards: NZ 8 – Opposition 2

Bones

Something which isn't being taken into account and I'd say would have a heavy bearing on slanted stats - NZ play out the advantage a lot. And I mean a lot. Be it a penalty advantage in our half that turns into a breakaway into the oppo half, or just a penalty 5 out that more often than not gets turned into a try.

If NZ give away a penalty advantage, the opposition more often than not gets shutdown, so the penalty is awarded.

Edit: Actually, it'd be interesting to see how many of our tries this year were scored under penalty advantage.

taniwharugby

@Bones good point!

Although doesnt change the fact we are just thugs that play rugby!

Bones

@taniwharugby said in Ireland II:

@Bones good point!

Although doesnt change the fact we are just thugs that play rugby!

Not only that mate. Some of our players are fast. Reprehensible.

Nepia

@jegga He didn't actually go forward until the maul formed.

Siam

@kiwiinmelb said in Ireland II:

While our discipline has been a major talking point , Someone else posted this on facebook , thought it was interesting , So i cut and paste it for here , Penalties and yellow cards

Wales in Auckland: NZ 8 - Wales 7
Wales in Wellington: NZ 10 – Wales 6
Wales in Dunedin: NZ 10 – Wales 6 (Sam Cane yellow card)
Australia in Sydney: NZ 9 – Aussie 8 (Kieran Read yellow card)
Australia in Wellington: Aussie 15 – NZ 12
Argentina in Hamilton: Pumas 14 – NZ 9
South Africa in Christchurch: NZ 10 – Boks 8
Argentina in Buenos Aires: NZ 12 – Pumas 5 (Joe Moody, Liam Squire yellow cards)
South Africa in Durban: Boks 10 – NZ 8 (Codie Taylor yellow card)
Australia in Auckland: NZ 11 – Aussie 10
Ireland in Chicago: NZ 12 – Ireland 4 (Joe Moody yellow card)
Italy in Rome: NZ 5 – Italy 4
Ireland in Dublin: NZ 14 – Ireland 4 (Aaron Smith, Malakai Fekitoa yellow cards)
Overall Penalty Count: NZ 130 – Opposition 101
Yellow Cards: NZ 8 – Opposition 2

Wonder which game Nigel Owens officiated??

Just saying

Kiwidom

@mooshld Exactly. The decision had been made so he needed to just get on with it. Imagine if Read had of done that? We would be branded arrogant, bad sports and the crowd would have invaded the ground with lanterns and pitchforks...

jegga

@Nepia He didn't seem to want to leave the Guiness advertisement.

mooshld

@Kiwidom The thing that makes it worse is that he and his team clearly had no issue with it until they watched a replay. Umm how about not watching the replays and concentrate on how you are going to get over the try line.

If he had an issue immediately and raised it with the ref fine. But to let the crowd coerce you into asking the ref to check something is weak leadership.

da_grubster

The try where they questioned the forward pass, seemed like it was nowhere near a forward pass to me.

It actually looks like fekitoa had taken it behind tho the passer.

There wasn't another angle of it shown was there?

Funnily enough, it was in the same corner for crotty's try in 2013 where the Irish got there knickers in a twist over a legal pass.

Maybe it's just a bad camera angle down that side?

Wreck Diver

I think for our tours Nth in future we should automatically play all games with 10 men as we surely will comment 5 red card offenses each game. This should keep the precious players and fans in the Nth happy but I'm sure even this wont appease the media up here. For that to happen we should just forfeit every game and take a 12 week ban for all squad members.

da_grubster

And yes, I thought it was poor form when Best approached Peyper.

Although payper indulged him Which showed poor control.

I thought the Irish were all over peyper at the weekend, which showed in how he Reffed the game.

Lots of Irish players questioning his decisions and for the BB try, after it was given, he explained to both best and sexton that 'the tmo can see a clear grounding, we are just going to have to accept it'

Very strange words to use at the end there.

I realise going to forensic will be like the aussies earlier this year but it all adds up to a very curious refereeing performance by peyper

The Silver Fern

All Blacks v Ireland II